Why cant we just leave people alone?

I definelty agree..i get real upset when people try to change my mind on things..i am an individual and i believe what i believe..and that's that..i do not mind sharing our opinons, morals, values, and beliefs w/ people..sure thats' amazing..that is what makes us all so beautiful is that we can be so different...it's truely beautiful.

for example..i am not a vegitarian..but i have many friends who are..and we love eachother regardless...i hate it when people try to push it down my throat..because i believe differently doesn't mean we can't get along...some of my friends are also democrats and some are republican..but again..we can all agree to disagree...it's wonderful ...

i think to be a mature rational person u must accept the fact that we are all different..and u should embrace that...and love it...

yes we may never all agree..but we can still get along and have tolerance for those who r different..

 

That's exactly how my mom is. When I was really settling into the hippie lifestyle and what not and mentioned something about being a hippie, she's all "No you're not!" and of course nothing was gonna change my mind. I was a hippie and that was that. You accept me that way or you don't. I don't care. Now I think she's more accepting of who I've chosen to become, but just as long as I don't take it to the 'extreme'. I wear a peace necklace everyday and she sees it but doesn't say anything about it, so maybe she's coming around. Now all I have to do is get her to become more accepting of other things. She's practically against anything you can think of. She doesn't like guys growing their hair out, wearing their hat backwards, having their boxers showing a little and what not, etc. All that stuff I'm groovy with. I don't mind it at all. We we're in the restaurant the other night and my former friend saw us and said hi and then later asked if he could have our phone number. When he left to get a paper and pen my mom told me to give him the wrong number. I hated it. When he came back, I looked at my mom and she gave me a look that meant 'don't do it....' and so I wrote down an inverted version of my cell phone number (much to my dismay) and gave it to him feeling mad and guilty. I saw that he had turned punk over the years and had his left ear pierced and stuff, and my mom had to voice her opinion on him when he left saying he didn't need a moustache (he was getting one on him) saying he was too young to be doing stuff like that. He's prolly 14 or 15 by now, and I told my mom how there was another boy in my class that last year had facial hair as well, also saying that they're guys and their horomones are different and to accept that and move on. Some people never change....

 

Yeah, I understand where your coming from, and I don't find much to disagree with in the principal of your argument, although I do wonder about the light of the universe in the eyes of the dear that just got shot, however I am not in any postion to complain, I eat meat, not very much these days but I do eat it. I have also seen many hundreds or possibly thousands of animals killed in an abbatoir, and I hate to say I think it's one of the most inhuman ways of killing. The death might be fairly quick for most anmals but the lead up to it is slow and the fear in the eyes on the animals is all far too knowing.

Bit of a tangent there maybe, but there you go.

 

Gosh, I love it. Thats the way I live, my friend. This world is so cool being diverse! We are all humans and we should love each other because we are all put on this earth to face the same challenges every day. We all have this nature to say yes or no, or to resist or accept certain things. People are all different and they all conform to one thing or another. Why? Because its easy. I love it, I love people, I love their personalities, I love the things we all share in each other. We are all trying and fail. But most of us make it.

 

Sounds kinda crazy, doesn't it? Nevertheless, that is precisely what is required to embrace the reality of peace. But then again, if you want to control the crapola out of them, hey...why not? That's as good a hobby as any. No worse to control them than to control yourself...but then, in the end, neither have value. Peace is the literal substance that makes up your being, like faithful unwavering core stuff that cannot be harmed by murderers.

Rather than worry about which cause to jump on or which group to control next...

Rather than spending efforts in fear about what is going to be your lot eventually anyway...

Dip into that substance you're made of...dip until it washes over, around and through you, and makes you see beyond the gap that seems so violent. Just straight out know yourself...be selfish about it...make sure YOU are number one in your life. If you don't, you won't have much to offer anyone else. Knowing yourself can be the biggest blast of all, for it frees you to rise above all that stuff out there by reaching toward all that you are...infinitely, omnipresently, and thus, being all...quite peacably.

 

Eventually, each one makes the discovery, that it is entirely impossible to change people. Sure, you can work a deal and watch their behavior change...but people are not their behavior. Any behavior that is arising from something in their bag, is just going to resurface when it gets suppressed or repressed...even when it seems a desirable change to the person believed to be changing themselves.

