does god still love me?

Here's my understanding of the Christian god, using the parent analogy....

I am a father (god) of two young children.
I tell them that they can play with anything in the house but they are not to play with the book of matches that I leave laying on the coffee table in the living room. I tell them I am going to go away for awhile but that I will be back shortly. I leave my two young children in the care of my teenage son who I know is "more crafty than any of the children I have made." I also know that this teenage son has a nasty habit of convincing others to play with matches. When I return I discover that the house is burning and my two young children are trapped inside. Outside, my teenage son is gleefully watching the flames. I stand beside him and watch the house burn while listening to the screams of my two young children. I refuse to go into the house on my own accord and save them. I will stand back and allow them to burn alive unless they first ask me to save them. If they don't ask me to be saved it is entirely their fault that they are being burned alive. I am a wise and merciful father who is allowed to treat his children any way I like because I, after all, created them. Without me they wouldn't be here, now trapped inside a burning house. I am a loving father because I have given my children an escape clause (salvation). Even though I constructed the whole scenario knowing full well the outcome would mean me standing outside watching my children trapped inside a burning house, I was loving enough to give them an escape clause. Of course, this clause only works on the condition that my children ask to be saved. Until they do that, I will stand back and allow them to burn. I will not raise one finger to help them unless I hear them ask. My love knows no bounds.

My question is this: If I behaved in this manner with my own children would I be considered the type of father worthy of love, admiration, and respect? Or might I be looked upon as a sick, cruel, psychopathic, and heartless monster deserving only derision, loathing, disgust, or pity? Would my actions be considered moral or immoral, my underlying intentions kind or malign? Is my offering of a so-called "escape clause" really demonstrating mercy or does it entail something else altogether, something darker, more self-serving, egocentric and selfish? Finally, am I demonstrating unconditional love with this type of behavior or only that when push comes to shove I really don't give a damn about anyone else's feelings but my own?

This is how I see the Christian god... He gives us an escape clause and its up to us to use it or burn. The only difference between Me and god in this scenario is that My children would soon die, and that would be the end of it, with gods plan, the kids (us) burn forever. Nice!:cheers2:

 

Unfortunately, your depiction of the "Christian God" is an accurate one. Fortunately, it is not an accurate depiction of the God of the Bible.

Since the death of the last of Jesus apostles “Christianity” has badly gone “South” turning from of the teachings of the Bible, to apostate teachings borrowed from the False Religion and Philosophies of the world around them.

Thus many have come to condemn the God the Bible for teachings that never even came up into his heart!

 

other than blatent conjecture on your part, you've done nothing to convince us that the "God of the Bible" isn't the Christian god. I agree the Christian god (Jesus) was built upon the Jewish god of the Torah, but the analogy I provided depicts both accurately as described in the Christian Bible, the OT and NT combined.

Please provide support for your conjecture about the "death of the last of Jesus' apostles. Who is the authority of what the bible teaches and why?

 

Sorry, didn't know I had to convince anyone. I was merely stating what I believe to be true, much as you were when you said what you said. I didn't ask you to convince me what you said is true.

The God of the Bible is the Christian God, he's just not the "Christian God" you described. Nor is he the God that most "Christians" say he is.

The analogy you provide is based on the False Religion and Philosophies of the world that the "Christian" apostates have allowed to creep into "Christianity" and you are just mimicking these false teachings.

It's easy to see how anyone with your view of God would find him loathsome and detestable. But having read the Bible, front to back, I just never found the God you speak of.

PS God is not built on the Bible or anything else, he is what he is. If anything everything is built on him.

 

Knock on wood... GOD still loves me and my tree...

 

What you "believe" to be true is irrelevent if you can't at least support your beliefs with some kind of evidence. My analogy above is based on the bible god using the adam and eve story, combined with the Jesus story. His actions are described in the bible in much the same way as my parent analogy. Your version of god has to be based on the bible. Without the bible, you have nothing other than language to evidence any god. There is nothing available to evidence any gods other than holy scriptures.

Denying my analogy doesn't make it so. My analogy is spot on the Christian/bible god. He stands back and does nothing to help us "kids" and even when we ask, many times (I'd argue most) he doesn't help even when asked.

Incorrect, my analogy is based on the bible, not a religion.

Either you're lying or you ignored all the terrble things this god is accredited with. Which is it? Did you forget the part of God destroying 70000 men because David miscounted a census? Did you forget the part that instead of just saying "I forgive you" he needed to sacrifice his only son in order for us to receive forgiveness? Did you forget the part where he killed thousands (millions?) of people in an apparent flood? Yeah Yeah, I know there are morals to these stories, but if they didn't happen, then they are just stories, with morals, like Aesops Fables, if they did happen, he's a prick.

[/quote] If he's not built on the bible, what can you present to show he even exists?

 

Okay let’s take a look at your analogy.

Your first misconception is thinking that Adam and Eve were young children. They were full grown adults with all the thinking and reasoning powers of full grown adults.

Play? Once again, these where full grown adults who had been given the job to turn the earth into a paradise. Being full grown adults if they had been left, as you say, with a book of matches they would have known full well what irresponsible use of them could mean.

First, God did not leave Adam and Eve in the care of anyone, anymore than you would need to leave your grown married son in the care of someone. Second, Satan, the one you call the teenage son, at this time had no record of misleading anyone.

