a new revolution.

ideas for a revolution ? global effort for cutting off overpopulation. this of course involves burning down the Vatican while the Pope is in, that's a good start for a revolution. Redesigning society teaching everybody that there is no worser crime than selfishness. Allowing people to live and go to work without a car without becoming outcasts. Considering consumerism as a capital crime. Keep private hands off the industry: what to produce and how much is a political choice and must be decided rationally and democratically according to the needs or else we shall end up with a pile of waste, a few super rich people, everybody else in deep shit and no environment. Water can't be private property or administered by private people because businessmen are thieves. Effective Right for everybody to have shelter and work. Devoting the whole world effort in finding efficient cheap ways to make power from sunlight. Nokia corp is doing that with nanotube technology and nobody gives a damn about that while it is a crucial issue for us to survive as a species and this is not work for a corporation, it should be the goal of all nations.
now we only have to find a way to do all this and we are done. easy, huh? most folks around wont move one finger until they aren't starving or see people being rifled in the streets on a regular basis and fear to be the next ones. so sit down , relax and enjoy your cruise on the titanic. the earth won't miss us.

sorry now i have to go shoot myself in the head.

 

Maybe we should all massively swear off electricity. we made it without, we can now.
And fuck internet, who needs it anyway? When we can have real contact with people face to face. we can find another way of quick communication.
furthermore, lets just live all together in small communes wich are interconnected and use herbs for medication.
Yeah I have crazy ideas, but i believe

 

okay. maybe ill start this thread back up one day when there are people who are willing to actually just help me brainstorm ideas, instead of just shoot me down.
(sorry slight moment of weakness)

ahh REVOLUTION!!!

 

A critical post can also be ment to be of help, dude.

 

Contrary to popular opinion (especially the opinions on this site), the real reason that so few revolutionary changes happen has less to do with political corruption (though there is certainly plenty on that), and more to do with the fact that nobody can agree-- this is especially difficult when everything is so stable and everyone is so comfortable. IN a priviliged society like ours, the luxury of disagreement is highly pronounced-- and given that things are so good (at least, superficially), you will need to have a damn good reason to want to change things-- something that reaches out and touches people. However given how sensationalized everything already is, and how (relatively) easy it is for people to accept things like war, poverty, famine, suffering, disaster, and armageddon, it's going to be extremely difficult to make people feel anything. Also, for everyone who is with you, there will be two or three people who think it's a terrible idea.

I would even go so far as to state that the majority of political corruption has far less to do with the inherent evil of politicals (yes, that's what most people seem to believe motivates these powerful people), and more to do with the cynicism that sets in when the politician realizes just how difficult it is to effect any sort of change whatsoever.

If you want to start a revolution, you need to be better, smarter, more exciting, and at least more popular than all current politicians. You need to be a lot more charismatic, have excellent public speaking skills, show some confidence and start displaying leadership qualities-- statements like 'awww c'mon guys, why do you have to be so negative' and the like make you seem weak and defensive. People didn't respect Stalin, or Marx, or Che Guevera because they went around complaining that nobody listened to them and everyone shot them down all the time.

I have absolutely nothing against someone who has a genuine, realistic plan for changing society (unless of course, I know in my heart that they're going to ruin things with their own blind stupidity), however what you must keep in mind is that there are always going to be people who will disagree with what you're trying to do, or think that it should be done differently, or that other things should take priority... etc. etc. etc. and you will have to deal with those people before you can get what you want.

If you are serious about staging a 'revolution', the first thing you will need to do is figure out how to deal with the people who are going to try to stop you.

Here are some ideas:

1. Build a small army-- in America, this is very possible, however it will be difficult to keep it a secret from the people with even bigger armies. With any revolution, military might will get you a lot further than talk... just open a history book.

2. Upset the balance-- assassination, terrorism, and fear can work wonders. A cataclysm may drive people to accept something that they once thought unthinkable, because in such situations people tend to grow very pliant.

3. Use propaganda-- of course, given how media-savvy everyone is, it's going to be tough to get past layer upon layer of critical thinking, but it is possible, probably, I suppose. Bob Dylan used folk music, John Lennon used pop music and his accent, Obama uses articulate speech, George Bush used Christianity... find something near and dear to people's hearts and exploit it-- and make sure it overrides their rationality.

