Womens Choice to Choose

Ha-ha-ha (LOL). Never heard this one, thanks!

But in order to prevent this post of mine from being considered off topic, I must add this:
in the same book, where it says "you should not kill" it says much earlier, that it was man who was not to be killed, but "every moving animal that is alive may serve as food for you".

 

i just really don't understand how anyone can feel comfortable with legally forcing a woman to bear a child for nine months and give birth and have responsibility for that child for the rest of her life. it's really beyond me how anyone can come to the conclusion that this would be an okay thing to do.

 

No, it's not illogical, its pragmatic. The real world does not follow priciples. There are always exceptions (eg. "Stealing is bad"/starving kids)

The legality question of pro-choice is; Who decides decides the applicability of the two principles "Don't kill babies" and "Err on the side of caution when deciding what is or is not a baby."

The pro-choice position is that the pregnant woman decides.
There are others who want the government to make that decision.

The record of the government making decisions for women, combined with other statements by anti-choice proponents about what they want women to do, convinces me that a pregnant woman is the most reliable decision maker about abortion.

My argument doesn't approach the question "Should a woman have an abortion in this situation." It is only applicable to the legality of abortion.

 

The ideas about sex differ very much: some think it is "a sin, which Adam commited and God sent them out of Paradise". And as such, it is a kinda "sinful" pleasure anyway. So in such religions people only have sex when they want to have children and never use condoms. And especially try to avoid having sex for pleasure.

But general tendency today is, to the contrary, to be extremely careless about sex; they have it just along with other pleasures -- hang out with beer "and chicks", for example.

But sex WASN'T "sin for which God threw Adam out". Before that God gave them commandment to "be fruitful and become many and fill the earth and subdue it..." Have any human beings ever had any problems obeying that commandment? Why not? Because of the great pleasure we have from these relations between man and woman. This is the thing designed to make us happy -- in case of the correct usage, of course. And the correct usage, I assume, would be to take into account the main purpose of sex, which is childbirth. Neither is it "too problematic" to follow these principles. When we fall in love, we naturally don't want to break away, but rather "leave our father and mother and stick to the wife and become one flesh" as the Scripture has it. So, it is as "easy" as this: follow our natural inclination, but also apply our mind and conscience and take responsibility. In that case there would be no pregnancies out of family bonds and the burden would not be thrown on the "weaker" shoulders of young single teenage mothers (for example).

I am sure, if people payed more attention to these things, abortion would be no question any more.

 

Perhaps my previous post was misunderstood. Please allow me to expand upon it. If you don't have a uterus and your reasoning for denying a woman an abortion is bible verse you have no credibility with others who don't believe as you do. This is a matter of personal choice, not a political issue, not a religious issue, not a medical issue. No one has the right to dictate the life or lifestyle of another. Not your religious organization, not your political party and ESPECIALLY not your governing body. That reeks of fascism.

Stop making it something it's not.

 

If you noticed, I didn't mention any such things as dictating to women by parties, organizations or governing bodies. I didn't mean to "press on somebody with the authority of the Bible" either, you see. If you disagree with the very ideas, it's OK.

I thought I was very clear in saying that no one can dictate to a woman. That it is her personal decision. But we make our decisions basing on our understanding of the matter, don't we? We calculate everything, see what is envolved. In this case the more food for thinking you have, the more balanced your decision would be. The less to regret about later. You go for council and information to different sources and make your decision. So I shared my opinion in the way of sharing of such additional information.
If our discussion should take the shape of " ABORTION -- YES!/ ABORTION --NO!!!" -- then what's the use?

I hate it when somebody is trying to dictate others on life of lifestyle. Personally, I have experienced it many times on myself. When I was a child, I had to subdue; but now that I'm adult, I know why I have this position or another. So nobody dictates me, thankfully. But who knows, the political situation in my country may change, too.

 

its real easy to slag off abortions when you live in a stable economic and social situation, ive noticed.

 

Actually aguest, that was for Wahkon and MikeE. See page one of this thread.

 

I think that Zoomie and I agree pretty good.

 

Birth control doesn't always work (as mentioned already)
It makes me sick thinking about a woman who has to get down on her knees in a doctor's office and beg for an abortion. It's her body, and what she wants she should get. And all that psychological crap about "making sure you should have one" is crap. I don't really have many pet peeves, but this one I am strong about.

It's our body. Leave us alone. And don't try dragging religion into it. They are two seperate things

Pro-choice...100%

 

i think women should have the choice ,just as they do it in a timley manner. ive known a couple of women waiting till 4 or 5 mo. before making a decision. then the "child" has developed and they feel everything you feel...then it should be way too late to have an abortion

 

Dear women, I wish you whole bunch of good things you'd wish for yourselves. I wish that none of you should ever have to make such painful decisions (nor anybody else make them for you either). May all of you have love, wisdom and family happiness. Peace, of course.

 

thanks for the positive, supportive thoughts.

 

I second that
Peace and Love

 

"Thou shall not kill".

Last time I checked the legality of abortion is a political and legal issue NOT a religious issue. It is illegal in this country to use scripture to force laws into effect. Just because a religion believes something is "wrong" doesn't mean that EVERYONE must be legally forced into christian ideals. If that were true then 90 percent of our population would be stoned to death as punishment for having sex outside of marriage.

Oh I also hope you are a vegetarian who never uses paper, anti-septic, or walks on the ground. All those things kill living organisms and the passiage DOES NOT say "Thou shall not kill (only other humans) after all.

 

Want to elaborate? What is illogical about allowing women who don't want abortions to carry pregnancy's to term(or not get pregnant)- and allowing women who do want or need abortions to abort. Each makes thier own choice - and the pro-life have no rights, liberties, or privleges taken away from them.
Forcing other people to do what YOU want them to do with thier feoti JUST BECAUSE "you" want them to do it is what is illogical.

 

I wander why they swear on a copy of the Bible during court hearings. Sorry, just trying to understand "this" country.

 

that's an anachronism.

 

I haven't read this whole thread, but I thought this was a good place to jump in. Only quoted the portion that I quoted here to say that abortion is a PERSONAL issue- the legality of it has made it a political hot-button only since the years and conditions leading up to Roe v. Wade. For the record, I am SO GLAD that abortion is safe and legal (for now, anyway).

However...this is an issue that cannot rightfully be decided by any government, or for that matter, by anyone who is not a female! It is a women's issue, purely and completely. Even the potential and future fathers out there (and I am a father, thank you)- you do not have any rightful claim to a fetus, because it's not your body. It's her decision, and if you do have any say in what happens, it's only because a woman lets you have that say. The decision of whether or not to end a pregnancy is possibly the most personal choice I can imagine a woman ever having to make...and if she has her reasons, I believe the option should be made available to her, legally and safely.

The notion of one person or group of people deciding for the public at large what is OK and what is not OK to do with an individual's body is so ludicrous that it makes my head spin.

That's all I've got. Flame away if you must...but I'm serious about this.

 

:applause: :applause: