Wishful thinking?

If you understand what I'm saying, then why don't you show it?

 

I never said they are bad people. Some people think that two people of the same sex shouldn't get married. That doesn't mean they shouldn't be able to. It's a personal thing, a personal choice, and marraige is about people not sexes.

Your second point really doesn't make sense to me. How would we get anywhere without starting somewhere?

 

Because I don't understand what you're saying

 

i know marriage is about people. and like i said i dont care if gay people want to get married. thats fine. i dont mind one bit. i'm not religious, i do not care.

what, so your saying that me arguing with someone on the internet about gay rights is eventually going to change the goverments and the churchs views on rights for gays???

it's going to do nothing. we all have views on important issues. arguing about them over the internet will not change anything.

that's all i'm saying.

 

If that's all you're saying I know where you're coming from. You don't care if gay people want to get married? I don't understand why people don't feel more strongly about this.

No, that's not what I'm saying at all. I'll reply in the morning, it's 6AM here and I'm damn tired lol.

By the way, I thought your original argument was this:

 

no i dont. just like i dont care if straight people want to get married, if people want to get there pets married or if a man wants to marry his pet. everyone can just do what they like. have a free for all. i don't mind.

and my original arguement was that. people who are religious and have a strong belief that gay marriage is un-godly or whatever, are not going to change that view coz you're stood there ranting at them. so it's pointless. just like they couldn't convince you that it was wrong. it works both ways.

and im going to bed too coz i got work in the morning.

 

Yeah, you don't mind if gay people get married. Neither do I. I also, like you, don't care if straight people get married. The thing is, straight people have the ability to get married. It's celebrated. Gay people don't have that right. It's like gay people are treated like a small minority with no rights. Homosexual people are just that, people. And they should have the right to love and marry anyone they fucking want to. They should be able to celebrate their relationships and commitment just like heterosexual people can.

Why can't they? Because other people are "against" it. If Christain people didn't have a "problem" with gay marriages, I don't think there'd be a problem at all. Now, I'm not trying to change their viewpoint (actually, I think that'd be lovely ). If they want to think it's wrong, they can think that. If gay people start getting married it's not going to change anyone else's life at all.

What I would love is for people to become more tolerant. I would love to see gay marriages made legal. It's one of the few ridiculous things there is. Just like women and black people (I know I'm using this example, but to me it's the same thing) now get to vote and work, one day gay people will be allowed to get married.

I'm not so deluded I think I'm sitting here ranting on and that's going to change the world. Or even your mind. I want people who agree with me to know that they can do something to help change it. It will happen, but it'll happen a lot quicker with people's support. And please don't anyone give me that shit about how people have no power and can't do anything about it. Because we've changed things before and we can change things again.

Thank you

 

Having debates with people and standing up for what you believe in is NOT always "forcing your views on people". Fuck, why dont we all just sit watching TV eating chicken out of a bucket in silence for the rest of our lives incase stating any opinions or part of our personality is seen as forcing views...

Objetdarte really believed in what she was saying, and with incredibly good reason-she was speaking partly for her friend. She was understandably upset by someones closed-minded, prejudiced views which to her had no genuine basis and she wanted to enlighten them to a more accepting way of thinking. You dont know the person so you cannot possibly say her attempts were completely pointless and the person would never change or take anything in. Even though its appeared to be the case, some ideas may have got into their mind, and they may be reforming their opinions...

Thats whats great about opinion sharing, it makes us think, it keeps us growing. Why, bravesirrUbin, do you want a world where no-one bothers to defend anything or anyone, no-one states their opinions or has a debate, no-one can say a word against the religious? Or did I miss the point of why you felt the need to "lecture" and criticise OD for simply doing these things?

It is not immature. I believe not having the open-mindedness to discuss these things freely with people and share your views is immature. No harm has come from what OD said to this person. They can choose not to listen and go about their business and no-one is hurt

Im really failing to see why you went to the bother of patronising OD so much. To appear clever?

