Whose afraid of the big bad muslim?

Hey Erasmus, Ho Chi Minh and the VC killed many people as well, would you have supported the Vietnam war as well? Iraq is the new vietnam with a new brainwashed American public, basically meaning that we dont have as much protest and good music resulting from the horrible senseless war now as we did from the horrible senseless war then.



BTW many Israeli Politicians are advocating expansion into Jordan (or as they refer to it"East Israel") besides that they have allready expanded far too much and it is not only right, but inevitable that they contract and the Palestinian people take back what is rightfully theirs.

 

For whats it worth - I pretty much explained that to you (re. Iraq) however thanks for explaining it back in more detail.
You dont seem to be giving any sort of commited suggestion on what you and your friends think of the Iraq invasion and if its representative of the Canadian public.
You just tell us what its not or what it doesnt mean.
Well done.

 

I have stated what i think of it, and that is that the invasion is an imperialistic oil grab with no real regard to world security. Indeed, there are many more warlike states with much more nuclear capabilities than Iraq (North Korea being the most obvious example) and so if it was really about stopping a madman from having nukes, Kim Il Jong is far madder than Saddam. But Kim Il Jong does not sit atop the one of the worlds largest black lakes, that is to say North Korea isnt very oil wealthy, and so what good would an invasion of a very poor country do for the US and the neoliberals that control it. The invasion of Iraq is basically oppurtunism. It could not have happened if it werent for September 11 (which is prooving to be a lucky day for mr. bush) because september 11 offered the government a golden oppurtunity to make its masses afraid of terrorism (particularly Islamist terrorism), it was an act that bore many resemblences to the burning of the Reichstag, or the sinking of the Maine, and I truly believe that the culprits of September 11 will be viewed as different people when 2001 becomes more distant history (much like what happened to the culprits of the Reichstag and the Maine, if you argued against the paradigm that it was communists or the spanish back then, nobody would have taken you seriously, but we now know that Hitler burned the Reichstag and the yanks sunk the Maine). To invade Iraq because of what a Saudi-born CIA trained Afghan residing terrorist supposedly done makes no sense, but then again neither does the war on terror (hey, lets have a war on violence while we're at it, we can rip all violent people apart, nothing oxy-moronical about it at all). You may say that you got rid of an evil dictator, but look at how many evil dictators are in the world today, better yet, look at who pays their bills. Indeed, Iraq is much more violent after the overthrow of that supposed madman than it was when he reigned. Thankfully, the occupation of Iraq isnt yet quite as bad as the occupation od Palestine, but it isnt getting any better. You may say that the world is a safer place, but how can this be? look at all the car bombings in Iraq now, where were they in 2002? look at America's global reputation now, everybody hates you except for your Israeli thugs and some contra's here and there. Thankfully my nation stayed out of the direct war, but i am still ashamed that we have a complicity in it like we did in Vietnam. I am also ashamed at our reluctance to harbour war-resisters (so lovingly called draft dodgers south of the border) unlike how we kept humans who were unwilling to kill or die for a false cause safe from the jungles of 'Nam. I turn on Canadian news, and I see cool heads going over facts, I turn on American news, and I see some tanks rolling by with red white and blue captions saying some stupid shit like "our heros in iraq" or "defending freedom" and the screams of Iraqi's are covered over by crappy Jingoistic jingles, it makes me sick. They make the war out to be like a video game. and then there are the pro-war video-games like America's army. Im afraid to say that America's propaganda machine is far stronger than her war machine, America's masses are subdued by their televisions whereas Iraq refuses to submit to the vassalage of the United States.




May sound like harsh words, but I will say this. I do not hate the USA and I do not hate Americans. I hate what their becoming. The corporate powers, especially the ones in the media, have taken control of your country and raped it into the peice of shit that it is becoming. You have traded Mark Twain for Freinds, you have traded Bill Monroe for Britney Spears, America doesnt truly exist anymore. Welcome to America™. Canada is next unless we fight corporate takeover.

