Hillary's Mandate Enforcement?

We started the income tax for fund the war effort and never repealed. Every bit of power you give to the govt will never be given back unless taken by force. Remember that when voting for candidates promising this and that from Govt.

You are exactly right, the govt does not work for us.

 

The reason you need to make participation in a national health plan "mandatory" is to prevent adverse selection, which is almost certain to occur otherwise. And if you have to look up the term "adverse selection," please refrain from muddying the debate with your ignorance and leave the discussion to the grown-ups.

 

This thread demonstrates how conservatives "debate" the issues.

Republicans: Don't make health care coverage mandatory!!!!! Arrrgh!!!! [insert insane rants and grunts by Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter]

Informed citizen: Then exactly how will you avoid adverse selection?

Republicans: [crickets chirping sound]

Informed citizen: Okay so now we-

Republicans (interrupting): Don't make health care coverage mandatory!!!!! Arrrgh!!!! [insert insane rants by Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter]

Loop endlessly, and toss in an occasional "why do you hate America?" and you have mastered the art of being an assertive conservative.

 

Now that the writer's strike is over SunLion shouldn't you be focusing on your career again?

 

I'm sorry, I don't understand the question. (I'm not a writer, though I have done a little editing... I'm a terrible writer, and much better but much more brutal editor!)

 

i am not too keen on the working of insurance but it seems to me if everyone is covered, the tax payers are going to be the ones hit by the smokers and whatnot that contribute to the adverse selection you refer to.

If i drink, smoke, and am obese and you are neither of the 3, i will use a bigger piece of the pie for my coverage which will raise taxes or everyone.

Is that the jist? I honestly do not know. I am sorry if i seem "ignorant" and am not a "grown up" so why don't you try explaining it?

 

Vehicle insurance in California is mandated.

 

Actually a recent study found that smokers and the obese have lower health care costs than healthier individuals (because their life spans are shorter), so not a good argument on the insurance companies part.

 

I have to both agree and disagree. While anyone get cancer or heart disease, those people under current insurance plans have higher premiums because they on average have more health problems, more medications, more hospital visits, more equipment, more treatments and programs than the average person. That is why most plans make you take a physical and nicotine tests.

So while it is true they live less, their year to year costs, while alive, are more than the average person.

Also, i am in no way calling this report untrue, but i would like to read it. Do you know where i can find it? I enjoy reading up on all sides of any argument and expanding knowledge while proving pre-existing beliefs untrue.

 

Actually a recent study found that smokers and the obese have lower health care costs than healthier individuals (because their life spans are shorter), so not a good argument on the insurance companies part.

That sounds like a good argument, and in other sorts of health care financing arrangements, could be a consideration. But (as SpreadneckGA correctly states in the post before this one) what they don't mention is that once the person dies, health plans cannot collect the monthly premium. So they don't save anything (and actually lose money) due to smokers dying young. Their question isn't "what's the total cost of providing health care to this person in their lifetime," but rather "what is the cost of providing health care to this person versus how much they pay us in premiums."

Some people feel that if they pay out a lot of money, but never use the insurance, that they've been "ripped off." I'm not even joking. When I worked in that industry, we would actually occasionally encounter a customer who would argue that they should get all their premium money refunded to them because they never filed a single claim. Heck, in my twisted mind, those people should be charged a little extra. A health tax

 

SunLion, i have heard people complain of that same thing and go as far as not opt into the insurance provided at work for 20$ a pay period. That is only 10 a week, 520 a yr. One small problem easily costs way more than that.

It is pretty wild.

 

A link to the study: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,328367,00.html?sPage=fnc/health/nutrition

 

That is very interesting. Thank you for sharing that.

 

I think we all need to stop looking at the figure of how many people are uninsured. These people are receiving medical care. I know of no one even the homeless living under a bridge that are denied care.

The thing is many people pay out of their own savings. Isn't that the capitalist system? Are the insurance companies worried that they are missing a huge part of a market that Hillary and her ilk could guarrantee them? While the republicans are worried more about whether or not you or your employer pays the insurance companies.

Insurance companies and the medical profession have an incestuous relationship. I have a friend that was a chiropractor, every year in order to renew his license he had to attend 12 hours of what was classed as training to update his skills. Those trainings consisted mainly of workshops on how to get as much money out of patients' insurance policies as possible by charging for unnecessary xrays and modalities, because they were allowed by certain insurance policies. It was rare that he ever came back with new skills not related to billing, but related to patient care or new practices.

 

here is what transpired on This week with George Stephanopoulos from 4Feb. she didn't say YES and she didn't say NO.


The Democratic presidential hopeful tried to duck the question Sunday, when ABC's George Stephanopoulos asked her about wage-garnishing three times. But she didn't rule it out.

Clinton on Sunday described universal health care as "a core Democratic value and a moral principle, and I'm absolutely going to do everything I can to achieve that."

The campaign of Sen. Barack Obama is warning voters that Clinton's plan forces everyone to buy insurance, even if they can't afford it. "And if they cannot afford it, then the question is what are you going to do about it? Are you going to fine them? Are you going to garnish their wages?" Obama asked Clinton at one of their debates.

Clinton, pressed on the issue Sunday during her appearance on ABC's "This Week," said people will be able to afford her plan because she would limit premiums to a "low percent of your income."

According to Clinton, "about 20 percent of the people who don't have health insurance in America today could well afford it," despite its "exorbitant" cost. "So what we've got to do is have shared responsibility. Everybody has to pay something, but, obviously, on a sliding scale."

Stephanopoulos tried again: "And I still haven't heard, if people can afford it and they don't buy the insurance, will their wages be garnished under your plan? Will they have to pay fines?"

Clinton told Stephanopoulos "there are a number of ways" of getting people to enroll in her universal health care plan. "I think you can automatically enroll people, and you will then say you've got to be part of this."

She added that Congress is sure to "have some ideas" about it as well. "But if you don't start with universal health care, if you don't say everybody's going to be in the system, we'll never get there," Clinton said.

Pressed a third time on the wage-garnishing question, Clinton said, "we will have an enforcement mechanism -- whether it's that (wage garnishing) or it's some other mechanism through the tax system or automatic enrollments."

Clinton said the "key point" is to implement universal health care. She said the mechanism by which it is achieved -- "going after people's wages, automatic enrollment...whatever the mechanism is, is not as important as...the fundamental commitment to universal health care..."

Clinton insisted that she will not force people to buy health insurance they can't afford: "There will be mechanisms to enable everyone to afford it. We have costed this out, and we will be able to achieve it," she insisted.

 

i'm just going to start handing over all my pay to the government. looks like they're coming after it either way.