my problems with christianity

Because the Bible says so. For the fundamentalists, it's all about the book.

 

Yeah, you got that right! But note the word "fundamentalists". Not all Christians believe that. Progressive Christians in the mainline Protestant churches view the Bible historically and meatphorically, and aren't stuck up or inclined to believe their views are the only valid ones in town.

 

The fact that it is a special piece of literature doesn't prove anything. Your argument is that because it holds meaning to a large group of people it's then a devine book? argumentum ad populum, The Koran, Gita, even perhaps the Communist Manifestso could be substituted for the Bible in those questions.

 

1)I dont think you should need a man made book to find spirituality. When you say the book is devine though man you are assuming the point your trying to prove. If I remembered my phil intro to logic more id give you the exact name for doing that.
so in your view tribes that have no contact with cultured society (no "holy bible") are going to hell. forget how they live, forget their belief that they connect with a higher power.
Oh wait, im sure the bible has an out clause for them , just as it does for any problem one could come up with. It cant be that cut and dry...

2) I dont wanna go with a little kid answer on this, but the greatest trick of all time perhaps? jk
But really is it possible people need something tangible like a book and a sunday church service to lurch onto? maybe....
People need something to follow, to find faith on ones own would tear many people to insanity.

3)Can you site sources of this? I mean in the world anything can be made to seem a certain way, an illusion, based on false logic and corrupt interpretation.
For example, people claiming the world will end in 2012 say they have math backing their claim. But come on, i dont believe that at all but thats a different story.

terrence mckenna would say the only way to experience the devine would be through psychedelics. DMT with syrian rue, Mushrooms. Now he bases this not on logic, or the future being predetermined and known. He bases it on experience, but he also uses math to claim 2012.... so who knows. He hit the dutch alittle too hard.


That said, I have another question. the only real difference between many other religions and Christianity is the belief in Jesus Christ as a savior, correct????? You dont think God would make an exception or show pity for all those other cultures?????

 

If you'll note the question that was asked that this is an answer to was what makes the Bible the "special" and so the fact as you say; "that it is a special piece of literature" kind of proves that it's… “special” does it not?

My argument was not that it was divine, although I believe it to be and it would seem reasonable that if God were to write a book that he would make it easily obtainable for all, the argument was whether it was “special”.

Yes, they could be but the answers to the question would not be the same. Let’s just take two for instance:

If there is nothing special about the Bible, just another book, why has it translated in more languages than any other book?
The Bible has been translated into over 2000 languages, the exact number is impossible to say because it is being translated into more languages as we speak. In fact for some of those languages there was no written language before the Bible was translated in to that language and thus gave those people the first written form of their own language. Now tell me which of those books you mention even come close to that, say even 100 languages?

If there is nothing special about the Bible, just another book, why is it the most published book in history?
The Bible was hand written for thousands of years before the printing press was invented. It was one of the first scrolls to be converted to book form and after the invention of the printing press, it was the first book printed and continues to be one of the most printed books each year up to this day, in fact no one can even say how many copies of the Bible have been made because even the number printed each year is larger than most people want to keep track of. Now tell which of the books you mentioned can you say the same things about?

 

Most of what you asked, I believe I just answered in my previous post but if not, rephrase it and I’ll try to answer it. But let me try to answer this:

Actually, no, there are lot’s of other differences such as the belief in an immortal soul, which most religions believe in one way or another but the Bible says dust you are and to dust you will return and then offers the hope of a resurrection, where a person can be brought back to life and not just continue on living because of having an immortal soul but in a changed form.

Yes but that is why God has had the Bible translated into all the different languages and spread earth wide so that everyone can have access to the truth in their own language.

 

"If you'll note the question that was asked that this is an answer to was what makes the Bible the "special" and so the fact as you say; "that it is a special piece of literature" kind of proves that it's… “special” does it not?"



I meant "special" relating to my opinion that it is a well-written piece of literature and is very popular.




"My argument was not that it was divine, although I believe it to be and it would seem reasonable that if God were to write a book that he would make it easily obtainable for all, the argument was whether it was “special”."


If God were a writer it would seem logical for him to write better than any other author. It seems strange to me that Shakespere is a better writer then your God.


