Students Battle Police in UK! Prince Charles and Camilla Attacked!

...or they return to the exact same place they started from.

 

very true.

 

maybe the word cyclic isn't quite the right word... spiral would be more appropriate... now it may appear that it goes back to the same place, but infact it is a different place... moved on a rung

your post seems very defeatist IB... the State in a Democracy is supposed to represent the people... at present, this is not a real Democracy as the people are infact ruled by a few huge Corporations... we all know that Corporations exist to make profit, which benefits the few and not the whole...

by saying that the State will always win, you are acknowledging that is is an Us and Them scenario.... this is not true Democracy... it is interesting to note the etymology of the word Democracy: ORIGIN late 16th cent.: from French démocratie, via late Latin from Greek dēmokratia, from dēmos ‘the people’ + -kratia ‘power, rule.’

at the moment this seems to translate into ruling the people, whereas we are led to believe that it is the people ruling themselves? what a big fat lie that is!

with the current laws, which protect Corporations, freeing them from any responsibilities to their environments, giving them the go-ahead to make profit, whatever the cost to the peoples, i would not call this a real Democracy as championed in our society...

there will always be pros and cons to every situation/form of power structure.... but the least we can do is try to make it right... i can't be alone in being prepared to die for this cause... ofcourse i'd rather not, but i am certainly not prepared to take this crap any longer... at present we are all slaves to this monster called profit... time for change... even if it means turning everything on it's head... change is healthy and very necessary, now more than at any time...

REVOLUTION is here and it is growing in the hearts and minds of ordinary people everywhere...!!!

 

Fair enough. I was being pessimistic.
I think since mass literacy people have gathered more information about their world.
I think todays youth are more inclined to form their own opinions regardless of facts or if they can make a fair assessment of the situation.
They are as biased and prone to distrust those above them as they ever were.
That goes for everybody not just the youth of today, to be fair.
I personally think the spur might change but the reaction is exactly the same.
The results might vary.
Basically there isn't anything new to revolt against and there isn't anything new in response.

 

Interesting stuff, will respond properly when I get home.

I will agree my post seems defeatist, I just don't see how society can ever arguably contest what they want if everybody's idea of 'ideal' is completely different. Democracy is a term that has lost all meaning, if it ever had any, but one thing is sure

democracy should protect you from anarchism, at the moment it just seems to be causing it.

And I am identifying an us versus them idea, but it's not unlike anybody else here. I don't believe, from my own opinion, governments do things in the best nature of its people. The student fees however, wouldn't even be considered had it not been for such a large deficit, it's to extremist

whoever caused this problem, they are the real culprits. It's arguably America's fault

 

Discussing democracy in a thread about "royal's" being attacked...

I will totally agree that democracy has lost its meaning...

I'm with Odon in his pessimism... I've said it numerous times (and likely will many more). The reason we have the world we do, is because of what people allow to happen.

What is more democratic then that?

Even if Charles and Camilla being put into that position was part of a conspiracy by those that are in power... what was its purpose? To add noise to a situation they would rather not be front and center... In order to distract the majority of people, because if they all focuses on one thing, they could make changes... And most people jumped on the bandwagon... again... what is more democratic then that?

Did it succeed?

We're up to 25 pages so far....

 

I think we should remember the purpose of the protest.
The students have not won. They lost.
They will no longer be able to apply for EMA.
The government states that 90% of students will continue their studies anyway.
Students will still be able to apply for a maintenance grant.
So, what has changed?

 

That's exactly right, though the problem is it's always been this way. One cave man, I expect, probably did bop another other the head with his club and tell him where to shove his standards.

It's sad, but all that the protests will do, I believe, is get a few kids arrested and have their careers ruined- and people will comply and pay them begrudgingly.

For example, I hate the idea of it, but rather fight it I have decided to willingly give away my money because of the risk they could put on my degree. It's just the way it's always been, they have everyone by the balls in some way or another.

 

like i said... defeatist... there was a time when people did have a say... it meant coming out in force... we have the internet now, so violence will be a thing of the past... there is plenty of support for change on the internet... i think your point is moot...

our ideals don't have to match, but surely a sense of moral responsibility to the globe and it's peoples? don't we all want to live in a world like that, or at least a world that aspires towards that? there will always be dark... but let it be on good soil at least... and Democracy has every chance of manifesting as it should... we just have to believe it...

i would say that it isn't just america... it is beyond america.. it is Global... it is CORPORATE...

not much has changed... but word is out... people have seen for themselves what happens when you demonstrate...

and you have the right to be defeatist about it... i just think the pill is too bitter for me to swallow, and i suspect there are hundreds of thousands more like me...

 

bring on the revolution.....the establishment has gotta go!!!!!

 

"because of what people allow to happen"? how can this be perceived as Democratic.....? a large slice of people just don't know or believe that it is happening... that they are being duped... some have a clue, but it is not there in B&W... we have a corrupt media, so it is extremely hard to get the facts... nah, this is NOT a Democracy...

the purpose of putting Charles and Camilla there, i should imagine, would have had something to do with baiting?

 

Perhaps you should go back and read the preceding posts, and then read mine again...

As for the fact that it is hard to get the facts and so many people are being duped etc etc...

It doesn't matter why they are allowing it to happen. The point is that when the majority of people don't care enough to even try to find the facts that are available, and in some cases argue against the facts with regurgitated media bullshit, THEY are the ones who are allowing it to happen. That doesn't change with the type of political system in charge... The masses must willingly submit to the system for the system to exist.

 

I wish people would be more pissed off about the tuition prices over here. Lots of kids pay as much as 50k a year or even more and spend decades of their lives paying off the loans. You guys don't know how lucky you are (or were).

 

i have read the posts and i can't see why reading them again would make any difference to my post...

and i have to diagree with you... "why" matters VERY much... you think that if all the lying, manipulation and corruption were to be made public knowledge, that people would stand for it? i certainly don't believe that for one moment.... why would it be so crucial for them to keep up the lies otherwise?