 

Listen to "the cause of death" and "the fourth branch" by immortal technique

 

Canada is already an American Franchise.
You cant just blame the Yanks though.. the fact is that Canadians can just as easily walk into a Zellers or Tim Hortons as easily as they can a Walmart or a Starbucks.
We could just as easily make a national dream of building an ideal Canadian vehicle.
Heck.. smaller countries like Sweden have their own cars!

Thats just an example but the point is that Canadians have no real objective reason to have become a US based franchisee other than their own apathy and fear of gaining a National identity and a national 'mission'.
Seriously.. what is Canada supposed to be anyways?
Is there a mandate?
A National Goal?
Some sort of plan or dream of what we will become?
Nope.
Just re-electing a corrupt government and waiting for the next episode of 'Fear Factor' or 'American Idol'.

Oh yeah.. all the crap about the murderers on 911 is just that - crap.
All 18 of them are scumbags and anyone who thinks differently is an asshole.
Its that simple.

 

911 is nothing compared to the bombings of Iraq and Afghanistan, which have killed multiple times more civilians than Usama supposedly did. Im not saying that Canada is perfect, or that America is wrought with scummy assholes. We are practicly the same except for a few differences, the main one being that Canada doesnt have a bullshit war on its bloodstained hands and that Canada doesnt have some peice of fascistic shit like the PATRIOT act. Our Tax money doesnt go to Terrorist organizations (like Mossad and the IDF) as much as your tax dollars do. Aside from that governmental bullshit, what seperates Canadians from Americans? we spell colour with a u.

 

Canada institutued Martial Law (which is 1000 times more restrictive) over the terrorist murder of just ONE diplomat.
The temporary Patriot Act is pretty weak compared to what most nations enact for War Measures.
(btw.. in case you didnt notice, Canada did not have MASSIVE attacks on its soil, including blowing up the front of Parliament and dropping the CN Tower into the downtown core).

Like I said - if you condone the 911 murderers then you are a great big huge asshole with a severe 'moral relevancy' problem.
You remind me of those scumbags in the PLO that figure as long as Israelis accidently hit a civilian WHILE intending to stop a Sniper.... then.. 'Therefore' .. this makes it permissable to blow a nail through a Babies head in a Pizza shop.

The fact my last sentence has 'stumped you' or you need to keep trying to think it through only proves my point.

You are sitting here trying to tell me that there is a justification or a 'mitigating factor' in the murder of that planeload of civilians.
Answer this?

 

I dont condone the 9/11 murderers....I just have my own theories of who they are. it is too soon to tell who they are, so ask me in 100 years and dont say anything like it is a solid fact until after this has passed into the pages of history. hey, look up a girl named Iman Al Hams then tell me how great your fucking israeli's are. you tell me that there is justification for the bombing of baghdad, which has killed far more innocent people than 9/11 or Hamas, or any of that terrorism, yet you ignore military terrorism. The war in Iraq is far worse than 9/11, and frankly, if you support the killings of innocent Iraqis, you are an asshole.

 

And change your bloody pic, your opinions fall right into the hands of the illuminati or whatever the powers to be are.

 

Why are you asking me about Iman Al Hams?
Is it because you think that allows for one 'free' murder of an Israeli child?
Id like your honest straightforward answer?