"Yes, they could be but the answers to the question would not be the same. Let’s just take two for instance:

If there is nothing special about the Bible, just another book, why has it translated in more languages than any other book?
The Bible has been translated into over 2000 languages, the exact number is impossible to say because it is being translated into more languages as we speak. In fact for some of those languages there was no written language before the Bible was translated in to that language and thus gave those people the first written form of their own language. Now tell me which of those books you mention even come close to that, say even 100 languages?

If there is nothing special about the Bible, just another book, why is it the most published book in history?
The Bible was hand written for thousands of years before the printing press was invented. It was one of the first scrolls to be converted to book form and after the invention of the printing press, it was the first book printed and continues to be one of the most printed books each year up to this day, in fact no one can even say how many copies of the Bible have been made because even the number printed each year is larger than most people want to keep track of. Now tell which of the books you mentioned can you say the same things about?"

It's ancient and popular that makes it important obviously, it's a part of theology and human history. I personally own more copies of this book than I would like to count, they appear everywhere in your hotel, people handing them out on street corners. There are however books just as important perhaps not as famous as the Bible, but every religious doctrine has waxed and waned over the millenium, and as society moves away from infantilism and progresses our literature choices will defenantily change.

Although anyone who says it's not important is very wrong, any writings that have changed the course of history are worth reading.

 

hmmm..The Little Red Book... Chairman Mao....The most printed book in history, Quotations had an estimated 5 to 6.5 billion copies printed

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quotations_from_Chairman_Mao

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_books

then what ? The Koran?...

 

Christianity is losing ground ....fast

 

If as you say 6.5 billion copies were printed between 1964 until approximately 1976 that means about 1.5 million copies were printed every day for 12 years, seems a little high to me but maybe the Chinese presses printed nothing else for 12 years.

Your second URL gives the numbers for the Bible at 2.5 billion to more than 6 billion and the Little Red Book at 800 million to 6.5 billion, so instead of using just the highest estimates if we use the lower, then the Bible has been printed more and even if we average the high and the low the Bible has still been print more. Even at that the Little Red Book was only of interest for about 12 years whereas the Bible has been of interest for thousands. And by the way how many languages has the Little Red Book been translated into?

Try again?

 

Perhaps but the Bible does not say that everybody will be a Christian when the end comes.

 

Perhaps the most special thing about the Bible is its degree of insight into human nature. All 66 of the books selected for inclusion in the mainstream version have something timeless to say about what it means to be alive, to be spiritual, and to interact with other people. It stands out among ancient literary collections in this regard. People all over the world can connect with it on some level.

That does not prove that any of the 66 separate books were divinely inspired.

 

true. and really, what hippie can fail to be at all inspired by the teachings of Christ. he was the ultimate hippie.

 

...assuming that he really said all that himself. Since the stories were repeated orally for years before anything was written down, probably some of them were enhanced in various ways. His written teachings may actually reflect his actual teachings plus the collected wisdom and experience of many of his early followers.

I used to think it was funny that all my relatives hated hippie guys who looked exactly like the portraits of Jesus that they had hanging on their walls.

 

yeah, the irony didn't escape me either. :tongue:

 

Oh I know ... Red Book was required reading..and one might of gotten shot if they didn't have their copy too....nice incentive

Odd how the numbers stack up

 

To me, It kind of boils down to what has been deleted ...edited

Certainly, in the NT a good deal of what JC said has been lost to mankind forever

 

The Bible is still almost required reading in the South. Want to make new friends and hear live music around here? Very few options other than church.

That being said, I will bet you that the Bible is by far the least-read bestseller in America. In this area you are expected to have a copy highly visible in your bookcase, but a lot of them have a good bit of dust on top.

 

And like I said that is just one more reason the Bible is “special”.

Now that’s a matter of personal opinion isn’t it? Shakespeare himself quoted from the Bible in his writings so he must have thought the author of the Bible had something going on.

From a worldly viewpoint perhaps there are books just as important as the Bible but if the Bible is the word of God then that pretty much makes it more important than any other book.

As for moving away from infantilism and progressing there are those who would say a close examination of mankind’s direction would show mankind moving toward infantilism and moving away from progress.

And I would agree with you here.

 

There is not any absolute proof the Bible is divinely inspired, proof so absolute that even an hardened atheist would say yes that proves beyond a doubt that the Bible is divinely inspired.

But any book claiming to be divinely inspired would have to do what you just described, don’t you think?