Ponder This

Everything that can suffer is a sentient being.

Sentience does not refer to humanity.

 

of course we are animals. the only thing ever to say different is our own vanity and need to separate ourselves from the rest of the food chain. we want to believe we are special and advanced, but if we're so advanced why are we doing things to eachother that no other animal ever would?

a species with potential is what we are, in my opinion.

 

Great points on the altering environment thing. And I understand that civilization is unique, all I was saying is that it is something that is new to humans and is possible for other species as well in the near future. And as for "actual research" and classes, I think that working in the research department at a zoo for 5 years and having already begun classes for my degree in Primate Behavior & Ecology would qualify. Lol :tongue:

 

^^^lol. my bad.
i meant about the cities and such. if you didn't notice in my other post, i was confused aboutthe primates.

 

I think that pithy comment holds more water than anything yet.
i assume that all the animals are developing, and will get to a point where they have the same potential; for the current time, we happen to be the ones with the potential.

Unlike most animals, we are not satisfied with just staying alive and fed. Animals, in a basic sense , follow perceptions as a guiding principle in life. Humans also have perceptions, but they turn them into concepts, which are then the guiding principle in life. The animals follow the same guide, raw perception, but we complicate it, turn it into concepts, and can follow whatever reality we think exists. It's because if that that we have the potential to exalt ourselves or destroy ourselves.

To a human, survival alone is not an ultimate end in life. We want survival and happiness. But to most animals, those two things are identical. I think we can amplify our happiness by recognizing that survival is happiness.

 

^You still havent told me where your icon is from.

 

really? i thought I did. It's on the notre dame cathedral in Paris. The building was closed so I was just looking at it from outside and this one sculpted guy was staring at me, and it seemed profound so I took a pic. It has a few different meanings for me, but with the consistent theme of being inextricably linked to my brethren but having an individuated consciousness.

 

Ahhh, you probually did, I just never saw it. Anyway, I was checking out U of Washington, and they have these awsome people on top of one of their libraries, which is where I thought it might have been from. I probaully told you that already...but what can i say, im a stoner.

 

this is why im vegan

 

First off I'm glad I was born a human...humans and dolfins are the only mamals/ animals (?) that have sex for pleasure. Animals can't make medal or engineer cities....its an interesting topic but....I'm glad to be human.

 

im pretty sure humans are the only ones who were able to split something that is indescribably small (an atom) and other assorted amazing shit so i think that sits us comfortably on the top

 

^good example of a possible good potential as well as potential destruction. where much is given, much is expected.

 

Umm...that is the most unture thing I have ever heard. WHen in the world did you get that from

 

The top of what? Mind, but thats only part of it. I mean there are plenty of things that other species do better.

 

yea, like co-exist peacefully with others, not fuck up the whole planet, and illegalize plants for 1 thing.

we humans think we're the best species because we could theoretically destroy all other species of animals. the only difference between us and a dog is that we are simply smarter.

 

we humans think we're the best species because we could theoretically destroy all other species of animals. the only difference between us and a dog is that we are simply smarter.[/QUOTE]

Isnt the animal/mammal that can kill any other animal/mammal on the top of the food chain?

 

top of the food chain. and true but each species can do a few things better than us but we can do all things well and we can choose to specialize in one area and maybe surpass an animal that would otherwise be able to that certain skill better. think of humans as the most versatile animals/mammals

 

I dont see you run 46 mile and houre. Or fly without machine, or breath under water, lift 9x you body weight ect.

 

I dont understand this not wanting to eat animals. A plant is a living creature too. It grows and reacts to stimuli. The fact is that unless you can produce your own energy from sunlight then you have to get it by killing and consuming other lliving things. Its sad, but its nature. Being a vegetarian is just drawing a line at creatures that are more similar to you.

 

philosophically speaking, you are correct. killing and ingesting other living creatures is part of mortal existence. but I think most vegetarian/vegans notice that there is a very practical purpose in avoiding animal products. maybe it's compassion to animals, but I think a better reason is that (modern) humanity is so grossly dominant, and have habits of eating meat with almost every meal, and it all adds up to be very hard on the earth. it requires more and more water and land to produce the feed for the animals, who in turn require more land and water to develop fully. it just sucks a lot of life from the earth, when we could just skip the meat and eat what we wouldve fed the animals. if we only had meat once every few days, it wouldn't be such a big issue. many vegans seem radical and extreme, but they see the status quo as grossly extreme in its overconsumption of animals, and sometimes you get people throwing buckets of blood at ppl wearing fur. extreme, yes. but sometimes they need to resort to that as a commensurate response to a culture that is ignorant about its r'ship with food. otherwise who would pay attention?so again I don't think it's so much a matter of being compassionate to animals, but rather an attitude of respect to the earth and of consuming only what's required without undue stress to the planet. we can all have a much smaller impact if we give up meat, or at least eat much less of it. the body adjusts easily to new diets, it takes a couple weeks though