Fear mongering was prevalent in the McCarthy era of the 1950s in the U.S. People promulgating this type of mentality today can be proud of themselves to be in the ranks of demagogues like McCarthy. If not vaccines, fluoride, and healthcare, people of the McCarthy mentality will use fear mongering to promote their fascist-flavored views with other talking points (chemtrails, HAARP, 9/11, soy, Catholic Church, Jews). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCarthyism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Unholy_three.png "One focus of popular McCarthyism concerned the provision of public health services, particularly vaccination, mental health care services and fluoridation, all of which were deemed by some to be communist plots to poison or brainwash the American people. At times, the anti-internationalist aspect of McCarthyist literature took on an anti-Jewish tone. (See flier at right: Rabbi Spitz in the American Hebrew, March 1, 1946: "American Jews must come to grips with our contemporary anti-Semites; we must fill our insane asylums with anti-Semitic lunatics.") Such viewpoints led to major collisions between McCarthyite radicals and supporters of public health programs, most notably in the case of the Alaska Mental Health Bill controversy of 1956.[39]"
then following that logic, the immunized have nothing to fear by the un-immunized. it's pretty clear that both played a part. “The questionable contribution of medical measures to the decline of mortality in the United States in the twentieth century“. McKinlay JB, McKinlay SM, Milbank Mem Fund Q Health Soc. 1977 Summer; 55(3): 405-28. http://www.columbia.edu/itc/hs/pubhealth/rosner/g8965/client_edit/readings/week_2/mckinlay.pdf “Symposium: Accomplishments in Child Nutrition during the 20th Century. Infant Mortality in the 20th Century, Dramatic but Uneven Progress” Myron E. Wegman School of Public Health, University of Michigan: J. Nutr. 131: 401S–408S, 2001. http://jn.nutrition.org/content/131/2/401S.full.pdf it's not all due to vaccines either. I don't have a need to credit vaccines; its just simple research. I just don't really understand how people can act like vaccines have no value. certainly you didn't direct that at me, i never said any such thing. so then would you agree it should be up to the individual and their family? depends on where you source your material. if it's only from the U.S. CDC, then it's apt to be as skewed as some conspiracy nut-jobs sources are.
This is what happens when herd immunity is compromised. Measles Outbreak Traces To Vaccine-Refusing Megachurch A measles outbreak in Texas traces to a congregation of a megachurch whose leader, Kenneth Copeland, reportedly has warned followers away from vaccines, advocating for faith healing and pushing the debunked notion that vaccines cause autism. One of Copeland’s churches, Eagle Mountain International Church in North Texas, is the epicenter of the outbreak, which now has hit at least 20 people
ya, that's the nature of disease for ya. i'm just not so sure about that story in as much as since when is measles something to be alarmed about? yes it does spread like wildfire. i got them along with most of my school mates. if i'm going to get a vaccine, or force one on my kid, it's going to be for something deadly, not for a hangnail. or measles, chicken pox or mumps. seriously? i wouldn't mind a vaccine for hanta virus or something deadly, but it seems like the majority of vaccines they push at kids are for the kinds of childhood illnesses that most kids get, get over, and have stronger immune systems as a result.
http://www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs286/en/ I actually agree with you somewhat, but I don't think measles is a good example. i think chickenpox is a pointless vaccine for the most part. in this particular example measles happens to be the disease in question. It could easily happen with a more debilitating or deadlier disease.
true, and glad you noted that point. ya, i wouldn't want to see a truly horrible disease run rampant. i do however like to think that individuals should be allowed to make a choice, based on science and not hysteria. i dig where you're coming from, and i'm not railing against vaccination in principle. there should be balance is all. and about your example, note the fine print : It's like AIDS, most (no one?) people that die after contracting AIDS die from related problems, not from the disease itself. The reason I laughed at measles is exactly what was said earlier... advances in sanitation, knowledge of germs and microbiology, and a modern health infrastructure have more to do with it than vaccines. Kids that have decent nutrition and health practices don't normally die of measles or chicken pox. the risk of death from measles usually comes from meningitis or encephalitis. And again, good health practices :
An example of cherry picking research results. http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2012/07/31/mercola-attacks-vaccinations-again/
For those who try to belittle HIV/AIDS by saying that one dies of the diseases as a result of HIV depressing the immune system, feel free to inject yourself with HIV. In your mind, it's not a big deal because you interpret the death as not being caused by HIV but rather something else. The same goes for the truther denialist leaders on the web like Duesberg and Mercola. Step up to the plate and show the faith you have in your claims by injecting yourself with HIV.
well, vaccines ARE part of a modern health care system, along with sanitation and medical expertise. but if a country is going to call itself free, people should have a choice, and not need a note from their priest or rabbi to be able to say no. who knows what else they put in with the swine flu vaccine to test on g.i.s, when i was in the airforce 45 years ago. i know a week after receiving them, every one in the unit came down with something.
How can one belittle a disease? He was just telling the truth. It's the compromised immune system as a result of the disease that kills people, AIDS itself doesn't really kill you (at least, I don't think so, I'm not an expert). That's not to say that people don't die as a result of HIV/AIDS.
That's how vaccines work. In the service when going overseas they hit you with a lot vaccines that you would normally not get in the states. Many vaccines cause immune system responses that will make you feel like absolute shit for a couple of days, that is your body doing what it's supposed to and developing anti-bodies to fight those particular invaders. When my brother went out on the JFK aircraft carrier to the Mediterranean in '77, he said about 4000 out of the 5000 crew were sick as fuck for the first week due to the vaccinations, but hey, that's better than getting the plague or something. :2thumbsup:
Actually in very many different infections/diseases it is the immune system response to the invaders that kills a person.
