Do you feel that Gods expectations are unrealistic?

Actually it is you that relegate God's Word to a library shelf, Christians see the Bible alive and active in their lives.

 

You are the one that pronounces me at variance, not god. The bible does not speak. You need to learn the difference between animate and inanimate.

I asked you waterbrother, does love hate?

 

By this they shall know you are my disciples, that you love one another. The bible is useful for teaching, that is precisely what it is good for, no more no less. It cannot breath life into you, it cannot redeem you, only your living words can do that through your power of forgiveness. By your words you will be justified and by your words you will be condemned.

You have given me no rest no quarter, no grace, but there is time yet for you to change your mind about your brother. You are still as god created you.
I ask you to find that innocent part of you that remains untouched by time and
use it to bless the world rather than condemn your brother.

 

thedope,

You ask, "does love hate?" a couple times in this thread. My own answer to that is that love DOES hate. Love is not absent from hate because for love to be love it HAS to hate all things that are wrong.

Do you love murder? Pain? Suffering?

"It would be better for him to be thrown into the sea with a millstone tied around his neck than for him to cause one of these little ones to sin" is an example of true love hating what is wrong.

Hating what is wrong is a sign of love.

If a child of yours was bullied, would you love the act of bullying? No, you'd hate it, obviously, otherwise you aren't being honest with your emotions. If you didn't hate it, then how is it possible to act upon it? Knowing it's wrong and hating it are the same thing and knowing it's wrongness allows for action and change. Can't have one without the other without deluding ourselves.

Sometimes condemnation is a way to bless, but sometimes it isn't - ever heard of tough love? There's a time for both.

 

Pronounces? You've got to be kidding, I've made no pronouncements, let alone condemn you. All I've done is show how often you disagree with what the Bible says. But if you want you can wait till God points out your variance but then that's going to be a little late.

What's with all this the Bible does not speak, are you just being dense?

In the English language, any book can be spoken of as speaking to us, let alone the Bible which is alive.

Why, yes you did? Don't you think it's a little silly for you to personify Love as if it could have emotions?

 

Love does not seek it's own bearing all things, believing all things hoping all things. Love does not hate. What wrong, what child of god have you decided does not deserve forgiveness?

Hate spawns murder, not love. Mercy is the response for every heartache. Pain is part of our biological well being. When love is not chosen, there is suffering. Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you. Hate is not part of the bargain.

Hate does not come from love. Hate comes from judgment. You must condemn to justify your unwillingness to forgive. You have the power to redeem yourself and your brother through forgiveness.
This is the miracle of christs love. The only thing that christs love cannot redeem is what you have withheld from it.

A predictable reaction and a concern for those who would assault innocence in any form. This is not demonstration of hate, it is giving and receiving.

Hating what is wrong is a sign of judgment. How many times should you forgive a man, 7 times, no seventy times seven. Jesus healed the sick, he did not condemn them. I am certain you yourself have felt the effects of someone hating what they feel is wrong with you. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.
Every gift of love is maximal and contributes to gods plan of redemption through forgiveness. Every moment of hate, born of judgment, is an active attack on gods plan for salvation.

I forgive as my father has instructed, I tend to wounds. I am not led to temptation but am delivered from evil.

I need loose nothing as gods grace precedes me. You are young and inexperienced, but if you would like to come and bully my children to see how I would handle it, you are welcome to try, but I don't think that will be happening.

I have heard many bad ideas. You cannot serve two masters, either your brother is more or less worthy of love, mammon, or he is as god created him and worthy of your love.

 

How about that, you do read the Bible from time to time.

Really? But not only teaching but is also beneficial for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness, that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work.

Life is in the hands of God and his son Jesus and can not be earned through works.

You like this Scripture don't you? But please remember it can be a two edged sword that applies not only to the one you are trying to chastise but also to you.

I'm sorry you feel this way. Personally I think you are a good person but are being seriously mislead.

Again with this condemning stuff? It's not coming from me, it seems that this feeling is coming from you.

 

You continue to make the false assumption that if we do as God says we must hate someone, when that is not what Gods says. God says hate what is bad not who is bad. We are to hate what is bad and what is evil. Evil is not a child of God.

 

Why must I be kidding, yes pronouncements, exactly so.

God is my judge, he is my source, his word has breathed life into me. You do not define my choices for me. The bible does not speak, it does not interpret itself.

Well there you go. the bible is inanimate. You are seriously deluded.

Does love hate? You know the answer to this. Are you afraid to speak the truth?

 

No, you are attempting to find me guilty, I am not making false assumptions. I am speaking as taught by the holy spirit.
If you see evil you do not see the world as got created it but see what your judgments have made of it. I tell you hate does not spring from love. Hate springs from judgment. Why is it you can speak so vociferously of hate in the same breath with love and not mention once, the word forgiveness. Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.

 

Which belies your statement that I ignore the bible.

All of those are lessons and I am not without the lessons of the bible nor of the holy spirit

Who said anything about earning anything. the measure you give is the measure you receive. I desire mercy not sacrifice go and learn what this means. Faith without works is dead.

