Democracy in Iran

I'm not trying to prove anything. I just don't see any evidence it was rigged.

 

Then why say

When, half of the polls suggested he was going to lose?


Evidence, if you had the 40 million paper ballots at your feet, you would still say the same thing.

How does Iran count 40 million paper ballots in under 12 hours, by hand? btw thats 55,555 per minute/925 per second.
Do YOU have any evidence they have those capabilities?

 

With many hands I would imagine, but that is a bit fast I suppose.

 

come on why we are still arguing with him ? it's pointless, he may not be a supporter of iran but surely he is a fanatical hater of the western world. his biases are blatant, and there's no way to change the mind of this kind of people. after all if there is room in the world for these morons and this bunch of idiots we can also cope with the lawyer of the ayatollahs.

 

Don't put fucking words into my mouth mate, I donot fanatically hate the west, idiot!

 

if you insist in ignoring evil where it clearly is and try to make it appear elsewhere then tell me under what name this behavior goes. or better, forget it 'cause as i said before and i am not going to repeat myself again, the debate ends here ---> .

 

Oh right, so because I don't agree with you you just resort to name calling and that's the end of it? Very mature.

 

You know, I never really technically said that I believed the election was totally above board, not have I spoken anything in support of Ahmedinejad, I simply said I saw no evidence of foul play and had every reason to suspect that the west was intent on spreading lies and propaganda, something that the west has a very long history of I might add.

I suppose you might say I was playing devil's advocate here.

I started another thread with an article by George Galloway who highlighted the hypocrisy of the west in these situation. All I was trying to do in that thread was offer a different perspective, from the mind of a man who tends to think more freely and radically, and with a damned sight more respect for muslim culture than most people have.

I would like to say that although I have a great amount of respect for him, that is not to say I agree with him on everything, namely his stance on drugs. But he put his job on the line to try and stop the UK from taking part in the invasion of Iraq, and when the UN was killing thousands of Iraqi children with sanctions, he visited the country and made an effort to help the people of Iraq, peacefully, by negotiating with Saddam Hussein, as opposed to waging an expensive and genocidal war to capture him and then publically executing him on television!

Is this the kind of example the west would like to set in the fight against evil, genocidal dictators?

Saddam may have the blood of thousands on his hands, but he WAS co-operating with the weapons inspectors, and oh look, where are the fucking WMD's?

If there were any at all they have without a doubt crossed a border somewhere, which begs the question, what greater cause were thousands of Iraqis killed for?

All for standing up against this kind of hegemonic bullshit, Galloway is accused of all forms of corruption under the sun, anything the oligarchs can dream up. Can you see a pattern emerging? None of the countless allegations that have been made against him have any substance, and he even flew to America to clear his name of the allegations that he was taking bribes from Iraq several years ago. He stood up and showed the world that these allegations were unfounded, and if there was any truth in them, woudn't it have been uncovered there?

To say he is a terrorist sympathiser is really all down to your definition of terrorism. If terrorism is as has been said the indiscriminate slaughter of innocent people, then both sides in this west vs. Islam war are terrorists.

He is not selling weapons to Hamas, or Hizbollah, but we are still selling weapons to Isreal.

 

Are you implying Hamas and Hezbollah don't have weapons?
Our do you just not care about who is supplying them?

As long as it's not the west, who cares, right?

Hundreds of thousands.

So he can ONLY be terrorist if the west is too?

 

Not quite the point I was trying to make.

Why are Hizbollah and Hamas attacking Isreal? Could it be because they are occupying their land?

Do you tihnk they just like blowing buses up for fun? Or are they perhaps fighting for their homes and their livelihoods against an evil oppressor?

The Isreali forces are out of fucking control! Whatever Hamas or Hizbollah have done to them is nothing compared to what Isreal has done. I'm not saying it is right, but you know talking to them peacefully is still way better than driving tanks through their houses, or shooting children at point blank range, if that can be done without anyone accusing you of being a terrorist sympathiser.

Again, not what I am saying.

 

Thanks for holding down the fort in my absence against the policemen of the world, MLG.

You got to laugh about a guy who says half the opinion polls indicated the west-backed candidate was going to win, therefore the elections were rigged.

And what if it was rigged? Would the same guys allow Iran to intervene in Florida in 2000? What are you guys suggesting should be done, exactly? Nuke them?

 

Let me put it this way. Israel ended the occupation of Gaza, torn down all their settlements, and left. Hamas (which explicitly calls for the destruction of Israel in their charter) was then elected and used their new found freedom to fire rockets at Israeli civilians from this newly unoccupied territory.

Israel ended the occupation of Lebanon. Hizbollah, which is an unelected private iran financed militia, decides one day to cross the border and attack and kill some Israelis in parts of Israel that are not part of any Hizbollah territory claim.

In both cases, by ending the occupation, Israel was rewarded by rocket attacks on its civilians.

They seem to enjoy it.

 

Finally, someone with half an ounce of sense on this issue!

I mean it's not likely that the west could be waging a propaganda war against the Iranian government, no no that's just not our style...

I'm sure there was some foul play here, but as you quite rightly state Cherea, we are in no fucking position to judge them.

It's perfectly OK for governments to be corrupt, so long as they kowtow to our own corrupt system, but then I'm a "fanatical west hater" so I'm bound to say things like that.

 

That's deep... 'they probably cheated, but how can we judge them? We're from the west, born guilty.

 

Ganja Cloud LOL I've got a new nickname

How would you feel about being shoved into a small part of your homeland and told you are not allowed to cross the border? Would you sit back and take it?

I fucking wouldn't, that is for sure!

How many Isrealis have been killed compared to Lebanese and Palestinians?

 

Mind your own business and you won't be. There is such a thing as being just as/no less guilty as another, you know. Nobody's is putting a gun to your head saying you absolutely need to view the world in some neat black and white hierarchical diagram. Nobody is putting a gun to your head saying you got the responsibility of solving all of the world's problems.

 

1.5 million Germans civilians were killed in WW II. The US and UK together lost only 70,000. So I guess that makes the US and UK guilty and Germany the victim? Or at least if I apply you western hating 'logic'.

Perhaps the lesson for Palestinians should be that terrorism isn't working out so well for them as a strategy?

 

Wouldn't make me murder someone's children with an axe. How about you?

 

Yes, how can we judge them. We are hardly a bastion of peace and democracy ourselves.

OK, so our government was elected fair and square, there was no cheating during the last election, or the one before that, or the one before that.

No, the cheating and lying started as soon as the bastards took up office, and it has continued ever since these right wing totalitarian cunts came into power!

We flaunt UN resolutions, attack foreign nations unprovoked, we sell weapons to countries in Africa where women and children are raped on a daily basis, where children have their hands cut off so they cannot vote, we rob the tax payer of billions and spend on on fucking nuclear war heads, we allow companies to exploit third world slavery, the list goes on.

Iran might not be perfect, but make no mistake about it mate, we are in NO position to judge.

 

Oh yeah, I'd want to murder the children of my oppressor, because I'm a fanatic.

No mate, don't be implying shit like that about me OK, I would probably be prepared to fight for my country if it came to it, but no mate, blowing up children is not right, donot ever suggest that about me!