How To Get To Heaven When You Die

"Mine are. However, you won't know it until God teaches you."
Fine. Man, i cant wait until all you fucking religious people die and dont see this god. Your brain will cease to function, and it will be nothing for you forever more. My only worry is that you wont realize how incredibly wrong you were.

 

Colours,

And what if YOUR the one who is wrong? Then you will spend eternity in hell with no hope.

 

Lol IIWIAL (If I Wasn't in a library)

I don't have any legitimate worries, just like you.

I'm not worried about you realizing how incredibly wrong you are, because when you do, you will be happier to know the truth. It's all good.

 

"What shall we do", the question asked of Peter, was implying salvation. He told them that Jesus Christ was the Lord whom they crucified. They felt conviction upon their hearts ("They were cut to the heart", verse 37). They then asked the apostle what they needed to do to be saved. He told them three things they need. Those three things were Repenting, Baptism in water, and Baptism of the Spirit. They are ALL found verse 38 of Acts 2.

Baptism: Greek: Baptizmo "Dip, immerse, bury."

The Enuch I spoke of earlier, in Acts 8, verse 36 said, "Look here is water." He was not going to cook or drink with it. He was wanting to be baptized in it.

John the Baptist baptized with water, as did the apostles.

I’ve quoted the phrase, "Baptism of the Spirit", in several posts, thus making your statement claiming that I believe all baptism is water, fallacious, as usual.

One must undergo two baptisms. One is for death, the other is for new life.

Sorry, that Bible states more than that for salvation. Again, Jesus said repentance, water and spirit, and Peter reiterated that in Acts. That is what is required for salvation. You cannot simply follow one set of verses and diregard the commands given in the rest of them. All verses pertaining to salvation coincide with one another.

If one believes, they will follow the commands of baptism in water and spirit. Believing and denying the commands will not get you into Heaven. Why will it not get one into Heaven? Because they did not die to their old flesh through baptism, nor did they receive the rebirth through the Holy Spirit. Thus, simply believing and repenting does not equal salvation. If you possessed the Holy Spirit of the Lord Jesus Christ, you would know his truth. You flat out deny his plan, thus, according to his word, you do not know him.

Every verse you reiterate that states one must believe in Christ, also coincides with following his commands. Plenty of people in this world believe in the Lord. Does that mean they are saved? No it does not. If they have not repented, received remission, or possess the Spirit then they do not have salvation. All of these steps completed equal being born again, not just one of them.

No the bible does not state that one must repent and be baptized? Hmmm...

I have listed this verse given in five popular versions of the Bible. Here is what they say:

New International Version: "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

King James Version: "Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

New Living Translation:"Peter replied, "Each of you must turn from your sins and turn to God, and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. Then you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

Holman Christian Standard: "Repent," Peter said to them, "and be baptized, each of you, in the name of Jesus the Messiah for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

Amplified Bible: "And Peter answered them, Repent (change your views and purpose to accept the will of God in your inner selves instead of rejecting it) and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of and release from your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

I do not know what Bible you are using, but in each and every version Acts 2:38 has Peter stating that you must do both. Peter first states water baptism for releasing sin and then states the baptism of the spirit. That is the gopel.

No the bible does not state that forgiveness of sin comes through baptism? So, now you are calling the apostle Peter a liar? That is quite amusing. No, the verses you state are not lies. You are taking them horribly out of context and believing only what you wish to.

The Bible states that if you believe you shall be saved. It does not stop there. If you believe, then you are going to repent. If you believe you are going to be baptized. If you believe you are going to be filled with the Holy Spirit. Why? Because if you are a true believer of the Lord, then you will follow all of what he had stated, and his apostles reiterated.

You are trying to get to Heaven through following 1/3 of the plan (the repentance part). It does not work that way. If it worked that way, then there would be no command of water and spirit baptism.