This never happened there was no "burning house" with children trapped inside. God did take immediately action to set things straight.

There is no burning house so the rest of this breaks down unless you somehow believe that the Bible teaches Hellfire and the immortal soul which it does not. As for all this asking to be saved, What it comes down to is we all have free will and a choice to make and God will not force anyone to live in the Paradise he has in store for mankind unless they want to and he’s not asking us to make that decision while in a burning house.

The concepts of Hellfire and immortal soul do not come from the Bible. If you remember it was Satan not god that said; you will not die. But God said; dust you are and to dust you shall return, no concept of living forever in a burning place of torment in that statement.

 

This may or may not be true, but even if it is, you neglect the fact that A&E were not aware of the knowledge of good and evil (right and wrong) yet. Sure they were told not to eat from the tree (play with matches) but as soon as the older brother (serpant) comes along and convinces them they won't die, they, acting like kids without the proper knowledge, play with the matches/eat the fruit.

Again, thats wrong. It can be successfully argued that they didn't have the knowledge prior to eating from the tree, thus they were ignorant of the consequences of disobedience (fire) and ignorant of right from wrong, and had the free will given to them BY DAD, to make the right or wrong decision, without the knowledge of right or wrong (good and evil).

No, God left a stupid talking snake who was crafty with them. Are you that blind to see the analogy?

So?!?

The burning house represents the need for salvation, please, stop obfuscating the issue with technicallities of the analogy. We all (aledgedly) need salvation from then eternal burning hell due to original sin.

THere is a buring house, its called salvation (or the lack of it) Do you or do you not understand the concept of analogies? As for hellfire, are you trying to say the bible DOESN"T teach it? What bible are YOU reading? I said that my analogy was a combination of stories from both old and new testaments, and the salvation offered (asking dad to save them from burning which is what you get if you DON"T ask for salvation under christian doctrine.) The asking dad thing is equivalent to asking Jesus for salvation. If you don't ask or even believe, you aren't getting salvation. If you deny that you aren't talking about christianity.

Again, this analogy DOES represent Christian doctrine, not Jewish. I assumed we are in the Christianity thread so we are talking about CHristian doctrine and the analogy holds. You can't ignore all of the gospels and revelation just because you don't like it, they DO preach hellfire and eternal damnation.

 

Hellfire and the immortality of the soul are found the Bible? I suppose next you’ll say that the Bible also teaches that Jesus was put to death on a cross and that Jesus was born on Dec. 25 and that a big rabbit comes every spring and hides eggs for children to find!

Simple research will show that these ideas actually come from either false religion or Greek philosophy, not the Bible. The book; “The Two Babylons” might be helpful to you.

 

Moses' rules were a little extreme.

"Let's stone (the homosexual) to death. Everyone. The entire city."

God would be okay if just one person threw a pebble at the "perpetrator".

You know that homosexuals are born that way. It has been shown that gay men have more (some kind of) spots, on their hippocampus, as women have more than men.

 

Picas Dixon, as for your question about homosexuality, Itsdarts is correct when he says that (Leviticus 18:22) is one of the scriptures that deal with homosexuality in the Bible and it says;. . .“‘And you must not lie down with a male the same as you lie down with a woman. It is a detestable thing.

But there is also another, (1 Corinthians 6:9-11) That says; What! Do YOU not know that unrighteous persons will not inherit God’s kingdom? Do not be misled. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men kept for unnatural purposes, nor men who lie with men, nor thieves, nor greedy persons, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit God’s kingdom. And yet that is what some of YOU were. But YOU have been washed clean, but YOU have been sanctified, but YOU have been declared righteous in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ and with the spirit of our God.

 

Read the Gospels.

Yes it does.

 

Will it really make any difference if I prove to you that these are false doctrines that are not based on the Bible? These are the very doctrines that you use to hate the Bible and Christianity. Will you give them up so easily?

 

Took The Words Right Out Of My Mouth.

 

Stop playing around. If you have something to support your position, bring it on. I'm more than open to new evidence. But you "just saying so" makes it difficult for me to argue, wouldn't you agree? Support your arguments, but don't ask me to go buy/read a book. I would hope that since our debate all takes place online, that your sources of information would be online as well. What false religions? What religion do you follow? What makes you certain your's is the correct interpretation in light of the fact that thousands of other christian sects think there's is the correct interpretation.

 

If you really want to do this perhaps we should move this dicussion to another thread seeing as this not really on topic for this thread. What do you suggest?

 

That is fine with me. Send me a PM with the title when you've created it.:cheers2:

 

Of course God loves you! He just hates that you have sex as a fornicator, and with another man. You can love them in a platonic way, though, there is no scripture against that. In fact, there are many "romantic friendships" ( see wikipedia ) among men in the Bible. It's just that having sex with another man ( or woman, depending on if you're fornicating or not. Fornication is the sin. ) is considered sinful, yet, according to the Bible, everything else is perfectly fine.

 

why is sex with another man so bad? Maybe the Christian "God" doesn't like it, because this is the same "God" who preaches such fire and brimstone and hate. "God" is omnipitent; God is love and energy and the universe, and God loves all forms of love.

 

I'm pretty sure you just said that there's a reference to the Easter Bunny in the Bible. Kinda hard to take you seriously.