White non-muslim women wearing the Hijab?

hitler was a man of great morals ask any nazi.

you can get qoutes praising both hitler and stalin if you look for them both men had very low moral standards .
slavery wasnt restricted by the coming of mohammed think about all the people this monster made slaves and his men raped .

and surely even if slavery was about at the time of mohammed he could have made a stand against it and said no making people slaves he didnt in fact he did the oppersite .

if it wasnt for the west in the last century the muslim world would still have slavery, thats how mohammeds example effected things, I mean look at saudi where slavery most likely still goes on and was only outlawed in the 1970s .

would you be happy marrying off your daughter of six to a 54? year old man, can a six year old consent, do they know whats happening.
The haddith seems to say that aisha didnt that she was out playing with dolls and then married to this old for her man .

she didnt get the chance to have another husband when he died when she was 18 because mohammed made it a rule that his wives were not allowed to remarry ....is this really the best that god can do marry off a little child to a old man and then cause her to spend the rest of her life alone

 

http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/AyeshaAhmed50405.htm

interesting article on mohammeds moral character

 

Why do you bother arguing with him? He's being a dick. Why waste your time arguing with someone who knows nothing about your religion, and is just sitting behind the moniter starting shit because he has nothing better to do with his time?

 

Actually he didn't start shit he have very good arguments and reasons to slam the facts into their face.
But YOU start shit since you obviously have no clue what he's talking about and did an ad hominem attack.
Your bitchy attitude was unnescessary.

 

Cab I’ve just told you that I could find non Nazis at the time of Hitler who said what a great man Hitler is and what a great job he’s doing in Germany.

One of the things you’re doing is not thinking about the faults that I’m pointing out in Mohammed’s actions because some fool who in many cases doesn’t know much about Islam said that Mohammed was a great guy.



Lets say Michael Jackson said what a wonderful moral man Mohammed was, would that prove that Mohammed was moral, wouldn’t it be better to examine what Mohammed actually did



If his actions were best practice you could defend them without the help of George Bernard Shaw



If I write or say that Mohammed was a paedophile, rapist, mass murderer, who enjoyed torturing people, all of which I have shown that he was using Islamic scripture.

and I do it openly even in the west I’m likely to be killed by members of your religion so no wonder you only get a false positive view of Mohammed’s morality .



Slavery

if you have a thief and he occasionally gives back the thing he stole, does that make that person moral or not a thief , so to if you have a man who makes thousands of people into slaves and sets up a system of slavery who occasionally frees a slave does that make him moral or not a slaver .



I’m saying why would god chose a man who made people into slaves as is prophet ,all you can come back with is that he occasionally let people go , well he shouldn’t have made them into slaves in the first place



Your haddith is nice but you have to remember that it comes from a book written by Muslims to encourage other people to become Muslims.



If you read mein kampf or the writings of other Nazis, you will find that Hitler is this really honest wonderful guy whose kind to animals.

But you would need to remember when reading Nazi writings that the people writing are Nazis and have a bias in favour of Nazism .



That’s how you should view Islamic scripture as something that’s written with a bias in favour of Islam and Mohammed





Zaid ibn Harith



Father! Who does not love his parents? My heart is full of love for you and mother. But I love this man Muhammad so much that I cannot think of living elsewhere than with him. I have met you and I am glad.. But separation from Muhammad I cannot endure." Zaid's father and his uncle did their utmost to persuade Zaid to return home with them but Zaid did not agree. Upon this the Holy Prophet said, "Zaid was a freed man already, but from today he will be my son." Seeing this affection between Zaid and the Prophet, Zaid's father and uncle went back and Zaid remained with the Prophet (Hisham).



This seems pretty sinister



stockholm syndrome describes the behavior of kidnap victims who, over time become sympathetic to their captors. The name derives from a 1973 hostage incident in Stockholm, Sweden. At the end of six days of captivity in a bank, several kidnap victims actually resisted rescue attempts, and afterwards refused to testify against their captors.



The most famous incident in the U.S. involved the kidnapped heiress . patty hirst Captured by a radical political group known as the symbionese liberation army in 1974, Ms. Hearst eventually became an accomplice of the group, taking on an assumed name and assisting them in several bank robberies. After her re-capture, she denounced the group and her involvement.



What causes Stockholm syndrome? Captives begin to identify with their captors initially as a defensive mechanism, out of fear of violence. Small acts of kindness by the captor are magnified, since finding perspective in a hostage situation is by definition impossible. Rescue attempts are also seen as a threat, since it's likely the captive would be injured during such attempts.

It's important to note that these symptoms occur under tremendous emotional and often physical duress. The behavior is considered a common survival strategy for victims of interpersonal abuse, and has been observed in battered spouses, abused children, prisoners of war, and concentration camp survivors



The Stockholm incident compelled journalists and social scientists to research whether the emotional bonding between captors and captives was a "freak" incident or a common occurrence in oppressive situations. They discovered that it's such a common phenomenon that it deserves a name. Thus the label, Stockholm Syndrome, was born. It has happened to concentration camp prisoners, cult members, civilians in Chinese Communist prisons, pimp-procured prostitutes, incest victims, physically and/or emotionally abused children, battered women, prisoners of war, victims of hijackings, and of course, hostages. Virtually anyone can get Stockholm Syndrome it the following conditions are met:

• Perceived threat to survival and the belief that one's captor is willing to act on that threat
• The captive's perception of small kindnesses from the captor within a context of terror
• Isolation from perspectives other than those of the captor
• Perceived inability to escape.