Before you give me to whole "Im just sharing my view" game, criticism of such an extent in this kind of context really does need some kind of real justification, otherwise the person doing it is just a complete prick. Sharing views doesnt mean going around being a dick to everyone...

 

I agree with this person

 

There is always a time and place for debate, yet you need to pick out the people you debate with.

Debating gay marriage with a strongly religious person is like a preacher debating God with a committed atheist. Neither side will change their opinion, no matter what you say. I don't see why this is so bloody hard to understand.

A religious person's beliefs are not based on logic. How hard is that to understand? They would have disowned their own son if he was gay. The OP is the one being closed minded because she fails to understand this.

The problem is that the person is hurt, both her and the OP seemed pretty butthurt about it afterwards and there will probably be some bad feelings between them.

As Opel said, if you want to really change something, there are better ways to do it. Trying to convince a religious person that gay marriage is ok is like trying to convince a child that candy sucks.

It's something that they have to realize by themselves. It's not like all the information isn't already out there. Living in this society, we're bombarded with the gay marriage debate, even if we don't like it... the arguments are pretty simple on both sides.

Preaching such an idea only antagonizes it. The person the OP was talking to probably felt attacked after her religious beliefs were questioned, which is why she resulted to replying with bible quotes. This actually makes it less likely for her to ever consider gay marriage as something she'd support.

All in all, people need to first be open to change before any sort of information can ever influence them to make a change. Religious people, especially those who frivolously quote the bible aren't ready for such change, and arguing with them is pointless because it won't change anything for the better.

You are simply just too inexperienced with life to understand that, but hopefully you will one day.

 

I read your post, nodding in agreement with a lot of your sentiments, ready to click "reply" and post out a few agreeing points and to explain why I was still right in my ways also...

Until I got to this sentence. I personally think you havent had enough experience with life to realise you sound like a completely arrogant cock, but hopefully you will one day
Either that or youve been hiding out and following me through life, spying on my every move in order to make yourself worthy of making this judgement. Somehow I doubt this is the case, I doubt you even know my name
Another possibility still is that you realise that youre a completely smug and patronising git who bases his judgements on absolutely nothing whatsoever and you just like it or think it makes you look cool. In which case

 

I honestly think the only logical argument against gay marriage would be if gay people were allowed to be married, then it might open a flood gate to not-so-tame or legal marriages, i.e. humans and animals, siblings, children and adults. But even then, that argument is silly because if we can have one type of marriage, what would one more hurt? Not to mention, you can't even compare gay marriage to any of those things I just mentioned, it's like apples and oranges.

That being said, I'm not against gay marriage at all, but I'm not out there protesting, because I don't feel that strongly about it. I guess I might feel more strongly if I didn't live in a state where common law is totally recognized and accepted. I don't see the benefits of paying the state anything when Daniel and I can still be recognized as husband and wife without all the paperwork. I don't believe in paying the government for the right to commit myself to someone, but I also don't believe gay people should have any less right to do it themselves.

 

I know that I sound like an arrogant cock, it's part of my charm.

But good job taking the bait!

Your thinking, and well... especially the thinking of the OP and LauraMay is way too youthful and idealistic. That's why I refer to it as "inexperience".

 

This "point" always gets me.
If you are infertil or a woman who has gone through menopause, you are not allowed to marry either. Sorry, but it won't produce children so you do not have the right. Anybody that has no intention of having children, you're out too. It's now illegal. If your marriage will not produce children, then fuck you and your useless seed.

 

It's youthful and idealistic to wonder why homosexual people are not granted the same rights as heterosexual people? And to want it changed?

 

No, not at all.

But, the approach you take to arguing and trying to change the problem is youthful and idealistic.

 

:cheers2: Can I sig it?

 

No prob.

 

Sorry for not pushing it to the edge of my mind and sitting in a corner twiddling my thumbs

 

I can't forgive you.