4. Join a revolutionary outfit-- there are a few of them around, I'm sure... and most of them are somewhat disorganized, which is why they aren't always so prominent. Push them into taking 'the next step', and if you can be persuasive enough, you can climb the ladder within their outfit until you are capable of defininig everything they stand for... and then you've got yourself a potential revolution!

I'm pretty sure that right now you're thinking 'well, that's not exactly what I had in mind'-- which is exactly why your own 'revolution' isn't going to happen. You need a lot more than some cliched words on a site where everyone has pretty much escaped into communes or drugs or their image or what-have-you in order to effect real change... and you will also have to come to terms with the fact that it is likely you will be arrested or attacked for what you are trying to do-- and never lose sight of the fact that your actual message is far less important than your ability to hit it home.

 

Sorry if you're thinking you get shot down again, Daytripper, but I think heywood explained it excellent.
So, why are you so convinced it is a revolution that should bring the change you want?

 

heywood your analysis is both synthetic and powerful. i agree that one group cant do much unless some major happening that shatters the feeling of safeness of most people occurs. take a look at all the successful social revolutions in history: a dire common distress is needed to trigger a revolution and the active support of large parts if not the majority of the population is crucial to give the active insurrectionalists some chance to fight and survive. the job of a real revolutionary is to form and mantain a low profile yet powerfully structured organisation which at the right time, under proper circumstances, can metamorphize itself into a working machine of war and propaganda. the point is, the Man knows this and will sure do his steps to map those groups so that they can be wiped out in a few days as soon as threats occur. that's why proper propaganda, building a large net of occult supporters, and keeping eyes open are so important. in the days of global communications and internet the game is at the same time simpler yet incomparably more dangerous. another way to gain consensus before the 'great disaster' without the inherent risks of planning and executing murders and terroristic attacks, which most times are counterproducing to the cause, are aimed, non-lethal attacks with great propagandistic meaning but little or no violence needed, the purpose of them is emphatizing an idea or just plain ridiculize persons, institutions and ways of life. an example: months ago some masked guys in Turin entered a famous extra-luxury elite restaurant populated by tycoons and politicians and dumped a heavy load of good ol'shit on the floors... and also on some of the customers. This to attract the general attention on respected people, in fact just vile pigs, who enjoy great life while their employees are being fired and can't survive, while ill immigrants are left to die without medical care in police centers, in the general indifference. this may seem a trivial prank but among common people no particular reactions of anger for those poor tycoons covered of crap were observed, other than a big laugh and maybe a secret inner consent. the risk, even in the occurrence of being caught is low and there is no way of being stigmatized as vile murderers. actions like that , if repeated on a regular basis, with a peculiar style, proper rivendications, and good targets at a certain point stop being stupid pranks and turn into intelligent non conventional political acts. every institution who is continuously laughed at, ridiculized, forced to confront itself with its own lies and incoherences and protested will finally break down. bashing cheap cars of common folks in the streets is stupid; systematically destroying rolls-royces and ferrari or better 'blue' government cars (a generally hated symbol of privilege here) is a political act. burning down a bank who robbed its customers is a political act; also robbing the bank and throwing the money outside or giving it to the unemployed is good but more risky. better if the poor and the unemployed that took the money then get into troubles. killing some minor politician is silly and suicidal. kidnapping some bastard murderer police officer and leaving him absolutely unharmed but tied up naked and covered with pig feces with a note of explanation for the newspapers in a public place is good propaganda; slaying him means making a martyr of him and finally is what the Man wishes. That's why governments are always hoping that radical opposers do such stupid things, and when they don't the establishment does them by itself and then dumps the blame over their evil bloody radical enemies. look what happens in street protests: at a certain point the usual thugs show up, the police is never there and they are left free to bash the city and who takes the blame? all the innocent peaceful protesters. another classic is putting a bomb who kills dozens of bystanders and then put the blame over left wing or anarchist extremists. twenty years after we learn that the actual murderers were our "deviated" secret services together with groups of fascists but the damage at this point is history. it is kind of a cliche around here. we have seen this a lot of times during periods of tenths of years, it is no news and it works great because most people just dont want to believe that they in fact are ruled by merciless tyrants.

the time for violent actions carried out with military actions comes only when the estabilishment throws the mask and turns openly brutal, really brutal, i mean . remember, you cant draw blood first and gain popularity.

