Whats your position on flag burning?

Just the fact that people are so dead set against it...that right there is reason enough to burn it. There's nothing that should keep you apart from another person, but you're saying there is. It's almost like you're saying "That flag is me." I burn the flag, I burn you.

You could have been born anywhere. You think Norwegians are going to care as much if I burn an American flag? Probably not...I don't know...

What's hypocritical is to talk about peace and then be so willing to show such hostility. I can't even imagine why I would get pissed off if someone burned a flag. That's not me, and that's not the whole of them. It has nothing to do with anything!

And I wouldn't burn a flag, just 'cause I wouldn't want the complications. But if someone is trying to bring something up, bully for them! I'll talk to them about it. I won't get pissed off and lose my mind and start ranting and raving about the flag. Unless we were discussing the flag 'cause the issue is banning flag burning...

 

It's a free country, I should be able to burn whatever the fuck I want.

 

fully agreed.

 

But what if they scream?

 

Upwind

 

You don't get the point, it's not about what the flag matters to you, it's the knowledge of what it means to other people. It's one of those it's not always about you moments.

 

A powerful symbolic protest. Burn it and move on to getting the real work done. Or, watch it burn and move on to getting the real work done. Regardless of where you fall politically, the rational mind recognizes the flag as a symbol and burning of the flag as a powerful symbolic protest.

Then it moves on to what is really important.

 

Tell me I can burn the flag, and I won't.
Tell me I can't burn it, I just might.
Don't fuck with my freedom.

 

you can continue to post in this forum

you can't kill yourself [it's illegal]

[be careful]

 

I served as soon as I turned 17, and I will say that I had a drastic world view change. Back then I would have tried to do anything possible to stop such a thing as burning the flag. Now after everything Ive been through I could care less....In a simple statement I love my country but can't stand my government. I can see why someone would want to burn it out of protest.

 

Well, I remember (guess my age, haha) when flag-burning became a pretty popular form of protest during the hippie and anti-war movement (yes, I'm an 'old'? hippie, but I never burned the flag.) I kind of fall in the middle between those who don't get all teary-eyed over seeing Old Glory wave, and those who wouldn't burn it either (although I think people that want to should have the freedom to).

Having said that, I became very unpatriotic, especially in the last decade or so, and left the US-I voted with my feet, and probably will never come back, and if I do, it will only be for a visit. If everyone that is dissatisfied enough with the US to burn the flag (or not, even) would vote with their feet and move somewhere else, it would be interesting to see what the makeup of the country would look like.

 

Vote with your feet my ass, some of us can't afford to leave the country even if we wanted to. Please wipe the smug off your unpatriotic ass...

ZW

 

I never understood people voting with their feet, this is the US, not Nepal, where are these paradises that are so much better than the US that it's worth moving to a different country for. Now moving just because you want to experience living in a different country and culture is a whole different story.

Besides, you're supposed to work to make your country better, not abandon ship when something doesn't go your way.

 

Agreed.

Patriotism to me is about allegiance to people and place, not nation and state.

ZW

 

*In comes obligatory comments about how you shouldn't make any connections to just the people of your country. Ignores fact of human nature that you can care about people in other countries while holding a special place for your own country's people since it's the people you grew up with, who you help and who help you everyday, who share the same customs and everyday work together to make our town, state, country, a better place and this leads to a stronger bond since a country basically is one giant extended family*

Alright so whoever was going to come in and say that there's no need, I got it covered.

 

I was working and protesting to make the US a better place a long time before a lot of you guys were born. I finally just got fed up, for a lot of reasons. I also came to realize that we don't really have that much control over what happens in the US, regardless of how much we may care or work for change.

The US is no utopia-it has the highest percentage of people incarcerated than any other country on the planet-the only other country that ever had more (by percentage) in jail was Stalin's Soviet Union. Most of the people that are in jail are there for trivial offenses (drug charges, family matters) that most countries wouldn't even arrest people for-and the situation ain't getting any better.

The standard of living where I am isn't nearly as high as it is in the US, but I have a hell of a lot more personal freedom. So, it's a trade-off.

 

Perhaps you should give us a few examples, Bob.
Also, can you participate in local government?


ZW

 

Uh...come again?

 

I can give you a lot of examples:

No drug tests for employment or to keep your job
No cops in schools searching students and their belongings
Very little interference by the government in family matters
An innate suspicion among the population of the police and excessive authority
A tendency in the government to solve problems in other ways than incarcerating people
A hell of a lot fewer laws in general


Sure I can participate in local government. The rate of voting here is a lot higher than in the US. But I don't hold any illusions that voting does that much good. The elites aren't going to concede that much power to the people here or anywhere else

And I hope you're not under the illusion that the US is somehow the 'freest country on earth' or the only true democracy.

 

This doesn't come from the government, it comes from insurance company policy

Wife beating and child abuse pretty well tolerated hmm?

None of that here...

Here it's called "probation"


This may not be the freest country in the world, but fuck it, all my friends are here! :biggrin:


ZW