Help me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I agree BBB I never claimed that Hinduism is superior
The ignorent hindus masses are on the same plane as the ignorent christian and islamic followers

What I find disturbing is that some westeners find superstitions that are followerd in India to be interesting and worthy of emulating for example-- frog dev worship thread.

Those who are attracted towards hinduism because of the kama sutra or tantric yoga or marijuana smoking fail to grasp the true essence of the religion because they practise hinduism only to pursue these areas and will never rise above their fascination for such matters and hence will never contribute in any meaningful way to the progress of religion.

With the influx of people who practice drugs it is not difficult to
visualize the future when ordinary rituals will be subverted to include drug use and hinduism will become a religion of sex and drugs.

People must convert or practise hinduism for the right reasons and not because Tantric sex and kama sutra are cool or just because there were some sadhus who smoked marijuana.

The course of action that is needed right now is
to combat and eliminate superstitious beliefs at the ground level while this is being done it is also important to discourage people who profess to practice hinduism but whose are basically in it for the sex and the drugs
and who will undo whatever work we do combating superstition.

Having said all this I must declare that I have no right to prevent anybody from practising hinduism and I am no authority to regulate the practice of hinduism

And about those who are lost ? I really don't know who will save them
Maybe kurt cobain -The prophet of depressed drug addicts will....

 

I really doubt this man's intention he is just a fashionable young man who wants to be cool
Like Maddona he will spend his time jumping from religion to religion.

 

Tell me devin, why Hinduism? Whats next? Maybe you should just join the Krishna movement, then you can mix it with Kabbalah (hollywood version) and Scientology for a neat little "Kabbalahistic Krishna is an Alien form of Wiccan Shamanism."

Look into your own soul, find your own callings. Did you know that many hindu deities come from Indo-European influence, and that the same deities can be found in congnate forms of European paganism? There is also reverence for the Divine Mother, through Shaktism. And that many elements of Continental Celtic beliefs are also there? Danu, the great waters, the sacred Bel tree, all of it.

But they dont teach that in your new age books, so you wouldnt know.

Druidism and Vedic teachings are twin disciplines, cultural influences aside, and even the mythologies reflect the same influences.
Hinduism is a result of many thousands of years of indeginous practices, mixed with the later influences of the Aryans. The product today is an India specific faith, it is steeped in their culture and being, and i dont think a suburban little kid like yourself will get it.

So if you are supposedly pagan, shamanism aside, the why would you change what you are doing just because the spice is different?

Deities aside, hinduism is living love, and knowledge and family.

Unless you want to take the Yogi path, and I dont think you have the stones for the one.

 

Some people do seem to be attracted to Hinduism and indeed other things for just those sorts of reasons. I think there's an element of seeking some kind of escape from humdrum reality in what is imagined to be a kind of 'exotic' cult. It's a kind of romanticism in a way.
The positive side is that although the initial motivation for looking at Hinduism may be flawed, maybe a few will come to see things in a different light.


Generally, I don't know about western people 'converting' to Hinduism. I'm not really sure even what it would mean.
Myself, I follow the line taken by Sweet Mother, that religion and yoga are two different things. I don't see that in order to practice yoga one needs to convert to any religion. Certainly, I think it's a mistake to try, as ISKCON have, to introduce Indian culture 'lock, stock and barrell' into the west. Just the clothing even is totally out of accord with the demands of the climate - many other things too, which are more or less superfluous.

No doubt there are a few westerners who have successfully 'converted' to become 'Hindus'. But I think thats only quite a small number, and even those who have, like Sri Krishnaprem for example, have still obviously retained their western cultural education and so on. So they are really in a kind of 'hybrid' class. Whether an ordinary person living in the west can really 'convert' is something I can't answer. To me it seems almost impossible - to others, it may seem different.

What you say about kids being attracted by cannabis smoking sadhus is interesting to me, as I've met cannabis smoking sufis, but I don't see many young folks turning to Islam on that basis.

 

Thank you!.

 

why do you consider the right reasons more valid than the left reasons?... its all one... do you see the Cosmic Joke?

 

From the Gita (bolds are added, by me)​

​

"​

I am the same to all beings:
To me none is disliked or dear.
But those worshipping Me, devout,
Are in Me, and I am in them. (29)

If even an evildoer Meaning that which is percieved as evil, since it is all one. So pot and psychedelic heads may be considered "evil" by the traditionalist elitist hindus that look down upon them like worms. The tone of Krishna is one of mocking evil
Worships me single-heartedly,
He should be considered righteous, focusing his mind on the one consciousness, ME, he learns how to use drugs in a positive non-attached manner filled with devotion and sharing and love. going beyond the duality of "on drugs" and "off drugs" and reaching Krishna though honoring Shiva. Only one consciousness
Truly having rightly resolved. (30)