 

Iman Al Hams is just one example of the Israeli terrorism, and it certainly does not allow for the killing of an Israeli child. But what it does justify is an active Palestinian resistance. I support the Intifada just as I would have supported the same thing at home (standoff at Oka) had I been old enough to do so. The difference is that Palestine is far smaller than Canada, and its natives are treated far more harshly than ours. I do not believe in total war under any circumstances, just to make myself clear, and I condemn acts of terrorism, be the culprit an Arab or a Jew, however, if you look at the statistics (offered by the IDF itself, so it is probably downplayed, but even here it is astounding) since that fat bastard waltzed into Al-Aqsa, something like 500 Israeli's and 1500 Palestinians have died, this being a civilian number. Being as it is an IDF statistic, one would expect to see a higher number of Palestinian dead in reality. The point of the example of Iman Al Hams is this. If a Palestinian blows himself and one innocent Israeli up, its all over the news, but can you seriously tell me that you heard of Iman Al Hams when she was murdered (and her murderer got off scott free)? Iman is one example out of thousands, but then again, people in this part of the world dont seem to care too much when an arab is dusted off. when it is somebody more priviliged however...

http://www.stop-us-military-aid-to-israel.net/

If you want to see the faces of Palestinian "militants", view the images, but be forewarned, only a sick bastard would look at these pictures without being met with disgust and depression.

 

Fact: Iman Alhams is a terrible mistake made with the intention of stopping a potential murderer.
Dont ask me to argue about what a stupid idiot this soldier was because he did this AGAINST HIS COMMANDERS ORDERS!
Read that again - ISRAELI COMMAND TOLD HIM NOT>> NOT>> to take out the suspect!
Cant overemphasise the difference between this case where a child accidently walks into a death-zone, is then taken out by an obviously overzealous Soldier who acts OUTSIDE and AGAINST Israel and is then condemned by Israel.
Obviously a tragedy.
Compare that to - PLO BabyKillers who deliberately INTEND to blow nails and fire through the heads of children, woman and men.
On purpose.
For the purpose of blowing their faces off and causing terror to their families and friends.

btw.. 'armed resistance'?
STupid!
The reason they are standing at that checkpoint ready to shoot anyone crossing IS BECAUSE OF THE ARMED RESISTANCE.
They are afraid of a Palestinian coming to blow them up.. so they shoot people who show up out of nowhere in a restricted zone.

What Natives?
Palestinians are not native to the West Bank and Gaza.
They are Jordanian and of other Arab lands.

Native are not treated harshly in Canada. Natives are treated very well actually.
Have no idea why would compare them to Palestinians who are not native to Israel anymore than most Jews are not 'Native' to that land either.
(well at least they can argue they all 'originally' stemmed from there 2,000 years ago).
Even still.. 'Palestinians' as they are now called are immigrants from other lands just like Jews.

 

The Palestinians were there before the zionist movement started in the late 19th century, indeed the palestinians were there for many centuries, thus making them natives compared to the Jews who started to move there after the zionist movement chose palestine as the intended target of the jewish homeland. They are not Jordanian, and one reason people mistake them is because Jordan is filled with Palestinians who were systematically forced from Palestine, and there was something of a cultural shift over the past 50 years, but the Jordanians are no more Palestinians than New Zealanders are Austrailians (enough ignorant people confuse those two as well). and how dare you call the murder of Iman al Hams a 'mistake'. The soldier (who I will remind you went unpunished) stood over her dying body, set his gun to fully automatic and emptied a clip into her body......he didnt make a mistake, the bastard knew exactly what he was doing. ant that happens all the time in the area, I have friends who witnessed brutal Israeli crimes on innocent civilians on a weekly basis, few of which made it to the news, barely any made it to western news. Natives are treated very harshly in canada, have you ever heard of a thing called residential shools? even today they comprise the poorest ethnic group in this nation and it makes me ashamed to be "canadian". Palestinians claim lineage from various ethnicities (in that land, homogenous blood is a near impossibility), one of them being the Canaanites, who were in the region before Abraham and his Jews came over from Iraq. I cant believe you called Iman a "suspect". she was a 13 year old girl walking home from school, the problem was she was a Palestinian. tell me, if he acted against Israels whims, why did they not charge him? origionally they were about to get him on misusing his weapon (kind of a slap on the wrist, wouldnt you say? or is lynching just misuse of knot tying skills learned at boyscouts), but when the media heat died down on that case, even those charges were dropped. by the way, the PLO doesnt have suicide bombers under its command, and that is a common assumption made by ignorant westerners, so please, get your facts from somewhere other than FOX news before you reply to this post, and dont speak about things which you can hardly guess at (like the treatment of Natives in Canada....what do you know about that? I am a native studies student at a canadian university, so dont think for a second that I will buy your uninformed bullshit)

