a question for christians

It's on the same page that explains how you become a saint and why you need a priest to confess.

 

Even as a Christian I can get behind that. They are meaningless in the sense that they happened independent of a creator, but we can learn from them just the same, if nothing else, then about ourselves...
It's so sad how so many people are afraid of standing on their own two feet.
At the very most, I pray for guidance. I don't beg for things to go my way.

 

That is more realistic.

 

Pain serves a purpose and so even in a perfect world “because time and unforeseen occurrence befall them all”, we would experience some pain in order for us not to further injure ourselves.

That having been said the amount of pain and suffering that we endure are not part of God’s “plan” for us.

If Adam and Eve had not used their free will to disobey God we would not be experiencing the amount of pain and suffering that we have today.

A perusal of their story in Genesis shows that at that time, Satan made the accusation that God was withholding good things from Adam and Eve, so by eating of the fruit they were telling God they could better decide what is good and bad than God.

So in order for the matter to be proved, one way or another, God has allowed Satan and mankind time to try show they can do a better job of things than God. Since then God has allowed Satan and mankind more or less a free hand in running the Earth, with the exception of destroying the Earth and eliminating his worshipers from the Earth.

So after some 6000 years mankind is on the edge of extinction and people wondering why God is allowing so much pain and suffering, well seems like the matter is pretty close to being resolved and God will soon step in and prevent the extinction of mankind and the Earth will be turned to the paradise he had originally purposed it to be.

 

Saint (capital S), as defined by the Catholic and Orthodox Churches are people who are in Heaven. These people are seen as alive in Heaven, and so can be petitioned (asked, or prayed to) to pray before the Heavenly High Altar of God for us.

A more undiscriminating term saint (lowercase S) is used a number of times throughout New Testament Scripture to describe faithful Christians.

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James 5:15-16 "Confess your sins to one another". I only know of a couple Churches that practice this: Catholic and Orthodox.

Matthew 18:18 The apostles are given the power to bind and loose [sins] on Earth, and the binding and loosing [of sins] will be in Heaven as well.

 

I'm sorry, but you did answer your own question. It's part of his plan. But since your looking for something else, it's also a way to test our faith to him. And for the non/anti christians, a way to say "HEY! THIS IS GOD HERE! HERE'S A SLAP IN THE FACE TO MAYBE KNOCK SOME SENSE INTO YOU! COME TO CHURCH!"

 

Without pain you wouldnt know pleasure. If you didn't have pain pleasure would just be another "thing" and you woudn't enjoy it cause you have felt anything else or been deprived of it.
Like when my computer breaks and i dont have access to the internet for weeks and weeks. When i get it back its absolutely amazing and i love it. When i have it for a long time it becomes and expectation and i dont enjoy it as much as i use to.

Of course this also contradicts heaven since the bible claims there is no pain there.

 

Well thats the average dumbed down response of a christian. I have no respect for your beliefs because you actually think church is necessary. Dont let other preach to you what god is or isn't. Find your own definition of god.

 

Its just pain and suffering in this life. What would be the point if everyone was healthy and wealthy ? You don't get this life so you could be careless and carefree. Some people are happy when they're suffering because they know its not eternal and they know they'll be rewarded for everything.
I've personally felt closest to God when I was suffering and had problems. Its just one life, which is nothing compared to the eternity.
Also, have you seen how many people forget God when they're 100% happy ?
I think God 'talks' through testing us and tempting us.
And I know that this whole salvation through pain sounds unfair, but pain helps people put things into perspective.

 

Sorry, guys but you're being hoodwinked.

Yes, there is a reason for pain but it's not because we can't experience pleasure without it. Pleasure exists without pain, just as pain exists without pleasure.

It a little like saying that if you break your leg you won't feel pain unless you felt pleasure first. Sorry, if you break your leg, you're going to feel pain regardless of how much pleasure you've felt in your life.

 

Personally, I think that it is a mistake to see purpose in suffering and pain.