Jesus Christ said that he was the bread of life. In the same verse he tells the followers that their forefathers ate manna from Heaven, and yet, they perished (They did not go to Heaven, which is eternal life, as the Bible tells us, they went to Abraham’s Bosom which was not part of Heaven). Why did they not enter into Heaven when they died? In the Bible God states that they did not follow his commands. Abraham, Moses, Noah, did not enter into Heaven immediately upon their death because they did not follow what the Lord commanded them to. You are not above these men, yet you believe that by simply admitting that Jesus Christ is your savior, you will enter into Heaven upon it. You must take heed from the example made of these men.

Entrance into Heaven is not simply based on belief. That is unbiblical and ridiculous. Repentance, baptism in water, baptism in spirit, walking in the spirit/praying in the spirit, following his commands, spreading the gospel. All of these things are required. The Bible tells us that we will have to give an account for each and every word and action. It does not say, "You will go to Heaven because you believe." In fact, it states that many knock on the door, but FEW shall enter.

If you believe in him and follow his commands.

Your way of thinking means that everyone will get to Heaven.

Nearly all the verses you use as rebuttal, leave you constantly contradicting yourself. You are now stating that by simply believing in Jesus Christ that one will be saved. A few posts back, you stated that one must possess the Holy Spirit to be saved. You continue your claim that these verses do not mention baptism. The funny thing is, these verses do not mention baptism of the Holy Spirit either.

Baptism is not the gospel?. So, every part of the gospel that mentions baptism is a lie? So now you only believe in specific parts of the Bible? One of those, "I believe what I see fit", "Christians".

Correction: Believing in the gospel and FOLLOWING what it says saves.

"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them"

Jesus wanted them baptized, and he is the only one who can baptize with the spirt, yet, he was telling his apostles to baptize. Thus, he was speaking of WATER baptism.

I have already stated that it is not up to us when we receive the Holy Spirit. The Bible states the Spirit of the Lord goes where it wills. One can receive the Holy Spirit whenever the Lord feels they are truly ready and sincere in their belief. Some folks receive the spirit before baptism, some receive the spirit after baptism. Regardless of the date and time, the Bible states that Baptism is necessary for part of the process of salvation because it is for the removal of sin.

LOL If I did not believe the Bible, I would not follow what it says, I would not quote scripture and would not use the verses for correcting and rebuking you as the Bible states (2 Timothy 3:16) I find that comment humorous, ludicrous and the farthest thing from the truth that I have heard all day long.

 

Epiphany you take one verse from the bible out of context, ignore the other 99 that talk about the same issue, and build a church on it.

 

Oooh, well that's the catch 22, isn't it? You must either have complete faith in the path that has been set before you and follow it, or you have to flail around looking for the "perfect" Christianity to save you from the chaos. Both require the same leap of faith. Near as I can tell, if you have total faith in your connection to God, then it's still a matter to be resolved by luck: you had better hope that path you have such faith in is the right one, eh?

Here's the real good news: EVERYONE gets entrance to the Kingdom and that only YOU can deny yourself that bliss (through feelings of doubt, guilt, etc.). If you really have a personal relationship with your saviour, then your saviour isn't going to deny you entrance, right? ANYONE, baptized or not (are you going to be denied the kingdom because no one dunked you in a pool of water? I don't think so.), repentant or not (to hate/deny your past is to hate/deny yourself, for you and your past are inseperable - it is what makes you who you are - as long as you learn from your experiences and don't stupidly repeat the same mistakes over and over, the spiritual purpose of repentance is served - the ritual is unnecessary), ANYONE who has true faith in their personal saviour has the keys to the Kingdom and will not be denied.

