Astral plane

Discussion in 'Psychic' started by bluesafire, Feb 6, 2009.

  1. lostminty

    lostminty Member

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  2. zengizmo

    zengizmo Ignorant Slut HipForums Supporter

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    I've read some of Frankel's work...while experiencing concentration camp lite, in the midst of the modern American "civilization." It can happen to anyone, anywhere, any time - it all depends on the spirits, and what they choose to teach us.
     
  3. bluesafire

    bluesafire Senior Member

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    People don't like to face their pain, fear, darkness, or whatever may remind them of their vulnerability. They identify themselves with an image of strength, creativity, productivity, and happiness. But life isn't comprised of just one season. It isn't just about growth. As spring gives way to summer, then to autumn, and then to winter, we must embrace the cycles of life in which we begin to diminish and then die. Loss is a natural part of existence, and so is the pain of loss. But that kind of pain is clean... it is grieving without resistance. It is the energetic form of letting go.

    Legitimate suffering begins with acknowledgment of pain, followed by the willingness to experience it. Denial and repression sends it into the subconscious realms where it becomes our shadow and wreaks havoc on our inner and outer life experience. This is what is at the heart of mental illness and insanity... and not just what is defined by the DSM-IV. Those are just the extreme manifestation, but most of us have the same distortions, just in less obvious forms.

    When emotions have been denied and repressed then legitimate suffering also involves allowing those emotions, those deeply hidden elements, to surface and be dealt with. We must embrace the shadow without allowing the fear to eclipse the light of our awareness. We must suffer consciously.

    One thing I've noticed from personal experience is that the IDEA of suffering is much worse than the experience itself. When faced fully what is actually there, interestingly enough, is physical sensation coupled with a jumble of story surrounding a particular life event. The story is all the mental noise, all the stuff we tell ourselves and believe about what is going on, all the conditioned mind patterns that we think go along (or should go along) with a particular experience. Without the story the physical manifestations are very tolerable.

    I've gone very deeply into myself in regard to suffering. I have faced it without resistance. There have been times that it felt like it broke me open. It forced me to my knees in complete surrender. And what's so amazing is that the moment I thought was my darkest showed a different face. There was incredible peace in the midst of it... the peace that passeth all understanding. :) And afterward I was always left more open, more vulnerable, more compassionate, more present.

    Throughout my life there have been wave upon wave of facing the pain and shadows, which have brought the opportunity to suffer consciously. Not too terribly long ago, in fact, I had another such opportunity. I was distraught, crying hard and in much pain (always attentive though, as I've learned to be) when suddenly it dawned on me... the light just broke through and flooded my mind and heart. THIS IS IT, I thought. This moment is perfect. Right here, right now, just as it is. It is no better or worse than any other moment, it is no different actually. This experience is absolutely and completely FULL. It is... LIFE ITSELF. Of course words don't really capture the joy I felt at this discovery or the fullness of the revelation. But in that instant the pain of my experienced vanished as if it had never been at all. And I was light and free.

    That is what it means to suffer consciously... and to know sanity.
     
  4. Cherea

    Cherea Senior Member

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    Right. :) But mariecstacy made me think of the role of self-encouragement in my life. I used to think that self-encouraging thoughts were escapist and delusional. I felt thoughts such as "I'm ok" or "I am loved" or "I'm gonna do this!" or "I'm a good guy" when I found myself in the bind of self-doubt should be rejected:

    1) because sometimes "positive thinking" gives me anxiety about outcome

    2) because there is really no way I can know whether they are true or not (it's sort of an attachment to scepticism, which turns out was an attachment to pessimism)

    BUT, I'm starting to realize that although positive reinforcement can lead to denial, inability to acknowledge challenges, and face pain, etc. (imagine a self-congratulating braggart) It is not their veracity that matters. I think not taking heed of optimistic thoughts have sent me into a self-doubting, pessimistic spiral which is the flipside of suppressing pain.

    I think I may be arriving at a new happiness in my life. It is sort of unconditional and a feeling that, no matter what: I'm ok.
     
