Yes, as far as the traveler is concerned, he would have only aged a year, BUT, back on earth a thousand years could have passed. Did you watch that video above? Explains it better than I can.
^^that's the part i don't buy or understand. just because he's moving super fast doesn't mean his physical body would stop aging. i'll watch the video, but i'm not very hopeful that it'll convince me. wait...i guess it depends on where the time is being kept. i suppose if it was the time in the ship that was flying at the speed of light...an hour on that, maybe WOULD equal 1000 years on earth. but i maintain that in that case, dude would die within the first spaceship month and about 900 more earth years would pass during the last 11 months okay, after watching the video, it seems that he would live the 1000 years, but his thoughts and EVERYTHING would be slowed down so that he only experiences it as lasting for one year. and if then he could return to the earth...1000 years would have passed...?!?!?! sure...
His body is aging regularly, jut irregularly in relation to planet earth. I would buy it, doesn't mean it's possible to move that fast. Perhaps there is actually a 'speed of time' and when you move fast enough you begin to 'catch up'?
Not sure what there is to convince you of, pork, it's a proven phenomena and has been tested here on Earth as well as during space flights. The differences are miniscule in those tests, but it still proves the theory. It has been shown true with mathematical proofs (Einstein) and in actual observations.
just because sub atomic particles exhibit this effect doesn't mean that an entire body would i wasn't necessarily trying to say "it's not true" just that i can't wrap my head around it, therefore i can't really believe it. try to explain it to me again...how can the dude fly at light speed for one hour (spaceship time?) and then come back to earth and 1000 years have passed? and his body is just fine and he can get out and walk around in the future?? you really think that? i'm not dismissing it, just trying to actually grasp it. the video said that on the ship, time would pass more slowly than it did at mission control. so it ends up traveling like half the distance in half the observed time.....so it equals out in 4 dimensions. but did it even say anything about his aging?? it said that his breathing and pulse would be half as fast, and his thoughts would be half as fast, but it would SEEM like real time since everything he can see is slowed down. so it seems the same to him, even though he's really maybe aging half as fast...ok maybe i'm getting it a little bit. *thinking....* maybe i do kinda get it, but it's just so fucking crazy!! my physics teacher said something about this in 11th grade...2002. i stopped the class and tried to get it. we had to move on. i was high. it blew my mind. still am. still does i just tried to pretend that right now, i'm in that situation. everything is hurdling through space on earth. and my body is aging slower than it would if i wasn't speeding. so maybe that means if i was just floating in space, not moving AT ALL, then i would move maximally through time and age fastest?
I don't believe that a body can really withstand such forces to be moving that fast. I don't know if it is possible to not move, because we are talking about time in relation to other objects (Earth) in space, and if you stopped they would still be moving in relation to you. If everything 'stopped' perhaps time would be different, but I think that since the speed at which we are moving through space is nowhere near the speed of light, in fact a small fraction, effects might not be noticeable if that makes sense.
I think maybe one reason you guys are having a hard time with this is because you are looking at time as a constant in the universe, it's not, as demonstrated in the simple experiments mentioned in this article that Voyage linked to; http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2010-09/superaccurate-clocks-prove-your-head-older-your-feet Time is relative to the speed of the traveler/observer and is also effected by gravity. Light is also effected by gravitational fields and can be bent and slowed by them. If you can wrap your head around the fact that time is not an universal constant, then all this becomes easier to grasp, although on first appearance it presents as a paradox.
i understand that time is not a universal constant. you aren't answering my questions, noxious. i'm really interested...do you ACTUALLY believe that stuff i asked above? that the guy would get out and aged a year while the earth has aged 1000 years (let's imagine that he CAN withstand a year at lightspeed) i guess my real problem is understanding what TIME is. i've always thought of normal clock time as an illusion (it sort of is, since it's different throughout the universe or under different conditions of speed and mass), and that time is just the passage of events. i really can't fully grasp that time can actually speed up or slow down and have an effect on the physical world. again, i'm not dismissing it, just admitting that i don't really get it. do you REALLY get it??
In an intuitive way, yes, I get it and it is perfectly sensible. All the math and tests have shown it to be true. How about the differences in the time kept by clocks in orbit exhibiting less time passing then here on Earth? Again that is something that has been tested many times and every time holds true. Isn't that the main criteria for scientific proof, it's reproducible and gives consistent results. You do know that they have to make adjustments on satellites to account for the difference in the passage of time between a satellite in orbit and Earth. It may be miniscule, but it does have an accumulative effect. Also a passenger in a vessel traveling at light speed would not be adversely affected by the ship's velocity. When you take a plane trip, other than the initial inertia felt at take off, you don't notice or "feel" the velocity the plane is moving at, do you? Then let's add in conditions in a vacuum such as space. I'm not a physicist, but this type of stuff has always "made sense" to me.
Everything happens at once, everywhere, that is, everything happens now, or it is not happening. Growth is concentric, not linear. The past and the future are both artifacts of current emergence. They, past and future, do not exist as entities separate from now. Memory is living tissue as is the projection of "future", based on memory.