Just be real with yourself about yourself...and as you understand yourself more, you will automatically be more real with others...and "that" will assist them in opening their mind to the rest of their own self. Then, although they won't change per se, they will approach themselves and their world in a new way that agrees with their true self-knowledge. They could never change, because they're already perfect as is...but simply do not believe that because they have lost sight of themselves.

Odd thing that we are taught to not be self-centered, using all kinds of ploys. We call anyone selfish that isn't giving it all away. We're taught that Mom and Dad's rules are more important than we are. Then we learn the rules of our religion are more important than we are. Then we learn that the rules of society are more important than we are. Then we learn that basically everyone else on the planet is more important than we are...and we "should" live a life of service to them, to God, to our parents, to our spouse...ad nauseum. Finally, somewhere, some way, somehow...each one will and absolutely "must" find themselves and thus bring their world into a proper perspective.

 

that bike reminds me of Pee-wee's bike...*beep beep*

 

Hehe. Yeah, sorry about the dead deer thing. Just wanted to piss off some vegi-nazis that were pissed off enough to give me some bad rep anyway.

I understand that we have differences that others find it hard to accept. I have a hard time with a lot of things I see in the world and Im not even going to try to explain my views on war because half of you wouldnt understand and another 25% wouldnt believe me anyway. Im not talking about myself anyway. I could care less who disagrees with me and I give less than a cold turd who likes me or not.

But you wont see me trying to tell someone else that the lifestyle they have chosen is wrong and that they should believe what I do and live like I do. Even before I joined the military (when I was more of a hippie than some of you could ever hope to be) I never tried to tell someone else they were wrong for the way they were living.

I see a lot of people here trying to make people ashamed or guilty and I think that just blows.

 

I couldn't agree MORE, U.S.!

 

Someone characterized in one book the hippie movement in the 60s and 70s that there was this tendency of trying to convert as many as possible to be part of the movement, accept some common values, change the world. Probably there's some truth there. In these forums too I've noticed something similar. There is some talk of the second coming of the hippies, of revolution, of leaving Babylon and of course the talks about vegeterianism, war, drugs... and talks wether it's good to label people and oneselves as hippies etc. then there is this topic of tolerance, freedom and converting or moralizing. There are some who don't moralize or try to convert. Then there are the ones who do this and now the ones who say this is something that ought not be done.
For me it is not easy to say where exactly is the line between converting and discussion, expressing one's opinions. and what about advicing. or trying together to govern this world into a safe haven. We have to share the world together. What future is like depends on each of us. Everyone suffers when when the governors are blind, without a map, don't know who they are, where they come from.. That's why it's good to speak up.
Here is also different levels here. The level of how to dress, wether to get piercings or not, what music to listen to. Level of who to hang out with. Level of war, killing animals, abortion, politics.. etc.
Is there then any truth or right moral principles or actions better than others? I don't think this can be really answered objectively. But subjectively, to me there is not really a question. Some choises appear much better than others. There are bad things which I don't want anyone to have to face. And I really believe some things are valuable.
What is the problem with one person starting to dictate others about how to behave, what is right, what is wrong? One thing is that when people have strong different opinions, who is to decide who is right. Who has the truth? The mother who tells the daughter not to be a hippie probably wants to protect the child, although doesn't understand what the hippie thing means and doesn't know her child. Or maybe she understands exactly what the hippie thing means, or knows the child well enough and knows it's bad for the child. This is all to be taken hypothetically now. Who wouldn't try to protect a child. I think many agree that up to some point it is right for the parents to tell the children what is good or bad for him/her. But then the parents don't know it themselves exactly as is mostly the case.
Also if one's friend is about to do something stupid, a friend advices not to. Or if someone is standing on a bridge, going to jump... you get the picture.
Anyway, whatever you do there probably is some religious sect to say it's wrong. The kind of religious sects that say they own the truth and only through them you can be saved. and they think they themselves will be saved if they convert as many people as possible. And I think it's very disturbing to meet these people. Mostly they are very lost themselves and they cannot hear anything you tell them because their religion tells them to build a strong shield against all the bads of the world and they take your words as misleading and because of that bad. This kind of sects can be found in many religions, without pointing fingers especially on anyone.
But if someone thinks to know the truth or the right from wrong, or a small piece of it, it's natural to want to tell people about it and help others. I think there is a place for discussion. Discussion is good. Together we can learn more. Somethings through discussion, some through meditation.
And then there are these special cases when some people need help making decisions: badly disturbed individuals(violent), small children, handicapped..
But it's part of today's western culture this individualism. We want to decide everything by ourselves. Maybe it's universal, I don't know. Everyone wants to choose what they think, what they believe in, their religion, philosophy. Noone can be forced to believe. Everyone is entitled to this respect. Everyone needs to be respected as a free individual, growing as they will, making roots whereever it is their place.
But still there is a place for discussion. And there is also good kind of converting and people should speak according to their opinion when the time demands it. Love creates love. Respect creates respect. Inspiration gives strength. And a good example really works powerfully. I think in our culture the induviduality is so highlighted that people learn to be very proud and that's why they cannot listen to other people. And because of this pride they will not learn many things. Some people are open and ready to learn and maybe wait to meet good people with/from whom to learn. It's not about who is better, who is worse. We all have needs. We need to find a way. We need the respect. and love. we need to know ourselves, understand somethings.
..we got to get ourselves back to the garden..