Don't be fooled by dogmatic rules and fights over what is required of you... there's no point to it. If you fall for that crap then you give rise to doubt concerning your path. Never doubt your path. Follow your bliss (the signal your personal saviour gives you - like a homing beacon to your own path to righteousness) and you will be just fine. Be honest with yourself and others. Deciet will always lead you away from your path, it will twist you around til you no longer know which way is which. Know yourself and understand the connectedness of all things. Love yourself and know that you are a part of the universe. Then you will come to love the universe and you will, by proxy, love God - it's the natural course of events, if you let it happen. Then you can't fail. The ancient rituals only apply if you want them to. Create your own rituals (I do) and exercise your spirituality creatively. The rules in those old books worked for the people who wrote them down. That is their path. Find your own. Conformity isn't the path for everyone - if it were, our inherent differences (due to genetics or upbringing, or whatever) would doom a vast number of people for whom conformity is impossible to damnation. No good and loving deity would let that happen. Be bold. Believe in yourself and strike out on the path which you find to be righteous and don't let anyone tell you that simply because you don't think about spiritual matters exactly the way they do, that there is something wrong with your beliefs. It's more likely that there is something wrong with theirs - since they feel the need to reinforce their belief system by using it to elevate themselves above those who don't share it. Don't prozelytize your personal beliefs because they may not work for someone else. Instead, if your path is such that you feel a need to do so, help others to know themselves and find their own path to the Kingdom.

I expect that this post will be met with a lot of resposes which will say, in essence "there is only one path - through Jesus." This may be true, but your path "through Jesus" is unique - each person must come to know God by their own path (though all those paths end up taking you "through Jesus"). Keep in mind that "Jesus" is just one of many names for the divine. The name "Jesus" is Greek (a translation of the Hebrew Yeshua, or Joshua, which is iteslf a contraction of the name/phrase Yehoshua, which means "God saves"). The original name would most likely have been in Aramaic. A rose by any other name... The name matters not. Call your personal saviour "Bob" if that's what your path leads you to do. Don't fall for the "everyone else believes so-and-so" line. History is full of occurrances where the vast majority were dead wrong.

Keep your spiritual eyes clear and don't let those who have blinded themselves do the same to you.

One more thing. The man from Nazereth was a Jew. He believed, as all Jews, that Heaven would exist here, not in some other world. When he said "The Kingdom of God is at hand" he meant just that. You can reach out and touch it right now. Only after Paul came along did the idea that you had to die to reach the Kingdom come into play.

 

I have not taken anything out of context. You simply choose the verses that make it easy for you. All you want to do is believe and think that somehow, that means you have eternal life. You deny Acts, Romans, and other books of the Bible where baptism is stated because it does not comply with your own personal beliefs.

"If anyone loves me, he will obey my teachings, My father will love him and he will come to him and make our home with him. He who does not love me will not obey my teachings." (John 14:23-24).

"This is love for God: to obey his commands." (1 John 5:3)

Last time I checked, you have not listed ninety nine verses about belief in Jesus Christ. You dismiss every single verse that has to do with the idea of baptism, and have left out some of the ones that speak of the Holy Spirit. There are MANY of these, and I’ve listed most of between both this post and my own salvation post, spoken by Jesus Christ, Peter and Paul, among others. Your claim that I only rely on one verse that speaks about baptism is amusing.

You continue to quote the same scriptures over and over again, based upon your own interpretation. The Bible was not mean to be interpreted. The Bible was written by man THROUGH the Holy Ghost and is intended to be read through it as well.

Peter says in one verse, Repent, be Baptized and be filled with the Spirit. One, single verse that ties in belief (because obviously if you don’t believe, you aren’t going to follow anything), asking for forgiveness, how to receive forgiveness and how to be reborn. One verse stating ALL of these things. This is the message the apostles carried when spreading the gospel of Jesus Christ. Upon believing, what did they do? The bible tells us they were baptized and filled with the Spirit. Does the bible ever give an example of these people simply believing without both baptisms? No, it does not. Does the Bible ever say, "And the apostles spread the news of Jesus Christ and the people of so and so simply believed". No, it states they believed and received baptism of water for cleansing and baptism of the Spirit for new life through Jesus Christ.