  5. bluesafire

    bluesafire Senior Member

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    I think the whole positive thinking movement has some big flaws. I mean, on the one hand perhaps it's a necessary and a helpful stepping stone for some people so I don't want to cast it as completely useless. But what I find more often than not is that people use that way of being to avoid and deny their shadow and any emotions which don't fit the "positive" framework. They want to have the happy summer season type of existence always. And that's just not the reality of life. Now if/when people take note of whatever they're feeling and don't deny and suppress it but are able to see that they don't have to indulge a negative perspective then "positive" can be more constructive and helpful.

    But really, positive... negative... they're just both sides of the same coin called duality. Personally I've discovered that when I allow WHAT IS to be AS IT IS then I can see it with fresh eyes without judgment. Then if there's something "negative" that is felt or experienced I can look at it and question the thoughts that I may be buying into that would give rise to negativity. Same thing with something "positive". I've learned to distinguish the surface type of positive emotions, you know like when we get all happy and excited to win a prize, or score a big date, or get the job we want, etc. I mean there's nothing WRONG with that buzz of excitement... it's just that if we get attached to that feeling then we can't handle when it changes into something else... which it definitely will. Surface emotions are very changeable, like passing clouds. Some white, some grey, some black and rain tears.

    What I've learned is that when I see the transient nature of those kinds of emotions then I can look beyond them and dwell in the deeper peace that is abiding. Then I don't have to "try" to be positive or anything like that. The joy and peace of being becomes natural and un-efforted. I find that it's easiest to feel joy when we remove or see past the blocks to joy, rather than try to add happiness on top of grief, sadness, and unhappiness. Like throwing flowers on top of a landfill... the stench will surface eventually.
     
  6. mariecstasy

    mariecstasy Enchanted

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    I don't think its about thinking positive or negatively...but allowing oneself to get out of the process of negative thinking. It is only when we are able to unattach from the thinking that has held us down, do we allow ourselves to get out of the shadows. Generally our thinking process is nothing more than a monologue on repeat. There is a dwelling on things that have been said to us, things that have hurt us. For me, its being able to come to grips with those thoughts, that aren't even my own, and to stand up and define me....according to who I am and who I want to be....not any of the shit given to me in the past. It's disintegrating those voices that no longer assist me but hold me back from my own fulfillment.

    Life is meant to be lived. This includes all emotions. It requires moving through all the fear, hurt, anger to get to the place where we are able to say "whew, I am going to be ok." Because when we really move through those negative emotions, their power begins to lose hold. Believe me... it is a lot of mother freaking work. But in the end, we get to integrate. Our angels embrace our demons and we accept all aspects of ourselves. We are all. We are male. We are female. We are flawed. We are perfect. I am that I am. I am!
     
  7. Cherea

    Cherea Senior Member

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    Yeah, the encouragement that I'm feeling is not the same as happy excitement over "getting something", or a cover for emotional distress. Quite the contrary, I'm feeling it in spite of great distress at the moment. It's not, "I'm gonna be ok" so much as it is, "I'm ok." (now, unconditionally.) It's a will to happiness almost. I've been practicing feeling comfortable with distress. Like a newborn. When it's time to cry, I cry. When it's time to be laugh, I laugh. But none of it invalidates the life process.
     
  8. mariecstasy

    mariecstasy Enchanted

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    (((cherea)))
    Your posts bring me joy. I am happy for you.
     
  9. Cherea

    Cherea Senior Member

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    Muah!
     
  10. mariecstasy

    mariecstasy Enchanted

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    Right back at ya.

    And blue, I feel the same reading your words. You are clear. I had to crack up laughing the other day at you being called a wordy biatch. I suppose you guys have lots of fun together.
     