 

Stop using Imans dead body and murder like it was some sort of glorious gift you received to now wave and throw at people as if it were an object for you to shake blood on Israelis.
YOU are telling ME it was a mistake and so does EVERYONE including Israelis totally agree this was a terrible UNACCEPTABLE event.

This is NOT the same as some PLO Murdered DELIBERATELY MURDERING A BABY and not only that but everyone CONDONES IT by paying his family money and saying "well look what they did to Imam?"
Sickos.

Just to demonstrate the sheer lying evil hypocrisy of these types - they DECRY Imams death like it was THE SINGLE WORST CHILD TORTURE AND DEATH IN THE HISTORY OF THE PLANET... (which it is) but do you see ANY outcry, anger and horror over Israeli kids being slaughtered DELIBERATELY and not by just one crazed wacko.. but as a way of strategy and with organised effort.
Shameful.

btw.. No, Palestianians are NOT natives.
You can try and dodge this but if you really want to start turning this around to a handful of Jordanians who once lived around this area... then I can just as easily point out that historically, the very word 'Palestinian' refers to the left-over remnant of JEWS WHO NEVER LEFT.

Realistically.. neither of those groups make up even a tiny fraction of what is now Israels population OR the immigrant labourers from all over Arabia who now call themselves 'Palestinians'.

Yes, there are now becoming second and even third generations who are now born IN Israel and now we are calling them 'Palestinian'.
Same for Jews born there too.
Still.. the very way to point this out to people is to simply notice how just about every 'Palestinian' has a Cousin and family 'back in Jordan'.

Incidently, the fact that you ARE a student in 'Native Studies' at a University absolutely CONFIRMS for me you are now full of total WRONGLY-INformed first-class Bullshit.
It will take decades of real life before you are deprogrammed from that bullshit.
Between you and me - One of us has lived on a horrible Rez (like half of them) and I guaran-fuckin-tee you its NOT 'white people' making them like that.
Not at all.
About 2 months for the average University trained 'Native Studies' social worker to go through the shock and awe of realising they were armed with bullshit and about another month before they become more bitter, jaded and cynical than anyone you ever met after that.

 

ok......this solves it, you are an idiot and you have no idea of what your talking about. have you ever even met a Palestinian, or are they just the scary people in the news for you? You have no clue about the history of Native people in my country and how their culture was systematically stolen from them after white people decided that they were in some way human and decided not to wipe them all out (as the Spaniards considered early on, causing one of the most massive genocides in human history). If you say there is no such thing as a Palestinian, firstly, you are wrong, there were Palestinians way back in the Byzantine days, but for the most part they belonged to a greater Arab nation (which no longer exists). to make a comparison, suppose the United States broke down, there would be such a thing as the New English people or the Texan culture. sure, the Palestinian and Jordanian cultures may be connected by language, customs, and religion, but so are Canada and America, and Canadians are not Americans, so dont give me that ignorant bullshit. Secondly, what are the Israeli people? that nationality was pretty much manufactured overnight in 1948, so if the Palestinians dont exist as a nation as you say, what makes the Israeli's a legitimate culture? Im not saying that their not, I'm just using the logic that you used to disclaim the Palestinians. It will take decades to remove your right-wing FOX news propaganda from you poor little brainwashed mind, until then, go find a job at Wal-Mart and shut up about things you can hardly guess at. Also, try finding a more conservative forum to post your lies at, Im sure those ignorant bastards would be more receptive to your bullshit.

 

Immortal Technique- The fourth branch

The voice of racism preaching the gospel is devilish
A fake church called the prophet Muhammad a terrorist
Forgetting God is not a religion, but a spiritual bond
And Jesus is the most quoted prophet in the Qu'ran
They bombed innocent people, tryin' to murder Saddam
When you gave him those chemical weapons to go to war with Iran
This is the information that they hold back from Peter Jennings
Cause Condoleeza Rice is just a new age Sally Hemmings
I break it down with critical language and spiritual anguish
The Judas I hang with, the guilt of betraying Christ
You murdered and stole his religion, and painting him white
Translated in psychologically tainted philosophy
Conservative political right wing, ideology
Glued together sloppily, the blasphemy of a nation
Got my back to the wall, cause I'm facin' assassination
Guantanamo Bay, federal incarceration
How could this be, the land of the free, home of the brave?
Indigenous holocaust, and the home of the slaves
Corporate America, dancin' offbeat to the rhythm
You really think this country, never sponsored terrorism?
Human rights violations, we continue the saga
El Savador and the contras in Nicaragua
And on top of that, you still wanna take me to prison
Just cause I won't trade humanity for patriotism

[Hook]
It's like MK-ULTRA, controlling your brain
Suggestive thinking, causing your perspective to change
They wanna rearrange the whole point of view of the ghetto
The fourth branch of the government, want us to settle
A bandana full of glittering, generality
Fighting for freedom and fighting terror, but what's reality?
Read about the history of the place that we live in
And stop letting corporate news tell lies to your children

[Verse 2]
Flow like the blood of Abraham through the Jews and the Arabs
Broken apart like a woman's heart, abused in a marriage
The brink of holy war, bottled up, like a miscarriage
Embedded correspondents don't tell the source of the tension
And they refuse to even mention, European intervention
Or the massacres in Jenin, the innocent screams
U.S. manufactured missles, and M-16's
Weapon contracts and corrupted American dreams
Media censorship, blocking out the video screens
A continent of oil kingdoms, bought for a bargain
Democracy is just a word, when the people are starvin'
The average citizen, made to be, blind to the reason
A desert full of genocide, where the bodies are freezin'
And the world doesn't believe that you fightin' for freedom
Cause you fucked the Middle East, and gave birth to a demon
It's open season with the CIA, bugging my crib
Trapped in a ghetto region like a Palestinian kid
Where nobody gives a fuck whether you die or you live
I'm tryin' to give the truth, and I know the price is my life
But when I'm gone they'll sing a song about Immortal Technique
Who beheaded the President, and the princes and sheiks
You don't give a fuck about us, I can see through your facade
Like a fallen angel standing in the presence of God
Bitch niggaz scared of the truth, when it looks at you hard

[Hook]
It's like MK-ULTRA, controlling your brain
Suggestive thinking, causing your perspective to change
They wanna rearrange the whole point of view in the ghetto
The fourth branch of the government, want us to settle
A bandana full of glittering, generality
Fighting for freedom and fighting terror, but what's reality?
Martial law is coming soon to the hood, to kill you
While you hanging your flag out your project window

[Talking]
Yeah..
The fourth branch of the government AKA the media
Seems to now have a retirement plan for ex-military officials
As if their opinion was at all unbiased
A machine shouldn't speak for men
So shut the fuck up you mindless drone!
And you know it's serious
When these same media outfits are spending millions of dollars on a PR campaign
To try to convince you they're fair and balanced
When they're some of the most ignorant, and racist people
Giving that type of mentality a safe haven
We act like we share in the spoils of war that they do
We die in wars, we don't get the contracts to make money off 'em afterwards!
We don't get weapons contracts, nigga!
We don't get cheap labor for our companies, nigga!
We are cheap labor, nigga!
Turn off the news and read, nigga!
Read... read... read...