Everyone should be wealthy, healthy and prosperous. It is senseless to see purpose in suffering and poverty. And when I say wealthy, I mostly mean thriving, not necessarily being ordained with jewels and having 12 toilets in the house.

We can be comforted in a time of suffering, but that suffering in of itself is meaningless and should be avoided whenever possible. It may be useful to discover meaning during a time of suffering in order to shield oneself from the suffering, but beyond that, suffering is absolutely needless.

Just like how we cannot have matter without void, we cannot have pleasure without pain being in the background. In other words, pain is never necessary but it is there to give us a contrast.

Other than contrast, it has purpose in the survival sense. If we are being injured and we do not feel pain, most likely we will not try to stop what's causing the injury, so pain is there to help keep us alive.

With that said, suffering may be unavoidable and from that we may learn something about ourselves and others and God. So it shows, no matter which direction we head towards, as long as we take on the right attitude, we can come out of it gaining something we did not have before we went into the journey. Perhaps that is what is meant when it is said that God comforts us through our troubles.

Like it has been said before, suffering is not a part of God's plan. Rather, it's the plans of men misusing their free will that brings suffering on those that do not deserve it.

 

Bottom line is..... You really have no choice.

There's a love in your life right? Do you love everything about this person?

God never said you get to understand. He said that you WILL understand. After the judgment.

He tells us that we have to do this and that. The only alternative is to trust the other guy. The one who's really bringing the pain.

There isn't any middle ground here. Just two teams. God or satan. Each one of these teams have many different crews but they're all working for two teams.

All we really have to do is make a choice and follow the rules of that team when we do.


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For this argument to have legs, it must assume the the pain and suffering comes from God. Which it doesn't. Don't blame God, or Buddha, or a metorite out in the middle of the desert, for mans machinations.

He didn't plan on all the pain and suffering. We took it that way.

He's just trying to clean up the mess now. Weed out the duff, so to speak. And get it right again.


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Do you really think He's cleaning it up for us? I think He's waiting for us to get on that... Otherwise, how will we learn?

 

Yes, I agree. But he's giving us every opportunity to accomplish this.


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One day, you lived in a forest with me. You cannot remember this, but you did. We were both children then.

Your father ate the apple he was told not to eat. There was a disagreement. People chose sides. The wrong side. And the only way for them to learn is to see how lost they are without my father. This is the only way to settle the disagreement.

The children left the true father for the false one. He is waiting for them to return to him, but still, even now with all this pain and suffering they say "why does your father let this happen?" But he is not doing any of this. It is your father who is letting this happen.

When all you have to do is leave your father. Leave your mother. Leave your sister. Leave yourself, and everything you hold false to the claim of love. Follow the spirit, the mother, that lives inside you. Seek no girlfriend, seek no other mother, seek no other love than your own, so that you can speak no other love than your own. Then you will know Christ. Christ will come to you, and you will come to him. He will speak to the true father on your behalf, and you will never know suffering again.

But so long as another suffers in the world, you also will know suffering. That is why it was said "love your enemy", so that they should not suffer, and thus bring suffering to you. But this is not done. So why do you point blame at God when you live in the school of satan? The only way out of this school, is to put blame on yourself, as I also put blame on myself. Only when each and every person blames themselves for another's wrong, can God see that you are ready to enter the new school of eternal life.

Instead you want to be God now. Have him glorify you in luxury and security, have perfection, without being perfect, without knowing perfection.
He has said to you "My son, even though you wish to be like me, and know good and evil, I will let you, but know that it will involve death (of soul)".
And you have gone down that path. You learn, you fail, you suffer, you die, and are reborn again and again into a new soul with the same spirit. That is a gift he gave you, so one day you will learn to live in spirit as much as soul. You will be like God. But one cannot behold the powers of God, and think evil, what would become of us?

This is your road, your journey. There is not one word, or one spell that God can cast to suddenly make you as perfect as he is. This is the journey, NOW.
So blame yourself, cast away your prisons that bring suffering. Do not worship money. Do not worship food. Until you have done all this, you cannot even begin to wonder at the beauty of God, of life, of perfection.

 

That's a nice thought.