Quickly he becomes virtuous
And goes to everlasting peace.
O Son of Kunti, understand:
My devotee is never lost. Even if the devotee runs into trouble with a risky way of worshiping, it is a sacrafice for shiva, and the one consciouness doesn't abandon such devotion (31) Women, Vaishyas, also Shudras,
Even those born of evil wombs, Like the womb of an American, a society that has a drug culture that needs lovers and free minds in it, to spread positive one consciousness thoughts in users and abusers.
All those who take refuge in Me
Also go to the Supreme Goal.9 This basically sums it up. IT DOESN"T MATTER WHAT YOUR DANCE IS, drugs or no drugs, whatever... you take refuge in the one conciousness, you can go to the supreme goal, this can happen right here, right now, where else could it happen?(32) "



The point is that the one consciounsness honors those that worship SINGLE-heartedly, aiming at the one consciousness... Like a ganja smoke that keeps his/her mind on god, while doing his/her mantra for shiva, Om shiva shankara hare hare ganga... true devotion, even by a disliked put down pot smoker is HONORED by the one consciousness.

Thus don't listen to these silly heads that put down pot heads, and psychedelic trippers... these people can BE HERE NOW, and dance the dance that the one consciousness does... for these people are simply puppets... if the devotion is true, if refuge is taken in the one consciounsess, they can move toward the supreme goal...

THE HERE NOW! TOTAL REALIZATION beyond the cosmic joke, beyond leela, total dissolving of the seperate self eternally in the one consciousness.

So even US, bozos on the BUS, aware that it is one consciousness in varying degrees, doing some silly fun cosmic joke rituals for shiva, occassional using psychedelics and or pot... are true to the spirit. And the one consciousness speaks to me and it says in my hearts and hearts, "It is alright for some people"

It is in your devotion friend.... not whether you do or don't do drugs... drugs come and go... but your devotion is an addiction that lasts a lifetime and free you from the sacraments you use, while ironically you still play with them from time to time...


So roll up that gita verse and toke it!

​

 

Ram.

 

Ram.

Reminds me of this story Bhaskar, which is a cosmic joke.

Setup:
Neem Karoli Baba always wrote in this diary at least two pages a day... and all the devotees were intrigued, what secrets lay hidden in the great master of consciousness's writtings, who knows how detailed the secrets are... Yet Baba never let anyone see it... finally after the body of Neem Karoli Baba had undergoe energy transformation some call "death," (he is here now) the devotees are allowed to look at his diary.

Punchline:
Books and books, all of his diaries over the years contain...

drumroll

"Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram Ram"

over and over and over again.

 

Likhita japa.

 

what are you smoking? get some books and do some serious study.

 

Come on man, serious study

This is perhaps the worst recommendation you can give anyone, you are leading them straight on the path to HELL! Please be warned all.

That word serious is one of the biggest sins in my opinion, lighten up dude... find the unbearable compassion that comes with the cosmic giggle if ya can dig it?

From the course of sadhana, found in Ram Dass's Remember be here now

These are pointers to sadhana

"9. At certain stages you will takes your sadhana very seriously. Later you will see the wisdom of the statement of Jesus that to seek the Lord, men need not disfigure their faces. Cosmic humor, especially about your own predicament, is an important part of the journey."

I guess you haven't reached the cosmic humor stage. But perhaps you have, excuse me if I didn't get your humor.


Laughter of the great mystics



Ma, in the midst of a conversation or a devotional song, would often begin to laugh in a rich, resonant and rhythmic voice. Her laughter sometimes quite prolonged seemed to say: "Don’t worry - be happy!" This was in keeping with "Ja hoye jay" was the most frequent of her pithy East Bengali aphorisms. It means, "Come what may, all’s well, all is God’s wondrously intelligent, benevolent play." - About Anandamayi Ma



"Let the love of holy laughter guide you.” -RUMI, sufi mystic


"With each passing year I have increasingly experience his presence , his guidance, his love, and each time I have taken myself too seriously, his cosmic giggle ." - Ram Dass on Neem Karoli baba

"There is no greater mystery than this -​

that being the Reality ourselves, we seek to gain Reality.
We think that there is something binding our reality and
that it must be destroyed before the reality is gained.

It is ridiculous!

A day will dawn when you will yourself laugh at your effort.
That which is on the day of laughter is also now."

Ramana Maharshi​

The cosmic joke... ​

Come on friend lighten up with US ON THE BUS​

ON THE BUS = Aware of the one consciousness that is all in time and space, beyond time and space... thus a supporter of efforts to form group consciousness on earth, working together as one. Thus those on the bus are working full time to form a realization of unity on the earth, world peace through changing your own consciousness... shine on in THE ONE!​

IT IS ALL US, ON THE BUS​

THE SEA OF LOVE, what's the fuss?​

Fly with the Dove, see past duality dig?​

Don't get all hung up on vedas, even if it's the rig!​

with the serious study the ego grows big​

With holy humor it flies into bliss​

Join US and give the divine a kiss​

 

Exactly my friend! your view of drugs and sadhana has been corrupted and perverted by personal dramas related with drugs.

