Help me understand (schizophrenia/birth control)

PB,
1) i'm pretty sure i know more shizofrenics than you.

2) Im pretty sure i studied more about shizofrenia than you, i've even been labeled as one by many mother fuckers.

3) As you stated all your "knowledge" comes from books and other people, FOR ONCE try investigating yourself with people and creating a new criteria before speaking for other people that wrote books.

4) You say i say things i "think", instead of things i "know". I invite you to UNDERSTAND how things work before KNOWING and talking from there. And that's where the biggest gap of humanity remains. (referring to knowing and understanding)

5) You speak about mental illnes, as bi-polar disorder, manias, etc etc etc, i've lived with people with this, and for example down syndrome wich personally i think its much "worse" than what you stated, and i can tell they are DIFFERENT and they dont have an ill.

Your problem smith, as the 99.99% of this world is, tht you read a book, or a thousand books and then you think you know. wich is wrong. The point is to UNDERSTAND.

Also, most of what you said is wrong. Totally wrong and i really dont have the time to explain you step by step, and i strongly believe that you will come up with useless crap just to defend your dignity, so i refuse to waste my very valuable time. (also the answers remain in the other 2 posts i've made in this topic)

I'll give you a link of an interview, but i also wanna make something clear: I thought everything was like that before reading it myself. Believe me or not i dont care.

Here's the link: Jhon C. Lilly Interview Anyway i dont think you will understand 1% of it, based on what you posted here, anyways i cant predict your answer as i or any other being has not that privilege.

 

Dude, get your spelling right. It's Schizophrenia. Not Schizofrenia.

 

and yet for all that studying and knowledge you have, you still can't spell schizophrenia correctly.

Lilly is another one like McKenna. A brilliant mind that went way over the deep end with drug usage and lost all credibility and stopped making sense decades ago.

 

schizophrenia is a serious illness. It is proven by science that there is different things in the brain with an non-schizo person and an schizophrenic .and I highly doubt you have the disorder brain! You know why? bc I have a very close friend with it, and she is not functioning well on most days, adn without her meds, she is even more non-functioning. Schizos are more likely to kill themselves than any other mental illness. and I have first hand information about that too, my grandmas's mom and dad both had it and both committed suicide. It is not just oh my gosh I am a little nuts in the head, it affects their entire lives, and it isnt something they can control by themselves. they need help for it. so Please do nto pretend to know anything about it brains! bc you are dead wrong. I am all for alternative treatment, and not takign everything the shrinks say for fact,but schizophrenia is an scientifically proven disease. and it should be treated as such.

 

I apologise for my poor english writing skills as its not my main language.
Lilly is one of the greatest minds of the 20th century, and everything he says makes perfect sense to me, i dont take everything he says literally, many things he says i undestand them "metaphorically". You said "he lost credibility", to whom? That answer of yours disappointed me.

Psychedelic girl, you are indeed wrong in almost everything you said. im very sorry for you, but i cant and should not try to help you, as i cant change humanity, right now more than 90% of humanity thinks like you, and i cant (and dont really want) change the world. Wait a few centuries, or milleniums and this will be as clear as distilled water.
If you love yourself, stop taking any meds that a psychiatrist gives you, and talk to your family, friends, go to the countryside, explore the world, try to learn, and if you fail, and shoot yourself, you will die standing on your own feet.

Remember that a chemical cant save your life. Seriously, do you REALLY think that a molecule can save you? Do you have an idea of how many molecule types and molecule interactions/10x10E-100000 of a µsec (just to give an idea) you have inside your head? Did you know that even for god if "he" existed its impossible to know the position, or speed of a particle? Imagine a whole molecule, did you know that we dont have that possibility?

Well, now, as you say you believe in science, try to calculate the result of the interaction between 2 particles. (i know it seems simple, just try to do it)

Do you really think that we humans, that a couple years ago (like 3-5 generations) believed that some of us where witches and should kill ourselves for that?? i wouldnt belive to that kind of being. We need a lot of time to grow, to learn, to investigate.

Some people think that we live in a 248 Dimensional reality, do you really think that a psychiatrist is aware of that? (it doesnt matter anyway... i know)

Go out, live, learn, build your own thoughts. The important thing, Einstein said, is to never stop questioning things, and this is, imho, one thing to be questioned.

 

Good points.

 

Regarding the claim that molecules can't save your life...try telling that to someone who will certainly die without their medicine or chemical... I'm sure organ transplant recipients or peopple who need oxygen tanks to breathe will disagree.

 

i wasnt talking about that, i think if your smart enough you should've notice about that dont you?

 

How about alzheimers or parkinsons meds? They do the opposite of what several of you Seem to think all psych meds do to people. They delay the progression of the illness and keep the person functioning longer instead of becoming that drooling invalid.

 

Good rule of thumb: if you have an experience that is not completely pleasurable, do not repeat the experience.

I have been with several people who completely lost it during LSD trips - it can do some nasty permanent damage. Tripping is not for everyone.

 

You know i wasnt talking about that either, why ppl insist of taking things out of context, just to make some statement alone invalid??? Stop doing that if you wanna learn about anything... to understand something, you have to understand all of it...

And, i wont argue with you on this one, but did you know that some meds work in some cases (speaking about the kind of nervous system illnes you pointed out) and in some other cases they dont.

If you cant make a rule for every case, then its not a rule, its just like "go, take this shit and see what happens", for example recents discoveries say that heavy use of marijuana reduces the chances of having alzheimer, but you know that society wont easily accept this fact, they prefer to say that marijuana takes you to other drugs, makes you kill people, insane, shizophrenic and who knows what other kind of shit...