I dig where you're coming from PS, there's a difference between understanding what you read, and wrapping your head around it. Understanding it inside. It took me a long time to grasp the concept and I barely have scratched the surface of these ideas. But your last sentence, no. His body isn't a year older. What NO was saying about proven is correct. Highly accurate clocks have been used to prove the math behind the concept and have given 100% accurate results that the math predicts. I might have to read over this thread to see if I can help with an "ah ha" moment, that's what it takes for me to grasp stuff like this. But in the mean time, try these ideas. Light is an absolute. Forget the idea of faster than light. Try to grasp the idea that light is always 300,000 k per second. To all observers all the time. This is the hard idea to understand but it too has been proven. No matter how fast you travel in relation to anything else, light is still moving at 300,000 kilometers per second in relation to YOU. It is a universal constant. Velocity has two components. Distance over time. If you are traveling at 100,000 k per second and you observe light passing you at 300,000 k per second, in order for that to happen time must pass slower FOR you. If you left earth on Jan 1st and traveled at that speed for a year and returned next Jan 1st, a year would have passed on earth. But you will not have aged one year. Time, for YOU would have been less. For those that stayed here, one year would have passed. I should have read the rest of the thread before writing this. I think I really get it, but it took a long time to get there. And ya I believe it. The sad/amazing thing is this is a basic idea in physics. The shit these guys are doing with math at the cutting edge these days is beyond comprehension. Some of them even say as much themselves. This cat Leonard Susskind (one of the people behind string theory) developed a theory and the math behind it to explain why the blackhole phenomenon of Stephan Hawking's day couldn't be accurate because it violated the principle of the law of conservation of information. That if something is sucked into a black hole, all "information" contained in that is gone and lost forever. The math he did lead to the theory that everything we call existence is merely a projected hologram. Math led to that idea. Smoke on that awhile.
thanks to the old timers for trying to help me. but i've taken physics courses. i understand most of what is being discussed, and i've at least heard a little bit about the experiments with clocks, etc. but that is just a stupid fucking clock!! just because the time keeper is showing a different amount of time passing, doesn't equate to a human being's aging actually slowing down (in my mind at least). i guess i need to understand that these were the most accurate clocks possible, so if we believe that the clock is right, then time itself must have actually slowed, so it's theorized that time slowing would slow aging as well. THAT is the part i don't really buy. tell me once they do this with a mouse or something taking off and accelerating to a few hundred miles per hour is a bit different than accelerating to LIGHT SPEED. that might be enough to kill someone. i guess if i can't understand it, i can just say "fuck it, i am never probably gonna get the chance to travel at light speed, so i don't really need to worry about it" i'm not fond of that type of thinking though, where does that get you?
Ok, I see what you're getting at. You're saying you dont get if slower passing of time is the same as slowing of biological processes. I can't recall reading what the conscensous on that is. I know they say the apollo guys aged just a little less than us. But we can't measure that like we can time with an atomic clock. Ya, they need to shoot a mouse out there and back. I agree. Two other observations... Nox example is a poor one, I agree. We don't feel like we're traveling at Mach .85 in an airplane primarily because our senses relate to the surroundings, the cabin feels like sitting in a chair in a room. You only feel the motion when they speed or slow. But also, accelerating to high speed wont kill you due to speed. All that is required is to keep accelerating. You don't live because an airplane only goes 5 or 600 mph. Or mach 2. If you kept accelerating at the rate of an airliner taking off, for hours instead of a couple minutes, in no time you'd be hauling serious ass. It's G forces that can kill. 32ft/sec/sec is one G, you recall from physics. 3 or 4 g's or so isn't uncomfortable, keep up that rate for a few hours and bingo. But of course, as NO pointed out, energy input to sustain that acceleration becomes astronomical pretty quick. I'd like to find out more about the biological process thing too. I found this. http://www.phys.unsw.edu.au/einsteinlight/jw/module4_time_dilation.htm Just to bring this back round to psychedelics... There's a new-ish idea to explain why time seems slow when we're young, and faster when we age. The idea is that when we're young, everything is new, unfamiliar, unique or uncommon. The everyday is more unpredictable than after we've "been there done that". As we become familiar with our environment, novelty becomes rare and our perception of time speeds up. I think this is a big part of time dialation while tripping. It jives well with people reporting feeling like a child again, the environment seemingly filled with wonder. It is so intensely unique, such a vastly different perspective from what we're accustomed to, that our sense of the passing of time changes. LSD is particularly good at this. Just my little theory anyways.
Got a kick out of this from the link above... FAQ. How is the 1961 EK Holden capable of relativistic speeds? This has never been satisfactorily explained. Zoe's car has neither speed stripes nor spoiler, so that can't be the answer. However, as the fins on this model serve no other purpose, we speculate that they may be involved.
i've commented on this a few times on this forum. i said it a little differently though. when you're a baby, one day is a significant fraction of your life. say you're two weeks old, a day is 7% of your whole life! but once you're older, a day is less significant...i think that's why time SEEMS to go by faster and faster as we age. a day flies by when it's only a fractional percentage of your whole life. but when it's still a good chunk of your total time here...it seems to take a long time. boredom kinda clashes with our ideas though. time seems slow when you're bored...even if you're old or even if it's not new and novel like you said. so i can't come up with an explanation why time flies when you're having fun (unless you're tripping haha) i'll have to check out that link later
Through the Wormhole episode on time; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbFoSR44ImY&feature=related"]Through the Wormhole Does Time Really Exist (BG SUB) - YouTube
