Vegetarians - would you eat meat if it did not entail killing?

What on earth gave you that idea? :ears:

 

common sense and basic high shool biology

 

Wha? Wait so what criteria do you need to suffer?

The article basically notes that eating too much meat can be bad for you, big whoop. Too much of anything is bad for you.

 

i think in order to suffer you need to have some sort of consciousness. i suppose i could be wrong and there could be other forms of suffering. but i find it hard to empathize with a plant.

 

Bingo! The folly of all us when comes to understanding the suffering of others, plants in this case.

 

By the same token, just because you think it must be suffering doesn't mean it is. The fact is: You don't know, either way.

The preying mantis...I dunno. I would expect suffering in that case...but do I know? Huh-uh.

 

All living things feed on other living things, period.

Vegetarians are free to decide not to eat meat. That doesn't make meat-eaters unnatural or inhumane, and the fact that the human body can handle meat doesn't mean vegetarians should start eating meat.

I'm not sure I understand the plant vs meat argument...either way, we have to eat one or the other to survive.

and either way, I wouldn't touch lab-grown meat with a ten foot pole

 

Bonkai,

You should never eat more than twelve ounces of meat per day, that is, if you believe you must. If you do eat more than that, you are eating too much for the reasons listed in the link I provided.

How many vegetables would you have to eat before it is a harmful to your system? You can eat enough vegetables to live on without harming your system. Not so with meat! Go ahead and try it; prove it to yourself.


But that wasn't what I asked you. I asked you why you would utilize something as acid-producing and as expensive as meat when there's something else that doesn't have a negative effect on the body. The protein debate is a non-issue, by the way.

 

stem cells can be used to make any human body part.. so,, theoretically penis and vagina burgers. whos gonna eat that?..

ok, Ill have a vagina burger.. hold the mayo.

 

Cuz meat is yummers.

Okay, if they can grow a hairless one, fine. I'm not shaving my meal before I eat it.

 

In my day, we called it a Fur-burger with thighs on the side. But I digress . . .

 

Plants show signs of suffering....dude this is all on my first post plz if you mind, take a gander at it. I hate repeating myself.

The majority of plant life live off sunlight, water and soil or non-living things.

I totally agree. I wasn't arguing that vegetarians should eat meat, rather that they should recognized the life that they take no matter if it has a face or not.

Wuss! J/k :mickey:

Whoa! 12 oz sounds like a high limit, most studies say no more than 6-7 oz a day.

So you're suggesting that any amount of meat you eat is harmful to your system?! Please tell me you aren't serious

Red meat also supplies vitamin B12, which helps make DNA and keeps nerve and red blood cells healthy, and zinc, which keeps the immune system working properly.Not to mention iron and protein. Also pound for pound, you get more nutrients from meat than from plants - though plants give us everything else the body needs (except sunlight).

 

I'm on a fur-free diet.

 

Bonkai,

Animal protein tends to leach calcium from the bones, leading to its excretion in the urine. Animal proteins are high in sulfur-containing amino acids, especially cystine and methionine. Sulfur is converted to sulfate, which tends to acidify the blood. During the process of neutralizing this acid, bone dissolves into the bloodstream and filters through the kidneys into the urine. Meats and eggs contain two to five times more of these sulfur-containing amino acids than are found in plant foods.

http://www.makingpages.org/health/calcium.osteoporosis.html

Do you don't believe that meat is the only place to get you B-12, do you?

 

Years ago I read a book called The Secret Life of Plants. I'm familiar with the concept of plant responses to injury, both to themselves and to other nearby plants. However I'm still not convinced that this denotes "suffering" to the plant. Suffering implies some form of consciousness. Physiological responses by themselves do not imply consciousness.

But on this point I think we're probably going to continue to disagree. I think the main point you're driving at is that in order to eat, we need to terminate a life. In lots of cases that is true - however I think the earlier discussion about eating fruit shows that it ain't necessarily so in every case - and there's just no way I'm going to believe that fruit suffers when we eat it.

Not that it makes any difference to me. I'll probably continue to eat meat no matter what. My vegan daughter would probably not eat meat even if it were grown in a lab, no matter how much you reasoned with her about it.

 

"B12 is the only vitamin that is not recognised as being reliably supplied from a varied wholefood, plant-based diet with plenty of fruit and vegetables, together with exposure to sun."

http://www.vegansociety.com/lifestyle/nutrition/b12.aspx

The only way for a vegan to get vitamin B12 is to take supplements or eat vitamin-fortified foods. But yes, by doing that, eating meat is not required.

 

Slavery and genocide have been justified by the assertion that some kinds of people do not feel pain, do not feel love — are not truly human — in the same way as others. The same thinking has led to other practices less drastic but still appalling. For example, physicians once withheld anesthetics from infants during surgery because it was believed that these not-quite-yet-humans did not feel pain (smiles were gas, remember).

The differences that do seem to matter are things like the fact that plants don’t have nerves or brains. They cannot, we therefore conclude, feel pain. In other words, the differences that matter are those that prove that plants do not suffer as we do. Here the lack of a face on plants becomes important, too, faces being requisite to humans as proof not only that one is dealing with an actual individual being, but that it is an individual capable of suffering.

I could careless what people eat, but rather have them recognize that a life is a life, period (hence toward title of thread). Which is my general point, and which lowers anyone from their moral high ground. Though to save us from talking in circles furthermore, agreeing to disagree sounds like a good idea.

 

I have a plant enslaved in my cubicle. I like to think I treat it kindly though. I give it my leftover coffee. :2thumbsup: I would let it see its family on Christmas, but I would miss it too much, so it needs to stay with me always...

 

feed me seymour..

 

Zengi',

Do you think it's wise to be on a fur-free diet in light of the fact that hair is made of protein. Don't give it up.

__________________________________________________

Bonkai,

I haven't eaten any meat in many years. Nor do I take supplements. Here is something few people know about B-12:

___________________________________________________
Standard nutrition teaches that B12 is only present in animal products such as meat, eggs, and dairy. That none is found in veggies, fruits, seeds, nuts, sprouted legumes, or sprouted wheat.
Yet B12 is produced by bacteria that are SO widely prevalent in nature that many, or most, edible plants contain small amounts of B12. More importantly scientific evidence has proven our main source of B12 comes from our own bacteria called probiotics, or flora.
While it is true that animal products, especially beef liver, are great sources of vitamin B12, it is also true that fruits and veggies contain the vitamin. Some of the plants that B12 has been isolated in include:

* Bananas
* Greens
* Sunflower seeds
* Leeks
* Dates
* Sprouts
* Beets
* Green Beans
* Carrots
* Peas
* soybeans
* oats

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