Why do we have to pay for everything?

My Italian mother would argue with you...as would many tribes....food is life, and therefor a very real way of showing honest love and care for an individual, especially one who may end up bearing the burden of your child.

Arguing that you should be allowed to be selfish because you wont always be is one of the lamest and most pathetic lines I have ever heard, and any girl that falls for it deserves to be the single mother and sole provider of your child due to sheer stupidity.

 

I agree with David.

Society has this expectancy that the man pays and then the girl gives him head later. I think doing this would eliminate that.

I am sure giving or buying food for another is a way to show you love them, but on the first date YOU PROBABLY DON'T LOVE THEM! If you do you love them with your genitals and not your head, with the exception you have been very good friends for a long time.

Later in the relationship it would make sense for somebody to pick up the entire tab.

The thing is its some thing that society expects and that we should not conform to. We should not listen to society.

It eliminates people expecting guys to pick up the tab, and it eliminates people expeting girls to in response to the guys picking up the tab give him head.

If you think about it, girls are actually getting the equality they want so badly by not conforming to it. Because guys aren't the ones who should be making all the money anymore, so girls should help pay, and girls aren't beign expected to be housewives anymore (if you don't conform to it).
I think that supporting it is contrary to equallity among the sexes. Expecting one sex to do something that you don't expect the other one to do creates gender roles, which I strongly oppose. The only differene between a man and a woman should be our bodies, and not how they expect our bodies to preform or how we are supposed to act.

 

Hold on, hold on. Who's being selfish here? You expect me to buy you a free meal because I love you, even though I just met you. And if I refuse to, it meens I'm selfish? What if I want the woman to give or share too? Why are men the only ones who have to prove they're not selfish by buying things for women?

 

If it bugs you so much to date and respect the magnitude of someone with a womb (ie someone that in the long run will end up carrying the burden of the relationship, even if it was only a one night stand)......
then go gay...it's not like it's socially unacceptable or anything...and I'm sure your partner will be happy to pay for his own drinks....and just as happy to fuck constantly and pay for his own penicillin shots (which btw are a hell of a alot less invasive or expensive as an abortion). Looks like a win,win situation, and you still get a nice warm hole to use.

As it is you are showing a woman that she doesnt mean anything to you, and isnt worth any effort until you deem her fuckable. Not only does that speak loudly about how you will be in a relationship, but also how you will relate to potential family, friends, and business associates....and I gotta tell you, it doesn't speak well.
it looks like you are looking for friends with benifits....except maybe that you just want the benefits without even liking the friend....which in the long run means you wont like "her" kids. Dude, I've seen it too many times. You're looking for a cop out and a utopia that does not exist. In the long run you're just another babys daddy., another statistic, and totally a product of the society that you are claiming to rebuke.

 

I'm sorry, I didn't realise that your womb entitled you to better treatment. I must be a selfish man who doesn't know how to love anyone.

Excuse me, but when have you seen this too many times? How many men have you had children with who left you? And did none of them buy dinner on the first date? I challenge the existence of your "to many times," and I don't think that paying for a first date sais anything about weather or not a man will stick around and help raise his children. If that's how you judge someone's character, than you're gonna have some problems.

The way I show someone respect and show someone that she meens something to me is by listening to what she has to say, discussing subjects of mutual interest, and being honest. At least that's on the first few dates. Later that are all sorts of thoughtfull and appropriate ways. You're saying that spending money on someone is the essential way of showing you care about them. I fear for your soul, lady. Instead of looking at how much money he has in his wallet and how much of it he spends on you, why don't you look at his eyes and listen to his stories and examine the way he treets other people?

I'd still like to know. If the man shows that he cares by spending money, how does the woman show that she cares about the man?

Oh yeah. And since when is being gay socially acceptable? You're in a fantasy world.

 

Well first of all, I disagree with this completely. I think if you were to consider all mechanics as automatic sleaze balls who rip people off, you are going to have other generalizations. Which will lead to manipulating other people you see as inferior, or of lower character. So what starts out as just a piece of shit mechanic, can easily turn into a friend, boyfriend, or husband.