I am condemned for what, telling you you remain ever as god created you, holy in creation. That hate does not come from love but from judgment. That you are without sin unless you choose it for yourself by denying the blessings of the holy spirit. I love only god and my brothers in creation. My affections are not divided between love and hate.

In what way?

 

To jmt question.

Gods will is you be happy and have abundant life abundantly. It is the same will you have for yourself. Your will and gods will are the same will. God allows whatever you desire but your brother may not agree with your choices and it is him that you may have unbalanced accounts with, and him you need to get along with.

Creation is extension, a law without opposite. God is not waiting for something in return.

 

Love does not seek it's own, definitely, but what does this have to do with what I said? For us to bear all things means there is something for us to bear. No?

Also, when did I ever say a child of god does not deserve forgiveness?

How does hate for murder spawn murder? Does that even make sense? That's the only hate I talked about. It's the hate for murder and the fear to do wrong that prevents wrong.

Romans 12:9
"Hate what is evil; cling to what is good."

Same as above. I am only talking about a hatred for the wrong deeds done in the world. Yes, forgiveness is very powerful and does have the ability to redeem, but to be redeemed requires something in return. We can't make better what's not admitted. Hatred is an expression of admittance which leads to guilt and guilt leads to repentance.

To JMT:

If you think about it, this goes along with your original question. Is what God asking from us really too much? Yeah, it's hard, but are these difficulties in vain? What exactly is it that God is asking and what would the alternative be for not doing what is asked?

There is life and there is death. In life, there is action, in action there is consequence. Somewhere between action and consequence there is time to decide where we stand. Should the action be repeated? Is the action worth the consequence?

In death there is no action, so we decide to act or we don't while alive. If death is non-action then life with non-action is already dead. What I am getting at is that decision making is a part of life and a life with no decision making is contrary to life. Because of that, we can't avoid issues of morality and the like in life so a decision is to be made.

Where we stand with the whole God thing is up to everyone to decide for themselves.

 

None of those items are hate. To bear all things does not speak to the quality of things.

Ever hear of capital punishment? Revenge?

No it is the love for god and your brother that "prevents wrong" Do not let your right hand know what your left is doing.

Judgment is the only author of guilt and the only judgment that sets gods son free from sin is not guilty.
Repentance is reorienting the senses to seek god and his kingdom above all things because that is the way to freedom. Repentance is not for the assumption of guilt. Forgiveness is the only appropriate response to any perception of guilt. This is what it means to go and sin no more.
You were created to create the good not to corral evil. Lead us not into temptation but deliver us from evil.

 

They are hate. What else is it? Really really dislikeament? :sunny:

Depends whether or not you think capital punishment is murder. Some even believe that it is a good deterrent for murder. If we didn't hate crime, there would be no police officers.

as for revenge, well imo that would be an instance of murder. If they truly hated murder, it would be contradictory for them to murder in return.

In order to recognize what to love there needs to be an acknowledgment with what to hate. We love our children but we do not love our children to be bullied because bullying contradicts love. That doesn't mean we hate the bully. We demonstrate agape to the bully by teaching them the right thing to do is to not bully and find the cause for the bullying.

 

What makes Jesus not guilty is due to him never committing a sin.

Exactly what I am talking about. Hating what is evil takes reorientation.

Repentance can only happen when there is acceptance of blame. If an alcoholic is in denial of their alcoholism, how in the world can they ever make things better for themselves?

If someone is sincere with what they want to change, then not forgiving is merciless.

 

Friend this is not so. Love does not require hate to be what it is, however where hate is love is not.

 

Who really knows God may have only given us one life and people should live their own life . the only thing I'm saying is that you cant change the nature of any animal -I'm not trying to judge anyone

 

What makes the son of god not guilty is that he was created by god and judged good.

Consider the meaning of the lords prayer, lead us not into temptation but deliver us from evil. It is not our purpose to identify sin but to seek the kingdom of god.

Actually no. Repentance is for accessing the kingdom of god for orienting the pentacle of the senses toward seeking only god. Repentance is not for accepting blame.

Repent for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. Not take on guilt because the kingdom of heaven is at hand. It means heaven is within your grasp if you choose it. Jesus did not say confess your sins. He said let he who is blameless cast the first stone.

It is this structural hypocrisy in the mind of christians that rouses the communities ire. People are simply judged viciously for the sake of upholding goodness. The knowledge of good and evil is not knowledge, it is perception based on arbitrary evaluation. Judge not.

If someone is sincere with what they want to change, then not forgiving is merciless].[/QUOTE

 

I herd a hindi story about about a scorpion and a frog. Once along time ago in india there was a flood and the river basin grew. A scorpion asked a frog: "would you let me ride on your back across the river?" and the frog said "No you will sting me" and the scorpion said "I promise I will not" so the frog agreed ant the scorpion jumped onto the frogs back, when the frog reached the other bank the scorpion immediatley stung the frog ,and th frog said "but..you promised me.. that you wouldn't sting me" and the scorpion said " but it's my nature".