This is the Healthcare Reform that many of you hate?

I never said that. If people think voting is effective, then by all means vote. I, however, choose to exercise my right not to vote.

And again, the corporations already set the standards. They are already in the pockets of both political parties and the politicians, which they essentially own. Whether it's George Bush, Barack Obama or Tiny Tim, these people are all bought and paid for by corporate interests. Voting Democrat and Republican is simply the choice between Corporate Party A and Corporate Party B. The only differences are superficial at best. That's why many of the biggest corporations funnel money into both parties simultaneously.

 

So the elites aren't flocking to the US for our superior care? Amazing??? They are going to another socialized medical system? Who would have thought!

 

Thing is there are terms of service. And we do have a choice during that term if we choose to vote. That's more than monarchies have a choice between.

Corporations only have control as long as they have money. The people buy the goods and elect the politicians. We do have a lot of power. We only need to exercise it and stop being told our vote doesn't count. It does or they wouldn't spend so much on elections.

 

LOL!!!

Yeah, the only thing they can't steal is your right to vote for one of their hand-picked puppets. I think that's what you meant.

 

But back on track we are talking about health care. Why shouldn't everyone have access to care when they are sick?

 

No what I meant is we should demand national health care or vote out of office all those that stand against it.

It may take more than one election, but if we stand firm and vote we can accompli8sh that.

 

They spend so much money on elections because they know it's important to maintain the illusion that the people have a say under THEIR system. The minute people catch on and realize voting is a sham is when these elites know they're in trouble. Voting is simply the convenient way of avoiding a revolution every four years. If people knew the system was rigged, THEN there might be hope for some real change because people would stop turning to the same turncoats over and over to save them.

 

They don't spend money on illusions. Our votes count. And that's something you are unwilling to admit. Corporations don't spend millions/billions on swaying votes because they don't count.

 

As deeply flawed as the current system is, people still have greater access now than they would under Obama's proposed system. Have you ever read some of the stuff that Ezekiel Emanuel -- Rahm Emanuel's brother -- has said? He is at the head of Obama's health care panel. He admits care would be rationed to people who are elderly and/or terminally ill.

 

What's money to the bankers? They're the ones who print it out of nothing. It's always the people who are left holding the bag.

 

Watch this, Gardener:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCYfWrg4WKY

 

You are really desperate aren't you rat. Care rationed. Hell it's rationed today. I haven't had a new pair of glasses in 15 years (and that only happened once in twenty years when I had some extra money due to a settlement for a work comp claim, that stretched our for five years) and I can't afford a dentist.

 

At least terminally ill people now have access to Medicare/Medicaid, which won't be the case under a strictly government run system (contrary to what some are arguing).

 

Did I elect Rahm No, can Obama fire him... yes. Am I worried about depopulation? No. I am more worried about paying for insurance and being denied or refused services for something I've already paid for? well yes I paid for something that denies me. Would I like to see reform. You betcha.

 

Medicare and Medicaid not government run systems? For most elderly and poor it's the only coverage they have. Under a national system we would all have at least this minimum of service no matter our age or income. And since they are both government run programs why wouldn't they be available? We'd all know we have at least three days.

How is that evil? Please, tell me what programs will be available to the sick and destitute under a for profit plan? How much will the for profit industry charge us to protect the sick and elderly?

Probably as effective as deregulation of utilities in California and the profits Enron reaped there during their winter of huge profits. Privatization is always the answer to some, but it rarely holds up to oversight or scrutinization.

Or maybe we should look at how HMOs kept premiums down and supplied better health care...wasn't that what we were told they would do?

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ezekiel_J._Emanuel

 

Rat are you under the impression that with private medical insurance you have unlimited access to cost-is-no-object health care, and that you get to choose all your providers?

 

How have mandatory coverage, tobacco taxation and helmet laws for bicyclers and seat belts reduced your rates? Anyone? They've reduced the risk pools for insurance companies why haven't average citizens seen a return on their investment?

We allowed even voted for their regulation, but did anyone ever follow up and see any savings for the the citizens of this country?

 

i disagree except for the old---they keep them alive well past their due date --cas they get a check everymonth--for me and others like me its a waiting game but if u jump through their hoops--you get cared for-----not the greatest -cas all the want to do is get u out of hosp. asap---------i have buco bux in hospital billl----which is all covered bu the state---hospitalization-cat scans-ultrasounds-mri's PT allmy meds free--specialiste--and nonformulary drugs waitimg on cane and back brace not to mention monthly DR visits and montly lab work---yeah im poor--its the young and taxpayers pAYIN FOR ALL MY SHIT---JUST TRUTH---ITS THE WAY IT IS----IF YOU HAVE MONEY YOUR FUCKED

 

Isn't that what most for profit systems are based on? Except for the part about saving the most lives? Not sure they even consider that. Their bottom line is provide bonuses for their executives first, dividends to their stockholdes, consider the needs of their subscribers last if at all.