 

I always meditate upon this topic, weather to be moral or passive.
Moral hopes to better the world
Passive accpets the world.
If your gonna be moral you have to speak for morality
If your gonna be passive you agree with everything everyone say even if you dont agree with it.
It seems passive is more peacefull to everyone.
And Moral creates arguments

 

i thought hippies were known for leading by example....

 

Thats what it comes down to Lovemix, just being yourself. But then do you also speak for what you believe even though it may be in disagreement.

 

thats where i contradict myself. im a very oppinionated person and i love to voice my oppinions, even though most dont agree with them. but for the most part, if i know that there is no way ppl are even gonna listen to me then ill stay silent and not waste my breathe. i try to lead by example but sometimes people need a hint. meh...

 

USNavyDeadhead, a couple months back you sent me a PM saying "...you're a pussy if you don't joint the military." Ease up on the hypocrisy there, cowboy.

 

lol


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Even today many educated people think that the victory of Christianity over Greek philosophy is a proof of the superior truth of the former - although in this case it was only the coarser and more violent that conquered the more spiritual and delicate. So far as superior truth is concerned, it is enough to observe that the awakening sciences have allied themselves point by point with the philosophy of Epicurus, but point by point rejected Christianity.

Friedrich Nietzsche... thanks for your quote, it reminded me someone recommended me to read up on him!

 

...but we need people jointing the mikitary...

 

So you're bisexual? Just kidding

I am not aware of what makes people want "change", but you shouldn't change or do something to be different. You should do something your own way, and if it happens to be different so be it.

 

go post on a redneck forum if you don't want feedback.They'll accept you with open arms.I'm not a hippie,never hoped to be.I've always only been an observer.Like some said there's common values that tie people together into the class we call hippies.You can't be both military and hippie.The values are different.You may have acted like a hippie once,but if anything that only makes you more hypicritical.

 

OK I'm going to take a leap here, knowing what I say will be blasted. But here goes.
Why would someone want to be in a place that they did not agree with. If your not a Hippie or shared similar beliefs why would you want to hang out. Unless you just wanted a place to blow off hot air and harrass others and their values/beliefs.
Gate you were just at the, Where's the Beef thread to cause trouble. Coming in and saying, There are no OLD Hippies. What are you thinking. Do you mean to wipe out the 60's and what transpired there. Just because you weren't there you think it didn't happen and you try to erase it. No Way. It happen, we were there, we are still here and we are The OLD HIPPIES. Nothing you can say or do will take that away from us. Some us of still carry scars from it, be it physical or mental.
Are you so EGO ridden that you can't except yourself.Your higher self where the LOVE LOVE LOVE dwells. Are we a threat to you? what can you possibaly gain out of saying we don't exsist. Here we are. We all have our lessons to learn Gate as you do. Open your mind up and see the reality of which you speak, before you speak.