Tongue Splitting

Id say thats true, although I've never personally seen anything saying reversing a split is safe. One thing to note is that BME has had many many authors over the years so its very likely for there to be a lot of contradictions. That will probaly only get worse now with Shannon not running it anymore.

As I said though.. You shouldn't be splitting your tongue if you have thoughts of possibly reversing it in the future. What spaced said is right; while the splitting is an improvement in many ways and opens up new possibilities to you that was previously impossible, you are still damaging your tongue and adding an extra more intense surgery to it afterward is obviously only going to damage it more.

Good post and all good points spaced. Cant deny anything just sit slightly further down the fence on my opinion. Although I agree with moth on the haircut example. Extreme as it is you can take all sorts of examples like that to throw back, although not necessary. And to be honest hair is dead isnt it? Could say the same for cutting your nails, getting soem dentistry, and dont forget plastic surgery. Im pretty sure liposuction damaged the body, yet ive never seen someone refer to it as mutilation. People do it to feel better about their body image (and also other reasons) and many people mutilate themselves in other ways such as piercing, cutting, tattoo, branding and so on. Then theres the ones which would be clear cut mutilation to most people, with people selfperforming or having professional amputations at will. Most people cant or are unwilling to try to understand how missing a hand can possibly improve your life. But to some people their body doesnt fit their psychological body image (like with transgenders also, mutilation?) and the only way to be truely happy is to make their body how is should be in their mind. Or then theirs "amputations for love?" Cool story below if you havent read it.. Rather than get married and wedding rings blah blah blah they bit/cut the top of each others ring fingers off.

 

To Mothman:

Getting a hair cut wouldn't fit in self mutilation, because hair is kind of like a train of dead cells, so you aren't raly harming yourself, it would be more comparable to a snake shedding it's skin, in a way (could be wrong on this one though, I do remember reading that somewhere). As for ear piercings and tatoos, since they are body mods, they are a form of self mutilation, you are putting a hole in your ear, and inking your skin with a needle. I'm not discussing subjective perspectives, acceptable or not, it's not my place to judge that. I'm just discussing terms and definitions.

To atropine:
I hadn't thought about plastic surgery as assisted self mutilation, but that makes sense. As for transgenders, I don't realy know, I don't see it as self mutilation, but I don't know much about the procedures. Also, what you say about losing a hand as an improvement interests me, care to explain?

 

Okay then, definitions it is.

You said self mutilation is "Self-injury (SI) or self-harm (SH) is deliberate injury inflicted by a person upon their own body without suicidal intent." and also "Getting a hair cut wouldn't fit in self mutilation, because hair is kind of like a train of dead cells"

Lots of animals have hair...dogs, cats, primates and so on and more often than not it serves the purpose of protecting them from the elements and even adjusting to the environment. Growing thicker in winter and shedding in the spring. It's a natural part og their bodies.
Human hair is still a part of your body and being made up of dead skin cells is irrelevant. Snakes leave their skin behind and human hair sheds gradually (this is so we can have kick ass dreads).

Ask the millions of people spending their money on hair replacement products if hair is just dead skin cells. I think they would tell you how they miss those dead cells because it was an important part of their body and their identity.

Those that did not inherit baldness would have to remove their hair unnaturally by mutilating it with a razor to be bald. Just because you don't feel pain doesn't mean your not injuring/damaging/ mutilating your hair by severing it

It would appear that the power of perception still finds its way in, even with definitions.

 

I'd say that hair being dead is very relevant. You can't get an infection by cutting your hair, you don't have nerves in your hair, your hair doesn't contract desieses (if it does, please tell me which, I've just never, ever heard of a hair disease), your hair doesn't serve a purpose other than aesthetics (I'm not saying aesthetics aren't great by the way, but it's not a biological function of our hair). If death was irrelevant when defining mutilation, then an autopsy would be a form of mutilation, and organ donations too. Saying that cutting your hair is equivalent to cutting your skin or a finger is like saying that breaking a nail is equivalent to breaking a bone. Also, if cutting your hair is equivalent to severing a part of your body, then why isn't called an amputation?

Loving or being attached to something doesn't change it's nature. If I where to ask someone who spends their money on hair replacing treatment if his hair is made of dead cells, and he answered that it isn't, he would be wrong.

Well, we wouldn't be able to discuss this if it weren't for perception. What I meant when I said I was discussing terms wasn't that I was trying to be objective, because that's impossible, but rather that I was discussing the meaning of the terms, not my perception of the things we label wit such terms.
I just think that stating that my opinion as subjective is a bit dumb, since every opinion is subjective.
Also, If I don't make sense, please understand that jamaican weed doesn't help my rethoric very much.

 

Ill just grab this little bit. There is sooome use for hair. My example is eyebrows. People who shave off their eyebrows often find this out.. In a way they act like gutters or barriers for water. If youre in the rain youll actually quite often find your eyebrows redirect a lot of water thats trailing down your face away from your eyes. Interesting at least.