Here is a perfect example: Acts 8:12 - First they believed in Jesus Christ (as Philip was preaching the gospel to them), then they were baptized. When Peter and John came, they were filled with the Spirit. If they had not believed, they would not have been baptized, nor filled with the Spirit.

(On another note, you keep using Acts 10:47 trying to claim your point, "Can anyone keep these people from being baptized with water." Notice in the next sentence it says he ORDERED them to be baptized." If baptism was not of any importance, Peter would not have ordered them to do so.)

(You also uses Paul’s statement that he said he did not come to baptize. However, in Acts 22:16 he said, "And now what are you waiting for? Get up and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on his name.")

Of course someone has to believe in Jesus Christ for salvation. If they didn’t, then how would they repent, be baptized or be filled with the Spirit? Belief comes before anything. If you do not believe in God, are still going to repent? No. If you do not believe in Jesus, is he going to fill you with his spirit? No. If one does not believe in Jesus, are they going to be baptized? No. It is obvious that one must believe in Christ. However, simply because one has belief does not give them eternal life.

Jesus Christ said that without rebirth, one would not see his kingdom. That statement on it’s could prove that pure belief in him alone is not the basis for salvation. That doesn’t make any verse wrong, it means that they are parallel to one another. Your claims are like trying to conduct a scientific experiment without all of the elements. You have belief, you have repentance, but without baptism and the holy spirit, (death and rebirth) salvation is not complete.

No belief = No repentance = No death (bapstism) = No new life (Spirit)

It is so blatantly obvious, which makes it quite sad that people are so blinded by false prophecy that they cannot understand it.

I already went through a basic display of Apostolic beliefs (fifteen listed in all). My church is not based on one scripture. You can continue to put down it down all you want. It is simply another display of the fact that you have no understanding of Christ or his Spirit.

"This is what we speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in words taught by the Spirit (and this coincides with tongues, utterance through the spirit), expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words. The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned." (1 Corinthians 2:14 -15)

That is why you do not understand.

 

I have a morality teacher who is an activist against abortion at a local clinic, a supporter of capital punishment, and gay. The funny thing is, he twists and turns the bible to fit his lifestyle. When we talked about homosexuality in class he would say that the physical act of being gay is a sin, but not simply having gay feelings. I think that is bull, though only because i disagree with him on other issues, not because i dislike gays =p. He takes "thou shal not kill" to mean that under NO circumstances may you take another human life (unless they deserve it). It bugs me that he has convinced himself that he is living a moral life simply by interpreting the bible in his own way.

 

The truth is that He is right about the gay thing. It is not a sin to have the feelings, it is a sin to give in to them. Being tempted is NOT a sin. It is when we give in to temptation that we sin. Jesus was tempted, yet without sin:

Heb 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
(KJV)

Jas 1:13 ¶ Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: {evil: or, evils}
14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.


As far as the "Thou shall not kill" He is dead wrong. Even under the law, God commanded the Israelites to kill people. "Thou shall not kill" is referring to murder. We are allowed to defend ourselves.

Lu 22:36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

Jesus told them to sell their garnment and buy a sword. He was telling them that it was ok to defend theirselves.

 

well if i remember correctly from the sermon on the mount, that Jesus had said concerning i cant even remember what, but i do beleive it goes something like this

If someone should strike you on your right cheek, turn to him your left

...or something to that effect...

Also, and i mean im a pretty liberal guy so i see nothign wrong with anything homosexual, but Jesus on the sermon on the mount [again] says that if you look at a woman with lust, then you have commited adultury of the mind, im pretty sure this would apply to men to...I'm not saying this is how i feel, cause i dont feel this way, but it is right there

 

I think you misunderstood me. Maybe if youre gay and you try to keep it out of mind then it is okay. But i think it is cheating (for lack of a better word) to proudly call yourself homosexual and think homosexual thoughts but simply refrain from homosexual acts just to keep in tune with the bible.

