The Ukraine Crisis Part 1 The initial Battles

I don't understand Italy's reluctance to seize Putin's yacht, after all his billion dollar nautical palace which is currently moored off the Italian Riviera was built with cash stolen from the Russian people

 

I slight;y disagree there.with the greatest of respect. Nato has always had an open door policy and as such the emphasis is always on the democratic choice of the individual country to apply for membership .

 

Again I can see some of the other side of the coin ,with military history being an interest of mine. Russia has always mistrusted the West as we mistrust Russia . They were invaded twice by the West with Napoleons Grand Armee of 1812 and by Germany in 1941 .That said were I differ here is that only a small amount of Russia's borders are actually bordered by Nato countries compared to the none Nato countries that border albeit manly in the East .So I agree and I dont see Putins argument here also, other than as I said he mistrusts the West .

 

Still stalling and the Ukrainians still need more affective weapons like aircraft to prevent the Russians from reorganising

 

This made me chuckle today

 

But it's true... Russian tanks don't seem to have anything on Ukrainian farmers.

 

Tut, tut, tut, your historical knowledge has betrayed you matey. Russia has been invaded (in recent history) on THREE occasions. As you rightly observe by Napoleon, but you forgot the Imperial German invasion of Russian territory in 1914 - 1917.

 

Poland as was part of the Grand Armee and supplied both Infantry, cavalry and Artillery under the Duchy of Warsaw

It also depends on how far one wants to go back in History such as Polish–Muscovite War (1609–1618), Poland gained Severia and Smolensk.

Going back to Putin ,he has Stalinist ideas and wants to make Russia an Empire again . He wants to form a buffer in the west between Russia and the Nato countries like the Soviet Union had in the old cold war . Should war have broken out it would mean the Soviet Union could dirty somebody elses back yard and not its own such as the then West Germany . Soviet troops were stationed in the Warsaw Pac countries . The very elite 3rd Shock Army was stationed in East Germany and would have faced off against the British Army of the Rhine ( BAOR ) .

 

Your right but I dont tend to count that one as its because of Russia's invasion of East Prussia( Germany) on 17 August 1914 and the Austro-Hungarian province of Galicia. The German Invasion was more of a retaliation ..

Then of course the Russian Revolution soon followed

 

I cant see where Nato has been provocative with Putin . I can see where Putin is trying to bait Nato by flying drones into Nato Airspace in the hope of a response . Putin is on the back foot at the moment and some how he needs to justify the deaths of around 12000 dead Russian troops back home at sometime in the future . The best way to do that is to start another conflict nearby and then he can justify his war further .

Yes and its not going to stop there either should Ukraine fall .

I dont want to drive this thread off topic but I have placed some notes on this thread Could This Be The Start Of World War Three?. My post on the Baltics including Kaliningrad is very pertinent and along with neutral Moldova are likely to be in his sights .

The NATO meeting this Thursday with President Joe Biden may make things clearer as regards Natos change of stance if any .

 

Russia ratified START II on 14 April 2000 but withdrew from the treaty on 14 June 2002 in response to US withdrawal from the ABM Treaty.
START II - Wikipedia

So to see "both sides," one needs to look at facts and the right-wing spin on the facts, or "alternative facts," as they've been called by Kellyanne Conway. Or one can just call them lies, which is what they are.