 

yeah Heywood good post, its the first one that actually got some ideas out there in the open.

jagerhans, thank you. you gave a lot of radical ideas
lets keep the ideas flowing!!

asmodean, maybe i shouldn't of used the word revolution because you seem to think i mean revolution as in full scale take over or something. i mean revolution as just a great change in general.

 

Yeah well, I like to think that if someone starts a topic about revolution they actually know what it means. A revolution may be a lot of different things when it comes to details (economic, industrial, peaceful etc. etc.) but it always is about a radical change in a relatively short time. I think the problems you'd like to change should be taken care of one by one and although I do not have the exact answer how to, it's not by any kind of revolution.
Jagerhans may seriously have some great points how to start one but the biggest point he made is that most people don't have the common distress to trigger any kind of revolution (at least it's not bigger then their fear to loose everything).

 

My post was actually serious or did you mean the other guys?

 

i ment the other guys sorry

 

true several of the things that are in need of change will probably have to be focused on individually to actually change them, and may take some time.

lets pretend that this thread never mentioned anything of revolution, only that change is needed. now will you be more willing to help me think of ideas on how to change the state our country is slowly slipping into?

 

No, I'm from a different country which happily is in a slightly less need of radical change. I just get attracted to revolutionary things just like you, so when I red this thread I tried to make clear that if you really want to change these things it's no use calling for revolution. :biggrin:
I agree with the problems you mentioned though. If I ever get a good solution I will mention it here.

 

oh well thank you .
what country are you from?

 

Netherlands

 

TheDayTripper
so you want to have a new revolution?
just by the way, what's the old revolution?
could it be the one that Abby Hoffman and Jerry Rubin tried to start?
If it is- you can count me out.
They weren't part of a hippie revolution, they were yippies. In my opinion, yippies were no better than Karl Marx , Lenin and their cronies.

PAX

 

i only say new revolution because its still in the making. as for the old revolution, it can be which ever one you want it to be for there are several old revolutions. although i do like some of the methods used by the Chicago eight, (or seven which ever you prefer)

 

Did you mean Yippies?
and if you really meant Yuppies then maybe Jerry Rubin at the end became one and met the end he deserved, but Abbie one yuppie? holy crap, he died alone ill and penniless.
Let's leave apart Vlad and comrades, I don't feel like arguing too much nor i think it is good for the debate.

"Revolution isn't something fixed in ideology, nor something fashioned to a particular decade. It is a perpetual process embedded in the human spirit"

 

btw i'd like to ask if by accident y'all know how deep is the weird shit in which we are sinking here in italy. among voices of faked elections, the government sponsoring squadrism and each bad idea that comes out of the mouth of the pope, a real fascist party devoted to street violence who shamelessly candidates, racism on unbelievable rampage, wages lower than greece, the prime minister who openly lies day after day, evades tenths of criminal trials by law while asks to nearly abolish the parliament at his gain and attempts to put the judges, called all communists and bashed daily, under his own control (the constitution wants them to be a separate independent power), the highest rate of corruption ever, 19 convicted criminals sitting in parliament, and the hugest pro-government media coverage ever seen since Mussolini's days, filtering everything that the government does not like on more than 3/4 of all the media. All this over a spoiled population who day after day looks like growing more ignorant, selfish and barbaric than ever. This is not hype. when i was a boy, in public, clean schools they teached us tolerance. kids read of martin luther king and rose parks in books, were taught about the importance of birth control and among the rest studied politics, music, sociology. now schools literally fall on the heads of the pupils killing them and there is little or no trace left of all that and some lowlives teach the masses to be racist, xenophobe and violent, no shit, it is plain like that. you can go in a square and find a lunatic who by the way is the Major of the city openly teaching racial and religious intolerance to a howling crowd and inviting people to violence and there is no cop there to arrest him. elsewhere you see people in their 30's sporting fascist marks who come with sticks and pickaxes assaulting junior students in protest in the middle of historic squares in rome with the protection of the police who rescues them when a horde of older students come and run over the fascist. again, no hype. i could go on for pages listing episodes equal or worser than those and i feel in despair because i know that no one but us, the italians, can abort this rot trip but we are not even trying.

 

Yeah, I've noticed most of it. Italian politics make the US government look good...