And yeah, lust is a sin. So lust for another man is like a double wammy.

 

but, yeah, it technically does never say anyhitng about loving another man, only homosexual sex...but still, its still not wrong

 

sorry, im not trying to get into this debate...just wanna say this before we get started

 

Thank you Know1nozme! And to add to what you said here's some direct quotes (don't know where exactly but they're in the gospels and attributed to Jesus himself)

"The Kingdom of Heaven is here and now".

"It is the will of the Father that none should perish but that all would be saved"
(not the wish but the will of the Father, you know--the thing that supposedly created the universe?)

"How will I desribe the Kingdom of Heaven? It's like unto a mustard seed...." ie, not a place but a thing that takes root and grows within something else.

 

sarcasm?

 

That's not what I said. Thinking homosexual thoughts IS a sin. It is when they are tempted to think those thoughts and don't because it is wrong, that they aren't sinning. It is only when they give in to those thoughts by entertaining them and accepting them into their mind.

 

so then you can't even classify yourself as homosexual.

 

You are most welcome! So many Christians either forget or ignore the roots of their own belief system. Why is it that nearly every pagan I'm aquainted with knows Judeo-Christian religious history better than almost any Christian I know? Personally I think it has something to do with the innate pagan need to actually think for oneself; to strive to understand the nature of religions, how they work, what purposes they are put to, etc. Pagans refuse to be sheep. It seems Christians actually strive to be sheep. If I never hear the phrase "Let go. Let God." ever again, I will count myself among the blessed.

The greatest religious leaders in the world were heretics (including Jesus). Original religious ideas = heresy. A very dangerous concept to the entrenched leadership of organized religions everywhere.

HOORAY FOR HERESY!!! You have a right to your religion, no matter how freaky anyone else thinks it is! AN YE HARM NONE, DO WHAT THOU WILT. Curiosity is a sacred gift from the divine... A holy commandment to experience the world. To turn away from the sacred, active now in order to devote yourself to preparing for death is to turn away from the divine gift of your life. Oops, that's not in the proscribed reading material, is it?

Shhh... it's in the secret teachings

Isn't it funny that the largest contingent of the "pro-life" activist demographic is actually mainly concerned with what they think will happen when they die?

 

Human beings are complex creatures, inexplicably capable of embodying diametrically opposed attributes within a single action. In our most complete, meaningful moments, humanity fulfills a promise of great love, compassion, mercy and forgiveness, and yet ignorance of these things or the idea of losing these things, allows intolerance, fear, anger, hatred, and violence to overtake one's better nature and bring about the very condition one hopes to avoid.

We respect those who apply their genius to the realization of truth, wisdom, insight and creativity, to those who make peace and resolve conflicts, to those whose efforts ease the suffering, to those who suggest a better way to live. But even as we celebrate the highest ideals of what a human being may achieve we tend to condemn the humanity of those who fail to live up to those ideals.

It seems every facet of human nature has been used, erroneously of course, as justification for someone's damnation. The unenlightened have caused each other great suffering because one or the other did not have the "right" amount power or money, or simply because one did not have the "right" spiritual, intellectual, political, racial or sexual identity.

It seems to me that if any two adults truly love one another and are not causing suffering to anyone else (like a neglected spouse) then the details of their intimacy are no business of mine, or yours, or anyone but those two people. The details of their intimate relationship, whether sexual or otherwise, should have no influence on the decency, the kindness and respect with which you treat them.

If you, for any reason, religious or otherwise, reduce any human being down to his or her sexuality, or debase their humanity because their most intimate relationship does not fulfill your desires, then you should consider that your love for your fellow human beings is undeveloped. Perhaps your love for your fellow human beings could stand to become just a little more holy.

Consider the thought that God knows you by the measure of your love for humanity in general and for each individual human being.