The Cost Of Enjoyment.

If there is a God or you have faith in a God, whatever the doubts, is it sinful to enjoy what you have if you are well provided for, or could it be said that not to enjoy what God has provided for us is a greater sin?

I have a guilt complex because relatively speaking I live a life of luxury compared to many across the globe.

But suffering this doesn't help me or anyone else.

I want a life of continuous enjoyment, as I lean into my senescence. At 46 I have some way to go, but I want to set course now.

Does this make me a bad Christian?

 

I'm not a Christian so maybe not the perspective you're looking for, I used to be a Christian so i've thought about this from a Christian and non Christian perspective

But I've always disliked the idea that one is well provided for or "blessed," it kind of insinuates God favors some over others.

I dont think there is anything inherently wrong with enjoying the material comforts in life, as long as one realizes they have them because they live in a society of freedom and opportunity and hope and wealth, and not because God decided to give one person a Mcmansion, a boat, and a second vacation home, and gave another person endless hunger and worms in their belly.

 

Not at all..

If you have worked hard to get where you are, then why shouldn't you enjoy. Reap the benefits, it's why you do what you do..

I've always said, if you get that lucky break

Or your clever at something. And make use of it.. no god will say that's wrong.

What's wrong is if you rub it in people's faces, if you can give a little to something, then it helps your conscience too..

 

I don't believe that I am blessed or God has chosen me, or that I have special purpose. I think my current state of provision is largely random, and also something I have worked for.

I have spent a large portion of my life suffering, and I just cannot continue in that way anymore.

 

I mean God has provided for me but through random ends, for no apparent purpose save for some kind of ordered yet meaningless unravelling.

 

I wasn't trying to insinuate you felt that way, just speaking generally. My mind just kind of took off in that direction, apologies.

I don't see anything wrong with an ordinary person enjoying the things they've worked for. And if you dont prepare for your retirement you'll just end up being a burden on others anyways.

If you really feel guilty you could always dedicate some of your time towards helping out a cause of some sort.

 

Why would you ever think that your God wouldn't want you to enjoy life?

I never got this, I gotta admit. All that guilt trip shit that so many Christians seem to love.

Part of the reason I left the Catholic Church way back in my mid-teens.

So...now I am a card-carrying atheist. And, philosophically, an Epicurean. Which is pretty much the direct opposite of a Christian who feels guilty for having a bit of luxury or fun or amenities or vice in their lives. LOL I am of the belief that life is waay too short not to live and enjoy to the fullest. This does not include unbridled hedonism, mind you. Or gluttony or sloth. And indeed, the Greek Epicureans didn't believe in that either. That is a common misconception regarding their ethos.

But, even if you believe in God and think Jesus dies for your sins and all that. What possible reason could God have for wanting you to be suffer or miserable? Nope. Sorry..that was an old control ploy of the early Catholic Church. And a way to get tithes and indulgences. If God is all-knowing and omniscient and you are living a good and productive life and enjoying it, then take that as a sign from him that He wants it that way!

I think that the one thing you need to make sure of..in order to please your God and not feel guilty, if that's your aim here, is to simply be thankful for what you have. Just thank Him for your good life and leave it at that. Fuck guilt! Life's too short to spend like that. It's absurd. It's the worst aspect of religion, I believe.

Hope this helps.

 

apparently you can sin all you want and do awful things

all you have to do is quickly repent before you croak and all is forgiven because it wasnt your fault ..it was the devil tempting you and you couldnt resist because youre human

great little saving grace they put there at the end

 

But that theology is only for Catholics.

If there WAS such a thing as an Omniscient and benevolent God, one who is intelligent enough to create and sustain the Known Universe, I would surely think that He would not let somebody off the hook for evil deeds just because they bellied-up to a confessional booth for a few minutes and admitted what they did to another flawed human. Even if said human IS an ordained priest.

This theology, btw, is one of the primary reasons I left the Catholic Church many years ago. Even by the time I was in my mid-teens I had seen what utter bullshit that was. And how it totally belittled what a real God would be like.

Cheers.

 

Nah I was raised as a (back row) Baptist and they believe that shit too

 

Ahh....I did not know that.

But, oh yeah, I get it. The Baptists don't have formal confessions to a priest (or pastor) like the Catholics, right? But they still think that you get a green light for just repenting?

LOL...religion. I'll tell ya.

Hence, my signature.