Forgot the link I mentioned about the finger biters. http://www.bmezine.com/news/pubring/20050401.html

And just a few quotes more on the amputation thing..
Many doctors are beginning to recognize the valid therapeutic value of amputation in a small number of cases. The desire for amputation can be similar to transsexualism, where the internal notion of self is not aligned with the external notion.
At first glance this may appear to be a deep psychiatric problem, but modern psychiatry is begin to recognize it as something more valid. To oversimplify, a person has an internal body image -- this body image may not include all the normal body parts. If not, they will not be happy until they line up this internal image with the real world. Nullification may be the answer in some of these cases.

I dont quite understand how transgender can be seen as non-mutilative when other mods are. Having your penis cut up and turned into a vagina or having your breasts cut off would be in the same boat as having your tongue cut in half I would think. Just that most transgender have heavier motivation to do it.

Also, since putting a hole in your body is mutilative, how about blood tests/injections? While very small, the needles still damage the skin, not to mention veins, and while probaly unnoticable in most the do generally create scar tissue. If not mutilative, would you say that play piercing isnt?

 

I hadn't thaught about that, I was thinking of the hair on your head, not your face, but you're right, still, because hair is dead, I don't think that cutting it could be considered as self mutilation.

Very interesting, although from what I read, this kind of amputation is practiced for reasons related to mental health and well-being, so I'd rather put it in the same groop than surgery and blood tests rather than self mutilation, since mods and self mutilation aren't done for health reasons , be it physical or mental health.

I'm not going to say anything about this, since I wouldn't realy know what I'm talking about, but what you say does sound logical.

Blood tests and injections are also done for health reasons, aren't they? As for recreational drug related injections, they could be considered a form of self mutilation, if you define it as a deliberate injury inflicted by a person upon their own body without suicidal intent.

 

@Spaced...You said "I'm not discussing subjective perspectives, acceptable or not, it's not my place to judge that. I'm just discussing terms and definitions." and again "self mutilation is "Self-injury (SI) or self-harm (SH) is deliberate injury inflicted by a person upon their own body without suicidal intent."

It seems that you want it both ways. If you want to stick to definitions then you must concede that hair is a part of your body and that the definition you presented does not mention whether the cells of a particular body part must be living or have nerve endings thus making any such references to those facts irrelevant, at least if were are adhering to the definition. Any attempt to step outside of that by rationalizing the purpose (or lack there of) of a body part brings us back to the realm of perception and perspective.

If the question is: Can cutting off a part or parts of your body be considered mutilation? and you answer yes to this because you are following the definition of mutilation then you can not exclude your hair which is clearly a part of your body and still be within the bounds of the definition you have given.

I think the term self mutilation was initially used because of its potency and how it related to that posters stance on tongue splitting. I just wanted to let some of the air out of it by showing how it could apply to something most people think to be trivial. Perhaps I would gasp at the thought of someone cutting their own sacred hair and wonder to myself if they read about what happened to poor Samson as a result of cutting his locks? But I think I've beat on this horse long enough.

Lastly the Jamaican herb you mentioned is not having any negative affects on your ability to communicate clearly. Perhaps you, Atropine and I will one day have the opportunity to mutilate some brain cells with some of that Jamaican bud.

 

Many other mods are health related just as amputation. If cutting off a hand to suit your bodyimage and make yourself happy can be grouped with surgical then why cant the other mods? Many people do them just for an image or to look cool but many just dont feel right without them. Or even they just feel so much happier with their own image for having them. I was very selfconscious and felt like the uggliest person in the world, but once i started with particular modifications it has extremely increased my confidence and opinion on my own image. To remove them would, to a smaller degree probaly, decrease my opinion on my image and make me sadder about myself. So in that sense I would definately say that modifications are often done to help a person mentally. Whether it be surgery, amputation, or just a small plain piercing.

2.
Just a random thought, what about removing a small amount of blood yourself? For a halloween party we took some with a syringe for a friends costume.. Mutilative? I really dont have much thoughts on this myself actually.

 

this is kinda old but w.e.
i dont know any one who had their tongue split on purpose, however i do know from experience that it hurts like a son of a bitch lol. i was a youngn and i ended up biting my tongue and it split straight up the middle almost to the back of my tongue. i ended up getting 7 stitches it was horrible idk y ne1 would deliberately want it done. the day after i had to be rushed back to the hospital because my tongue swelled up and blocked my airway. so all im sayin is that u need to be really really really careful man it aint gonna be no picnic. best of luck though

 

Id really like an explanation on how someone possibly bites straight up the middle to close to the back of their tongue. Force not being a factor, I'd love to see how someone warps their tongue to be able to get the middle along their teeth, especially as far back as you describe.

And considering I do know a few people who have gone through with the bifurication, I can say that the general consensus is its only slightly worse than a tongue piercing as far as healing. The swelling is a bit worse, but as with the piercings it is not much more than a minor inconvenience for a week or slightly longer dependant on your body.

 

haha id really like to know too. the doctors couldn't explain how it split right up the middle. i jumped down through a jungle gym and hit my chin on the bar and ended up biting my tongue. it was horrible

 

I am guessing it was around the age(4 to 8) when baby teeth were being replaced by adult teeth ?- thats would explain - if say you were missing some teeth and one adult tooth cut your tounge as you were jumping- but OUCH holy cow.