  11. bluesafire

    bluesafire Senior Member

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    thank you dear *hugs* :)

    oh yeah! we do. :D
     
  12. mariecstasy

    mariecstasy Enchanted

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    I tell mine that he rambles too much. Oh dear god, he can go on and on for so long, changing from one topic to the next. I think it was too much LSD back in the day;)
     
  13. bluesafire

    bluesafire Senior Member

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    Going off on a tangent a bit here, but I wanted to share something I came across a few days ago. I was sitting at a cafe/bakery when I noticed a book of poetry and when flipping it open came across this. It really stood out for me so I wrote it down (one of those synchronous moments).

    From Bird Parliament by Omar Khayyam

    Such is when reacht the Table Land of One
    And Wonder: blazing with so fierce a Sun
    of Unity that blinds while it reveals
    The Universe that to a Point congeals,
    So, stunn'd with utter Revelation, reels
    The Pilgrim, when that Double-seeming House,
    Against whose Beams he long had chafed his Brows,
    Crumbles and Cracks before that Sea, whose near
    And nearer Voice now overwhelms his Ear.
    Till blinded, deafen'd, madden'd, drunk with doubt
    Of all within Himself as all without,
    Nay, whether a Without there be, or not,-
    Ev'n so shall the bewilder'd Pilgrim seem
    When nearest waking deepliest in Dream,
    And darkest next to Dawn; and lost what had
    When All is found: and just when sane quite Mad-
    As one that having found the Key once more
    Returns and Lo! he cannot find the Door
    He stumbles over- So the Pilgrim stands
    A moment on the Threshold- with raised Hands
    Calls to the eternal Saki for one Draught
    Of Light from the One Essence: which when quaff'd,
    He plunges headlong in: and all is well
    With him who never more returns to tell.
     
  14. liquidlight

    liquidlight Senior Member

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    I'm pleased to read all that everyone has said ... and you all seem to be pretty mutch of the same understanding ... beyond the up's and downs, and "I'm ok" seems to sum it up fairly nicely. It's nice to see everyone's 'ok' and so am I. :)

    Speaking of 'OK' ... a had a nice dream a few months ago .... I was walking along a path and i heard a woman talking quietly to me and about 20 yards behind me yet i could hear her loudly ...she was slowly catching up with me, not in a hurry, and i stopped to wait for her. She was pretty ... blonde curls and a short, floral summer dress and an air of ease about her. I asked her name and she said she was called 'OK'.
    She said it was nice to meet someone with some spiritual presence and she said she had loads of spiritual presence (which i thought was a wee bit arrogant but nevermind), and we just walked off down the path together.

    So i was indeed feeling particularly ok at the time of the dream and still am really. Being ok ... for me, feels like just being at peace with things really ... a kind of peace of mind. Rolling with the changes and a sense of balance. I like feeling ok :)

    And thanks blues for the wordy explaination :D Heck, the first paragraph would have sufficed!
     
  15. mariecstasy

    mariecstasy Enchanted

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    What a cool dream:) Very easy to understand too. At least I can put my own interpretation on it.

    Have you read A Course in Miracles?
     
  16. bluesafire

    bluesafire Senior Member

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    Feeling OK has now taken on a whole new meaning. :cool:


    :toetap05:
     
  17. liquidlight

    liquidlight Senior Member

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    Yeah waking from that dream was like ... Ah! life is good. I'd like to hear your interpretation!

    I've read the 'Introduction to A Course in Miracles' and i liked it but i'm not overly keen on the christian style terminology used. There's some really great stuff in there though. Have you read it mariecstasy?

    What a perverted mind you have! Hehe
    :p
     
  18. bluesafire

    bluesafire Senior Member

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    I've read it several times. It's fantastic!... for some.



    tis true. :D
     
  19. Cherea

    Cherea Senior Member

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    Don't even get me started about pretty women. I'm bitter again. :( What a bunch of two-faced cunts. But I highjack....
     
  20. mariecstasy

    mariecstasy Enchanted

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    I have not completed it. I even went to a class for a bit of time with some people at Unity Church. The terminology got me too. I really enjoyed quite a bit of what I read but damn, it was difficult too. Definately not a fast read. I do like to open it here and then just to see what message is for me that day.

    Oh there isn't really much to the interpretation except an acceptance.
     
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