 

I know exactly what Im talking about.
Palestine is not the name of a country or a nation or any sort of 'people'.
Palestine is a 'Region' and the borders and names of that region have changed and interchanged countless times even then!

Now you are being ridiculous and refering to the Byzantine Empire Era and talking about how there were people who lived there who yes.. were 'part of the Arab family'... and since modern day Arabs call themselves 'Palestinians' well then.....

Gimme a break LOL!

If you want to get down to that desperate rationalisation then Europeans can call themselves Palestinians and demand their 'native homeland' back lol.
Romans
Italians
British are native Palestinians.

Come on!?

Actually if you want to dive into history then find out for yourself that the people who long ago were called 'Palestinians' refered to the left-over JEWS in the region who were called 'Palestinian Jews'.

Dont even bother trying to bullshit me Ewok because I know you are just furious that I am well aware that almost ALL of the 'Palestianians' (as we just started calling them) are actually JORDANIAN and ARAB immigrant labourers.
By far that is ALL OF THEM!
Of course, many are now second and third generation born-in-Israel and NOW we are dubbing them 'Palestinians'.
No different than how many Israelis are now second and third generation born-in-Israel.
They ALL have the total right to be living there but the only difference is that Israel is a real, legitimate, recognised and instituted Nation.
'Palestine' is NOT a 'nation' or anything like that. There is no such thing as a 'Palestine' as any 'actual' country, nation, land or Entity.

What can I tell you - the sooner you start coming clean and being honest - the sooner you will see the rest of the world take your side on this.
Many of us would even WANT to take the side of Palestinians but wont as long as the murders, corruption and non-stop lies and 'playing victim' crap ends.

Think about that.

 

Yes, because as we all know, Palestine was uninhabited before the Jews came in 1948, God himself left it empty for his chosen people to return to.


Palestinians have lived in Palestine for a good deal longer than any other ethnic group, and yes, they are just that. They have their own accents, their own styles of music, their own cuisine, their own history, et cetera. Where do you get your information? because I get mine from my many friends who come from the region, as well as books on the subject by both Arab and Western Historians/Social Comentators. There is a nation of Palestine, and it is recognized by well over half of the worlds nations, despite the fact that it is terribly unorganized, but hey, so was the true government of France in 1943, so some understanding is needed of their plight. I'll bet that your one of the people who consider West Bank and Gaza to be Israeli property, which is both sad and pathetic. why do you support occupation? just because of some incidents of murder commited by the extreme fringes of Palestinian society? even then, the murder commited by Palestinians against innocent Isreali's (which i as well as most Palestinians condemn) fades in comparison to the systematic slaughter and oppression of the Palestinian people. My friend who was born in a shitty refugee camp in Gaza (his family used to own a rather large farm in what is now "the state of israel") has seen first hand the brutality of Israeli occupation......this includes near weekly death of children....not accidents mind you, but targetted murder, the proof being in the bullit holes were located in between the eyes, quite a hard random shot to make. But if you would like to delude yourself, sure, Palestine was uninhabbited but for a few left-over jews (many of whom actually converted to Islam and became arabized, so there is a jewish strain in Palestinian blood) and the state of Israel was founded on an empty land.



What makes a nationality? you say that the term Palestinian only goes back a few generations (which i dispute, but for the sake of arguement i will go with), so whatabout the Israeli's? that only goes back to 1948. Indeed, that nationality is just the smattering together of jews of various different cultures and ethnicities....it is a manufactured nationality. what gives them the right to be a nationality and denies the right for the palestinians to be a people? by the way, you said i was a university student with such hostility to that fact, am i to assume that i am talking to some uneducated ignoramous who is just spitting out what he heard geraldo reverra say on the television box?

 

"And certainly We have explained in this Quran every kind of example, and man is most of all given to contention" ....18:54

 

What does the Qur'an sound like in Arabic? because i have 2 English "meanings of the Qur'an" and I hear that any translation is terrible compared to its awesome true form.