Imagine you are this boy you’ve been kept as a slave by this man who you have seen murder lots of people, a cult leader who has convinced other people to kill and enslave people.

Wouldn’t this be a wonderful situation for a case of Stockholm syndrome .

How dare I come here having a filthy attitude to a old man having sex with a six year old …….gosh that’s bad of me isn’t it .



Im amazed that you believe its natural or best practice for this sort of thing to happen or that it wasn’t rape

How could aisha give a informed consent at that age



And if it’s nothing to be ashamed of why aren’t Muslims more open that they like the idea of sex with children.


”she didn’t get the chance to have another husband when he died “
”This shows how much she loved him,”



how does it show that, if it was one of his commands that his wives were not to remarry I would imagine it would be quite dangerous for her to do so

 

Michael Jackson is muslim???

 

How arrogant of you to "call" everyone else besides your self, ignorant, so the writers of the Encyclopedia of Brittanica and people like Ghandi and Lamartine are fools and big fat liars?

How many times do I have to repeat this.

Slavery existed prior to the prophets(peace and blessing of Allah be upon him) time, he restricted and modified it. He gave them rights they didnt have before and he restricted it so it could only come from one source, from CAPTIVES OF WAR and not because of skin color (like another nation liked to do, hmm what was the name of that nation? ^^)
He encourged them to treat them well and he even ordered them on many different occiasions to release them and he forbidded them to hit them brutaliy or in the face!
He said that they were their brothers and in the quran we find and important message:
And if any of your slaves ask for a deed in writing (to enable them to earn their freedom for a certain sum), give them such a deed if ye know any good in them: yea, give them something yourselves out of the means which Allah has given to you.


About the stockholm syndrom, you are assuming that he kidnapped this boy but please Johnny find me one hadith which shows that he did this. All I can find is that this boy was kidnapped by some people then sent around many different places-and then finally sold to the prophet(peace and blessing of Allah be upon him) who then took care of him, enough to make this boy chose his him before his own father. This is because of goodness from this man and not somehing else. Why would people storm into his religion if he indeed was so horrible, how could he start such a gigantic wave of convertion through out his country and the world.

Stop imagining, the prophet (peace and blessing of Allah be upon him) did not force his wives to stay married with them. He acually asked them if they wanted to leave him or not as he was commanded in the quran:
O Prophet! say to your wives: If you desire this world's life and its adornment, then come, I will give you a provision and allow you to depart a goodly departing[Quran Ahzab -interpretation of the meaning]


You seem to accept Aishas testimony about her age, do you then accept her words; It is reported in a hadith: Sa`d ibn Hisham said that he asked `A’ishah (may Allah be pleased with her), “Tell me about the character of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him). She said, “His character was the Qur’an”

 

He's a Jehovah's Witness I once heard.

 

Actually the rule that women should cover their heads is in the new testament aswell, its the reason why nuns do so:

Romans 7:2

"For if a woman will not veil herself, she should cut off her hair; but if it disgraceful for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her wear a veil"

 

Johnny2mad should have banned for his rudeness...

 

what Im saying isnt hardly rude at all, I have friends who are ex muslims who are far ruder than me about mohammed .

and I dont make up stuff about him if the historical record says he raped people and had sex with children and made people slaves thats what he did .

I can understand if your a muslim how you may not like these things being brought up, I used to believe in prophets to so I understand your point of view , but I think your being fooled as I was and so I think it best I point it out .

 

If you consider what you are saying to be "not rude" then you understand less about Islam than I previously put you down for. You a little boy with a little gun that wants to make a big bang, Johnny-halfwit.

You have taken a fact of truth and warped it to your own perspective, why dont you give others the chance to work things out for themselves, you seem to be the only fanatic around here.

I am sorry for you that you cant take part reasonably in a reasonable debate. Do everyone a favour and go and find the love of a good woman...or man, whatever you're into.

 

Yes, exactly. My grandmother did have to wear something over her head when she was young.

 

Yes you can wear it. Hijab simply means practicing modesty. It's just a scarf on your head. No biggie.

 

By veil they may simply mean cloak or something. Dress. If Shakespeare's english doesn't often mean what it looks like to most people, how can something that is thousands of years old be taken literally? What veil means today may not literally mean what it does today. I just think it's all very ambiguous and relative...

 

zaffydoo you have the concept of right hand possession where muslims could rape female captives.

you have mohammed having sex and marrying a 8 year old

you have him making people into slaves and and torturing people how have I warped the historical record .

I suppose its hard to defend his behavior thats why muslims get so violent to people who point out what a very nasty man he was but that doesnt change the facts of his life and actions .

and Im giving people the chance to hear both sides of the story you can tell them what a wonderful man mohammed was.

I will tell them that he married a 8 year old, then it will be up to them to judge whether they want to follow a man who was sexually attracted to children .

you can tell them how mercyful allah and mohammed are

I will tell them about mohammed having peoples eyes put out and their hands and feet cut off and watching them crawl about a desert till they died or people being cruicified which is a punishment in islam .

 

Another enlightening statement by our very own junior Pat Robertson...

 

thank you ewok if there is any detail in my post that you wish for me to explain using the historical evidence I can do so.

if you track back over my posts you will see that I have provided sahih (authentic) haddiths that mohammed was a pedophile for example , enjoyed torturing people was a slaver ect ect .

sahih haddith are the top source of islamic history without them muslims wouldnt have the sunnah or the path to show them how to do things like pray ect ect

Ive read the bible about 34 times can recite lots of it from memory, and can put a good case that thats false too, so I dont think as a atheist I would be that popular with pat robinson senior