For the record I have worked as a mechanic throughout most of my time after high school and in college, and I never scammed someone. In fact, I often go out of my way and do extra things on the car. This is partly because I am an honest, ethical person, and partly because I am highly efficient when it comes to fixing something mechanical. I don't need to rip someone off to make big bucks. There are a lot of mechanics like that. There are of course going to be assholes (just like everywhere else in life), but I put just as much blame on the typical consumer, who display such blatant ignorance about their $25,000 machine and allow these people to exploit it.

Back to the topic, there are women who are definite gold diggers, and women who are not. As cynical as I might be at this point in my life, I believe in being chivalrous and all that, but at the same time not looking at the woman as an object or something that is to be purchased. If I ask a girl out, sure I will hold doors, take her coat, pay for the meal. I don't look at it with such a competitive state of mind as many appear to, I just look at it as spending time with a female, recognizing and appreciating she is wanting or willing to spend time with me, and wanting to make it enjoyable and comfortable. If things progress into a relationship, which has to be reiprocal to survive, I would hope naturally things would balance out. I once dated a girl for almost a year, and I paid for all but maybe 3 meals. This was going out regularly also. I even talked to her about it, which in my mind should never have to happen. It should just be natural. Well, she turned out to be pretty self centered in ways beyond who pays the tab, and in retrospect I got pretty used in a lot of ways. But I learned and I try not to let it make me bitter.

The girls that come up to me and flirt in bars can fuck off. I flirt and talk back sure, but most of them are just trying to get free drinks, and first sign I catch of that I go back to getting drunk w/ my bros. I have had girl friends on a platonic level that actively go out just to get drunk for free, and to dupe old men into picking up their tab. It's fucking disgusting, and I don't fall for it. I would probably get laid more if I played their games, but that just really gets to me. They can do it all they want, but I won't involve myself. Besides, I like to get wasted and enjoy live music at bars not have small talk that nobody will remember or care about the next day.

But I enjoy treating a lady like a lady, even in this world of equalism, competition, and blurred lines between the two genders.

 

what about the girls who come up to you in a bar to flirt and buy YOU a drink?

 

Never had it happen. I'm 24 though, not to the phase of life where the women start buying the men drinks I guess.

 

Wow Conclealed Culture. That's very interesting. I keep on meeting more and more men who have come to this conclusion on their own, and it makes me hope that change is coming.

KC, you're in denial, and it's getting old. I've had a woman buy me drinks at a bar once, and it was pretty awesome. She invited me out, and she bought because I was broke and said we couldn't go to a bar if I had to buy drinks. That was once, and it felt great. But it never happened again. I certainly can't go to a bar and expect to drink for free. Well, women can. I know several who do.

This thread has been running for months now. Women keep on cycling through, explaining why they expect to have things bought for them on dates. Not one man has expressed that he refuses to go on dates with women who won't buy them a meal. I repeat, you're in denial.

 

i think you're in the wrong state.

 

Well how come noone from your state seems to come online except you?

 

most are allowed outside, where it's better and more fun.

 

Find a fat ugly chick they ussually pick up the tab.

 

lol. you know, maybe that's been my deal all along, and i just didn't know it.

 

Women are very competitive when it comes to dating. They think that the girl who looks the best is going to get the hottest guy (which if he is shallow, is true). When girls are picking going out with guys, they get the choice of going out with guys who will pay, or guys who expect them to pay their own way the first time. They would just rather take the guy who would pay, because it is a little bit better, and thats how they tend to see things. I guess that what you get for asking women their opinion in an issue like this.

If you read my previous post, you'll see what I said about guys paying and girls giving them head.

People can justify it how ever they want, but it doesn't matter what they say. Its sexism and materialism that they are supporting, along with that sense of shallowness because they want to date the hottest guy.

Its not entirely girls fault though, its also guys faults, but that was the past, and guys shouldn't be paying for dinner and expecting sex afterwards anymore.

This is another good reason to legalize prostitution, probably not valid though in front of congress, because I don't like something culture expects.

If I ever pay for a girl its going to be because I care for her with my head, not my dick. These women are expecting guys to care for them with their dicks and pay their way. "Oh, pay for me because I'm so pretty and you love me and if you don't your selfish and will turn out to be an awful father".

If you expect a guy to pay and he does because hes not "selfish" then he doesn't really love you, and he will be an awful father because your relationship is only going to last until he finds some other girl to pay for.

This isn't the 50's people.