Cheers.

 

Yeah God makes it even easier for Baptists! All you have to do is accept Jesus into your sweet little heart and occasionally pray and ask for forgiveness for being an asshole.

 

Matt 19:21 "Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me."

You could be forgiven for thinking that is pretty much unequivocal. From a Christian point of view based on the NT.

Since I'm not a Christian though, I could be wrong in my interpretation. And it would depend I suppose on how rich you are.

 

I don't know what this excerpt is trying to say. It seems to be making the point that some early Christians and Puritans seemed to be down on fun. That would be a rather selective view that leaves out much of church devellopment from the fouth thru the fourteenth centuries.I wouldn't take it as a statement of modern Chrusitans about fun. and enjoyment..

 

I'd have to take issue with that to some extent. The roots of western classical music go back to church music and to monastic chant.

Some of the most beautiful and I think contemplative music ever written is sacred choral music. Palestrina, De Lassus, Victoria and other composers of the renaissance in particular..Later there are many sacred works by Bach, Mozart and many others.(which I personally like less but are still up there with the best) Although that was all in the past, once it was all new - at the leading edge of western culture.

Not to everybody's taste perhaps, but I don't think it can all be dismissed as without value. As an omnivorous listener to music, I find some of it very impressive. I don't think one has to be a paid up Christian to appreciate it. The Christian elements are obviously a big part of it, but for me it's about harmony, beauty. And it's evident that Christianity didn't stifle the creative genius of those composers. In fact it gave to them a form within which to work.

There are of course instances of anti-music and anti-art movements in Christianity. The early protestant iconoclasts, the puritans, and some in more recent times burning rock ' roll records and so on. But without the previous history of the development of polyphony and music in general in the context of church music, it's unlikely rock n' roll would ever have existed. And I imagine that an argument could be constructed to indicate that the anti- jazz, anti-rock n' roll thing had a large element of racism fuelling it.
We've had Christian rock music, even Christian rave music.

I have to agree though that Christianity isn't, or doesn't seem to me to be about 'fun'. To quote William Blake "there is nothing so pernicious as an excess of fun" - and just maybe there's something in that. But fun is OK in due measure.

 

Until a few months ago alcohol sales were illegal in my county, had been since the repeal of prohibition. When a petition to allow alcohol sales was circulated a few years ago a local Baptist church called out any of it's member that had signed it. They were given the choice of repenting in front of the congregation or being kicked out of the church.

 

Martin Luther himself asked "Why should the devil have all the good tunes?" and he wrote hymns like "A mighty Fortress". His statement was really a swipe at the papacy, which had a mountain of beautiful sacred music. Thanks to Luther, we have Bach.

 

It's hard to answer your question without knowing how "relatively" you are speaking. Are you filthy rich, just well off, or just making a go of it? Jesus and the early Christians, especially Saint James, were pretty extreme in condemning wealth and emphasizing the duty to care for the poor, widows and orphans. Of course, they were living under different circumstances, in the midst of real poverty and huge income gaps, had short life spans and expected the world to end in their lifetimes. At 46, I hope you've been planning for your retirement. If you have kids, are they going to, already in, or out of college? I think you have a responsibility to provide for yourself and your dependents so you don't become a burden on society. I also think you're entitled to enjoy life, and if you've earned your money fair and square, I don't think it's wrong to spend some of it on personal enjoyment, including an occasional luxury. That said, there's a long tradition in the Abrahamic religions of not being greedy and helping those in need. Christianity has the tithe concept (one-tenth of income); Islam has the zakat (2.5% of total wealth above a subsistence amount called the nisab). Those are simply rules of thumb; use your best judgment in light of your means and comfort zone. Jesus told us we can't serve both God and Mammon. Is materialism a problem for you? Pray on it, and let the Spirit guide you.

What bothers me about the way you phrase your question is that it sounds like:"I don't want to do this, but do I have to?". That may be something you need to work on. If we love God and neighbor. and see our neighbor in need, and have the means, why not help? It feels good, and it might even be tax deductible! And if keeping your stuff is causing you suffering from guilt, you might feel better getting rid of some of it. Do it positively, out of love and compassion, within your means. And be careful who you vote for. There's a political party out there that wants to do a Robin Hood in reverse by destroying Medicaid for the poor, elderly and infirm in order to provide more tax cuts for the very wealthy Americans. What would Jesus do?