The whole medical system (just for you to not take this out of context again, yes im speaking about the psychiatrists), has a very strong cultural basis, leaving little place for new kinds of medicine, like the shamanistic medicine to get the consideration they deserve. I know several people with a very heavy background, for example: rape, abusive domestic violence and other kinds of trauma, that 20 years of psychiatric medicine, and therapy couldnt help, while one year with the shamans "cured" them completely, and not only that, now they are one with the universe, one privilege that a psychiatrist wont ever have because of all the shit they put in their head in school.

Also there are many kinds of new psychiatrists, for example i knew one that used ayahuasca (Yagé) to cure his patients, but he induced them to "die" in their sessions, and he also speaks very bad about lsd, marijuana, ketamine, etc. This person is very very wrong... but, as the majority of the psichiatrists out there, he thinks hes helping people...
And maybe it works in some cases, but whats wrong is to make a rule about a mind behaviour, and to set a limit to the mind, i personally think that what we should do to solve a problem we have, for example a trauma, or w/e is to expand our conciousness, as Einstein said: No problem can be solved by the same level of awareness that created it.

 

i was not intentionally taking anything out of context.

there is no rule for every case (insofar as helping/ curing the person) in modern medicine or shamanic healing. both work sometimes, and both fail sometimes.

 

I totally agree with that, but personally i think (what i learnt in my little stay here on this planet) is that psychiatric medicine/conventional therapy has a much higher chance of making things worse than actually making an improvement on the patient than shamanistic medicine, or other kinds of treatments, for example going out of your house with your friends, talking with your loved ones, exploring the planet, taking illegal drugs, and many other kinds of experiences. Or just doing nothing.

Just to make it clear, im not recomending any of this, if i were to cure a trauma, mind illnes or w/e, i would do what i said in the other post: Fill them with love, care, in a very comfortable place in nature, with very friendly people, i would talk with them, but for them to explain things with their point of view and learn from them, not to influence them or advice them in any particular way other than love for themselves and others. And maybe provide them with tools to expand their conciousness if they want to, and wouldnt ever take away their liberty to walk freely in this world. (clearly very different to the vast majority of the psychiatric institutions of occident, but i know that in the orient they have places like this, or very similar)

 

solid thread guys

 

:iagree: outstanding.

 

Do you even know what you're really trying to say? I think at this point you've found yourself between the reality that schizophrenia is a physical injury to the brain, and the reality that your current worldview vis a vis psychedelics, 2012, etc, make you want to jump on the "schizofreniks are shamans!!11" bandwagon.

Dude. You can do it. Just grow up. Just accept it. It sucks, I know. But there is nothing magical, wonderful, or special about schizophrenia. It is a brain disease, just like Bi-Polar syndrome, just like Epilepsy. It has an epedemiology. It has predictable symptoms. There are ways to treat it. We know some things that can cause it, we know what can make it worse. It's a real thing! "The only and most authoritative conclusion" of the common cold is that it's a virus and we don't have a cure for it, just like schizophrenia. I'm not sure what you want people to be open-minded about, should we also burn incense and talk all deep-like about people sneezing in the winter? It's a cold. It's schizophrenia. You may think you are being open minded but really you are just being daft man. You haven't the foggiest clue about 1% of the MASSIVE MEDICAL LITERATURE that the *entire planet* has accumulated over THOUSANDS OF YEARS about this debilitating disease. So please. Your attitude is good, but in this context, it is sheer folly. If you saw a real schizophrenic person you would feel so stupid about what your position is that it would make you hurt. You would feel guilty for downplaying this neural reality.

It's ok dude. Lots of people are gonna tell you that schizophrenia is western medicine's way of killing off our God-Men, especially people who themselves fucking have schizophrenia.

Every time this stupid, stupid debate comes up, good ol' Gerald comes out and puts a nice tasty foot in the mouths of ignorant "open minded" people.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGnl8dqEoPQ&feature=related"]YouTube- Schizophrenia: Gerald, Part 1

 

^ i could not possibly have said it better myself!

 

Good one again Mr. Writer,
It's sad when something as serious as mental illness is thought to be able to be cured with magical thinking.

 

I'm sorry man, but everything you said is valid. Equally as valid as Mckenna's video. Who am i to judge and conclude the "correct" point of view? Sorry, but i throw all the cards up for questioning.

Why do you think that i'm taking a position and downplaying schizophrenia? First off, i'm not taking a position. Secondly, being open to the possibility that schizophrenia and shamanism are linked is not downplaying it. Quite the opposite. I'm not coming to the conclusion that schizophrenia and shamanism are 100 percent linked. But i'm not shrugging that "ridiculous idea" off of my shoulders.

 

Hell, since i'm so daft and folly as it is, watch the Gerald video at 1:47. Disorganized thinking, loosely connected thoughts, delusional grandiose ideas (2012), mood disturbances, absent mood, inappropriate mood, unusual mannerisms, inexplicable and purposeless behavior. All attributes that i have acquired. I myself must be a textbook case of Schizophrenia! I mean i've taken enough psychedelics as it is. I must be out of my mind. So i'd stop paying attention to me if i were you. My words no longer have relevance, if they ever did. It's a shame i'm going to delve into Shamanism when the time calls for it. For it will only be a deluded chemical misfire in my brain. You know, being Schizophrenic and all. Must be the same with 2012.