obama,your responsibility to make sure your child speaks spanish..

Would it be fair to tell you you aren't allowed to leave the country without learning the language of your destination and the way to properly behave there, as dictated by the neighbours you will have?

 

I have rewritten this post four times to get it just right, and still, no go, so lets try this the simple direct way

immigrants should learn english for the same reason I should go to college, I want to be an engineer, and I am not qualified to be one without a piece of paper that says I sat through classes, the incentive, more money, easier work, a broader field in which I can practice a craft I have chosen for myself

learning english, the language of most commerce in this country, opens the same doors for immigrants

that being said, the infrastructure that exists doesn't support this, we need to start getting rid of billboards in spanish (over the next several years) and replace them with free english classes, offer amnesty to everyone who registers and attends the classes in good standing, give them a cisa so they aren't in the country illegally (because they are trying to better themselves, and better contribute to the economy) and offer them a path to citizenship which starts with getting a better job, and being able to offer a better life to their families, and themselves

it'd be cheaper than what we're doing now.

 

I don't give a fiddler's fart what language advertisements are in.

Every one of us is wearing a shirt, underwear, and a pair of pants with at least half a dozen different languages weaved on the tags. I bet I could count 50 different languages if I counted each fabrication tag in my closet, easy. (Wouldn't that be a mind-opening project this afternoon?)

Banks, grocers, libraries, ad nauseam have language material in all language you can imagine already. Why? Because that is the nature of business and community.

Welcome to the Global Village, America. Good of you to notice other languages besides English finally exist.

 

Lets not forget what Obama said and did not say.
He was not particularly nuanced, neither do I think he had a salient point.
Governments and business do just fine communicating with each other.
Do any of the world leaders, religious leaders or captains of industry speak multiple languages? I think not.
Would the world be at peace or capitalism/globalisation be a bigger beast than it is, I if they did? I think not.
IMO he was attempting to be academic about this and he failed miserably.
You on the other hand, have been nuanced and do raise salient points.
I may disagree with you, and think what you're saying is fundamentally flawed, but I respect what you are saying, and can somewhat see your point.

The world is in flux and peoples don't see eye to eye, not because of a lack of language skills, but because of ideology.
It would be nice if it was as simple as that, or if it would make a blind bit of difference if we did not live in the tower of Babel.

I don't actually believe if people learnt English; problem solved.
I believe the people within a country, in this case America, will not fundamentally gain anything from learning another language.
Neither do I think Europe is particularly proficient in its ability to have its people speak a secondary language, aside from English.
The fact that a majority do speak English as a second language, maybe because of "empire" or other such notions, I do not know.
I don't think it is because we are "stuck up" that is just how the order of the world is at the moment.
There is not a jot I can do about that.

I imagine you are right.
But, I speak English, but, I still have difficulty understanding the cultural differences between the UK and America.
So, maybe it is just me and you are right.

 

lol fair? life isn't fair...

and Lode, no i'm not prejudice. i have nothing against people of other races, and i am friends with many people who are of those races. there's a difference between that and what i stated. america has it's standards and we shouldn't have to adjust everything to cope with people who are coming here and don't even bother to act properly. you live in america, know how to speak english. this goes for any other country as well. you live in mexico, know how to speak spanish. you live in italy, know how to speak italian.

go to france and walk around speaking english...good luck to you =]

go to any other country, walk around speaking english, and act against their standards...see how they treat you.

and i know immigrants can't vote. i was talking about the immigrants who become citizens.


how would you like it if i went to your home, threw trash all over the floor, didn't clean up after myself, and parked my car on your lawn? then when you try to compromise with me about my behavior, all that comes out of my mouth is some gibberish which you don't understand? you wouldn't enjoy my company and you would do all that was in your power to have me removed.

this is america...just as much of a country as anywhere else. if you want to come here then care for it and treat it like your home, not a local junkyard.

 

Except, it's not YOUR home they're in, it's not YOUR floor they throw trash on and it's not YOUR lawn that they park cars on. Just because you don't like the way someone acts, it's no reason to be all "send them back where they came from". Different people have different values and different standards. You like things to look nice, they probably don't care just as much. But on the flipside, depending on where they come from, they may have higher standards of ethics than you, better familial relations, more real-life intelligence about the world. The "beauty" of a driveway and a lawn may cease to matter to someone who has seen people killed in the streets, or have lived in terrible conditions before getting to "the land of opportunity".

Here's a story I read about once that may have some significance here:

There was an immigrant family that moved into an apartment building. They had small children who would run about and play loudly in the halls and in the apartment. The neighbours became very tired of this and complained to the tenants but they didn't do anything. Eventually some government service was called (be it child services or immigration or something, I don't remember). The man told the mother of the children that she need to keep the kids under control because they are disturbing the other tenants and that it really isn't very safe at all to allow the children to play unsupervised. Her response? Of course it's safe, there are no landmines here. The man left her apartment, and explained the situation to her neighbours and they let it go.

Hopefully you can see why I put that in... We live much different lives in North America, have different values and different standards, yes, but we need to be understanding and accepting of others no matter. We're all human in the end, and maybe if you show understanding to your neighbour's position, they will show understanding and change some of their ways with a little friendly discussion.

 

i see where you're coming from but you can't have a friendly discussion with them if neither of you understands what the other is saying lol =p

and technically, their yards are still my home...along with everyone else around them. the neighborhood is our home. people don't put work into their houses and yards to keep them looking nice just so some douchebag across the street can degrade the area. they make their houses look like shit, and other people have to look at it. no one in their right mind wants to wake up every morning to look out their window and see a dump.

 

I for one am tired of people telling me what I can and can't do on my own property. My yard doesn't look so great at the moment. I can't afford to water the lawn or buy gas to mow my own lawn, so I let it die. I have a non-running vehicle setting in my driveway. I have an old recliner sitting on my porch because it's comfortable and I like to sit on it, and it's one less old recliner in the landfill at the moment. I can't afford to fix my eaves or gutters, or paint. I don't scope out the way you live so don't set standards for me or others. Right now it's not going to do much for your property value anyway.

And many of these immigrants aren't responsible for the condition of the homes they live in their landlords are. They work some of them seven days a week longer hours than you can imagine doing jobs you can't imagine. Some aren't aware of proper disposal of waste, many grew up living on the fringe of dumps outside Mexico City. They survived on waste. Try donating a trash can to them or offer to lend them your weedeater. And you'd be surprised how much both of you can understand when you take the time to talk with them. And remember some of these people toil daily cleaning gringo homes and mowing gringo yards. Maybe they have a little trouble getting into doing it at home with the little free time that they have.