wow, and i always thought the gateway theory was bullshit

ps. i defined gateway theory my own way, you keep insisting that the DEA's take on the getway theory is the only one there is?? the whole point of my posts have been to define the gateway tehory in a way that is more rational than the ones typically made.

 

you can't change a theoy with out it becoming a new theoy this whole thred is about the gateway theoy not yours. so get your head out of your ass good bye for ever

 

Now I'm curious... why's that?

 

Marijuana is only a gateway drug if you let it be.

 

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It's only a "gateway drug" for some people

 

i love the Cd, i wish theyd get more attention tho, they rap so much better then eminem.

 

i didnt change the theory, the theory is plain and simple:

doing marijuana raises the chance of people going on to other drugs

THAT is the gateway theory.

the DEA has its own theory on the gateway theory. I was proposing the one i believe. you have opposed the DEA's version of the theory, but we arent meant to be adressing that here.

the gateway theory was not a DEA invention. they intepreted the theory, and defined the mechanics behind it their own way. I am opposing their interpretation and subsequent sub-theory with my own that puts into perspective the gateway theory in a way i see valid. you have not clearly opposed my theory, you keep going over the place and referring to stupid thigns like how im not talking about the 'real' gateeay theory.

the gateway theory has nothing to do with marijuana in its specifics. marijuana is jsut the most common gateway drug, and so the theory has been stamped on marijuana by the dea because the statistics are only useful for criminalising weed as a gateway drug.

i mean honestly how can you talk down on me when your argueing a battle of definitions and words? I dont care if you dont think teh thread is about my thoery, or if my theory shouldnt be called a 'gateway theory', thats all besides the point!!!

the point is that people who do drugs have a much higher chance of doing other drugs next to people who dont do any drugs, and my take on one of the reasons is that it is due to the way a person percieves the use of a drug

youve jsut been shitting on about brainwashing and stupid little unrelated remarks

and for your question, velvet, its naive because northern europe has a culture that has developed over a long time, a culture that encompasses soft drugs such as alchohol and marijuana

america however has an increidbly unstable, irresponsible culture, as with most of the western world, with a huge population, and HUGE amount of drug related crime.

the outcome of legalising weed in today's america would be completely different to the semi-legalisation of weed in the amsterdam for example, where it was never as big a problem as america's before it was legalised.

population is completely different, view on drugs at the time of legalisation was different, climate and geography is different (no overproduction of weed in northern europe as possible in california or something), less of a conservatively-based place, like 0.005% of the funding and bother on teh war on drugs at the time of legalisation.

 

Imagine having the person you have to watch just baisicly die away being your own mother..... she's in jail right now but she'll be out soon and we'll see how long she'll stay clean ,this is her 3rd time going to jail for coke or crack.

 

Ehm.. I'd be carefull with generalising, since the Netherlands is the only country where weed is treated so liberaly. I'm not too sure about the laws about it in other countries, but I do know that there are trouble at the German and Belgian border because Germans and Belgians come to our coffeeshops to smoke.

What do you mean with unstable? And don't you think the irresponsibility is kinda created by your goverment, by treating stuff like alcohol and drugs like it's evil, not allowing teenagers to ease into it? Here you learn to deal with those things while most are still living at home (beer= 16, weed + strong alcohol = 18) so you learn to be responsible.. and then you can learn to drive (18).. not the other way round, like in the US.

That's my whole point, drug related crime only exists as long as drugs is illegal. As soon as you sort of legalize the stuff everyone uses anyway, like weed, then that can be better monitored while the other drugs will be harder to get, since you don't go to the same dealer for heroin as you do for your weed.

Well.. it was illegal in the '60 and early '70 as far as I know, but it was fairly new back then so the cops didn't know exactly what to be looking for.. which was a blast for the hippies and provo's in Amsterdam because they'd dry dogpoo and mix it with normal grass and act all suspicious, so the cops would arrest them and start fondling the dogpoo etc. If Holland would've coped with that by criminalising weed further than yeah, we would've gotten the same situation as in the US.. in my opinion, we made a better choice.

Yeah true.. basically.. you're screwed. It's very hard to change something when all the problems are already there.. once making the wrong turn it's hard to pull out the car when you notice you're stuck in mud basically. This is, in my opinion, just one of the many problems of the US.. an other main one would be the fact that religion and politics aren't seperated enough.. just look at Bush and the things he says. But that's a whole different issue. Basically.. you're screwed, move away or fight the fight.. didn't Che Guevera say something like "I envy you, since you live in the heart of the beast, you can fight it from within"?

 

haha so waht, are you ultimately agreeing or disagreeing with what i said?

and in terms of the drug related crime, it just distances drugs from \whats acceptable. and if lawys suddenly change, and criminals can no longer function as criminals in a legal business, they must then move on to different crime. if weed became illegal, harder drugs would probably take over as the main crime, instead of weed. hmm i dont think that issue has been discussed here (hipforums) for as long as i can remember

 

I'm agreeing that it's nearly impossible to legalize weed in the US at this very moment.. and I'm agreeing (or disagreeing? not sure what you think of our policy) that the way weed is dealt with in the Netherlands is the best way (maybe the growing itself should be legal as well..)..

 

It's an interesting idea btw.. what would happen to the drugdealers if they lost their income through weed.. I've no idea.. maybe they would seek money from harddrugs.. or maybe they'd become coffeeshop owners? I think it depends on the person.. if it's a mostly crackwhore dealer so to see or the chill type in SanFrancisco who mostly deals with dreads & hippies..

 

nar i think its good the way its regulated through coffeeshops, though im sure if the laws were changed gradually it would work

i think thats the only way, for teh laws to be slowly implimented, so that any problems that might occur can be predicted before they happen

 

Yup.. and starting with the more liberal states first probably.. I don't see weed ever becoming legal in the biblebelt states.. we'd have to kill or the rednecks and fundies first.. I wonder if legalizing weed would push down the violentcrime rates.. since a lot of people carry guns for 'protection' and such.. maybe if they just chilled out a little.. hm.. although weed can cause paranoia, which doesn't help if you're carrying a gun

Would be a nice experiment though.. legalizing weed in the US.. if I were God or an Alien, mastering Earth, that would be my new project I think

 

interesting. well velvet you should know your countries history. Amsterdam uses small amounts of weed not only to bring tourism(+ its a beautiful country so ive heard) but by allowing small usage of marijuana and punishing severely the use of harder drugs their hard drug and violence rates have decreased.

 

I know my countries situation.. and I was talking with Stonerbill about the difference between this culture and that of the US.. and we were wondering how legalising drugs would affect the situation in the US.. and since we've established that these two countries are very very different in a lot of ways (current situation as well as historically) you can't just compare the US to this country when it comes to the effects of legalising weed.. or sth like that

Plus I think that the punishments on harddrugs here are still not as tough as in the US..

 

yeah and i was saying if the US treated weed like amsterdam does then i think over time our situation would evolve to that of A'dams.

 

Meh.. I think there is way more needed for that.. Holland is a very liberal country.. and well.. the US mostly isn't.. so.. there would need to be a lot more changes than just the drugstuff I'm afraid..

I'd be more than happy to show you 'round in Amsterdam though if you ever come and visit

 

ill take you up on that! my mom is sending me to A'dam for a month when i graduate(summer of 07)