In the circles I've been in, psychedelic drugs have helped people with the HERE NOW and BEING just as much as say, sometimes less, sometimes more, then say visiting a holy person like Amma does... you don't want to get attached to either, but they both help. To deny this is to ignore the truth, that its good for people to use it occassionaly, not everybody, but a small minority of the spiritual practicioners yes... However if the path is solely drugs without a menditative, mantra, devotion and other practices also, it won't work as well, and I wouldn't recommend it...

 

Ganja...please understand, I've been down your path, personally very little with the drugs, but over 30 years ago was in the middle of the original counterculture. I saw plenty of people who were where you are now...getting high, reading Indian philosophy, doing the spiritual thing, and convinced they knew the truth and that there was no danger ahead. You come across as a very nice, sincere person, though a little out of control, and to state it plainly, I would hate to think that you might become an addict or permanently fucked up mentally.

Perverted view on my part? No. Coldly realistic and backed by experience and sound philosophy...yes.

I'm not going to preach to you about drug use anymore after this...done my duty, needn't be attached to the results. Consider it advice from a friend.

 

Yeah, well I trust my guru's advice about drugs over yours (ironically you are the guru, and I hear a deeper part of yourself say to me "go baby go"... so practice it in a way flowing with his teaching, my inner guidiance, Ram Dass's view and Remember Be Here Now... as well as my other teacher Bhagavan Das's view on drugs I should say, and being a tantric... but basically the people in the Neem Karoli Baba lineage have shaped my view of drugs and sadhana the most.

So I understand your view... but think it is absurdly moral absolutism... I can almost understand moral absolutism around the subject of violence, but when it comes to drugs it just stems from emotional pain, not realistic at all.

 

Yes, the loss of friends and family members to drug-caused addiction, mental illness, and suicide has been very painful, still is...it's very realistic.

I can accept the idea of Neem Karoli Baba personally allowing a very close and advanced disciple such as Baba Ram Dass to use LSD on occasion, but if his successors are encouraging drug use as a part of the self-realization process, they are misleading their followers and, I would guess, going against the wishes of their Guru.

 

Exactly man, it hurts... and the easy way out... is to blame the drugs... make drugs the bad guy.

But it isn't the drugs... the one consciousnes does all and is all... call it God if you will... GOD causes the loss of friend and family members over these drug issues...

Stop demonizing drugs, and go after the source of this misery, YOURSELF!

"LSD is good for the world" - Neem Karoli Baba

I think that says Baba's position on it quite clearly.

And his "successors" as you call them feel that everything is part of the self-realization process!


A substance that is good for the world in our guru's eye, because it lets one have the darshan of christ is alright to encourage the use of... But one must also warn against its dangers... the risks involved and so on... Which ram dass and bhagavan dass do!


I will sum of what Baba's argument is, based on all I have heard about him talking about LSD, taking LSD, viewing his devotees being so into it, and all his interactions with it that I know, as well as my personal communication with him through tuning him in.

We will focus on LSD, which can be applied to other psychedelics... as I have dealt with the issue of pot and my guru in another post on this forum about shiva.

1) LSD is a positive thing for the world, because it allows one to have the darshan of the one consciousness (He uses the word christ).

2) This darshan is only temporary, as if one is not doing other sadhana, one usually leaves this state after a few hours. Yet such an experience of the one consciousness, can inspire one to seek to practice sadhana in order to live in the state of the one consciousness (as it did for me... without the LSD experience, I would never got into gurus, meditation or other spiritual sadhanas that allow me to live IN IT HERE NOW)

Thus psychedelic sadhana won't allow on to BE IN IT, LIVE IN IT and so on... One must seeks other methods, like the HERE NOW.

3) There are exceptions, as there was a young kid Ram Dass knew that died while on LSD and doing breathing excercises, using both to attain liberation from the cycle of rebirths. Baba said that he accomplished this, finished his sadhana.

4) Some yogis would be afraid to use it, you have to be very focused on god to use it right.

5)He only recommended that Ram Dass use LSD, but also commanded him to tell the truth... thus Ram Dass is loyal as he speaks the truth about LSD.

And this truth, is not that everybody should stay away from LSD and psychedelics, and that it can't help people spiritualy... that view is incorrect.

 

What are some of the basic beliefs of honduism? Do you have to dress a certain way?
Can an no indian be hindu...Hare Krishna aside? What are some basic hindu practices?

 

At the door of my local temple, stand two bouncers - checking that no one gets in without a tie, and no trainers.


Seriously - Hindu practices - pray, offer everything to God, meditate if you can, try to remember the Divine at all times.

 

Perhaps, like Bob Dylan, he's gone beyond that stage.

(give 'all along the watchtower' a spin sometime).