The Bible

Discussion in 'Beat and Hippie Books' started by Bocks, Jul 25, 2010.

  1. Asmodean

    Asmodean Slo motion rider

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    Yes, I'm aware there are more gospels. There's one of Judas as well. And some other apocryphs. You have to keep in mind that old stuff always will change when a new religion is formed, it's normal. Old dogma's will be abandoned or assimilated to the suitings of those who shape what comes next. I also have my doubts with the decisions made in for instance the council of Nicaea but there wasn't a catholic church at that point. It formed out of those councils and developed later on to control the masses. So the leaving out of several books has not so much to do with that purpose at that point. It was mainly to create clarity I think.
     
  2. LetLovinTakeHold

    LetLovinTakeHold Cuz it will if you let it

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    A lot of the "lost gospels" we're dated long after the origonal bible was put together
     
  3. rjhangover

    rjhangover Senior Member

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    "It was mainly to create clarity I think."
    Clarity!? That's hilarious. Matthew 17:10-13 has Jesus speaking of reincarnation, and Christians don't even know it.
     
  4. Asmodean

    Asmodean Slo motion rider

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    Because it didn't fit in the new christian religion. I didn't say it was objective clarity. You have always to take in account that the composers of the bible had lots of different insights than us. In lots of departments they had less insights then us, but in some other they may have stood closer to the original views. Overall they stood inbetween both the scriptures and us so they took it upon them to shape their new belief. Yes, it's easy to dismiss them all as radical controlfreaks in this day and to regard it all as hilarious.
     
  5. rjhangover

    rjhangover Senior Member

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    I think they didn't like aliens, that's why the left out the book of Enoch, who like Elijah was taken up to heaven in a fiery chariot. I've been within 100 feet of one, so I don't have to believe, I know.
     
  6. Asmodean

    Asmodean Slo motion rider

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    Perhaps you can imagine then that they 'knew' different things.
     
  7. GardenGuy

    GardenGuy Senior Member

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    Not really proof of reincarnation.

    Elisha asked that a double portion of Elijah's spirit be given to him as he departed the Earth. Elijah said that this was a difficult request, but would be granted to him if a certain thing came to pass, a sign.

    Elisha had a spirit of his own, but the spirit of Elijah came upon him as well.

    In the same way, John the Baptist had a soul of his own, but was also indwelt with Elijah's spirit and ministry.

    In the demonic world, multiple spirits can inhabit a single human being.

    And He (Jesus) asked him (the man), "What is thy name?" And he answered, saying, "My name is Legion: for we are many." Mark 5:9

    Common estimates for a "legion", a term borrowed from the Roman army is 6,000, giving us an approximate idea of how many spirits lived in that one man.
     
  8. rjhangover

    rjhangover Senior Member

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    Way to go garden. You blew clarity right out the window. The Jews, Muslims and Christians ALL worship the God of Abraham. IT'S THE SAME GOD! They all have the same first five books of the old testament. And they all DEMONIZE the other religions. The Catholics used to murder both the Muslims and Jews during the crusades. The Jews DEMONIZED Christ. And the Muslims DEMONIZE both Christians and Jews as infidels. As long as you hold on to your BELIEFS, you can't see the truth. i.e. the Catholics used to BELIEVE that the world was flat, and burned people at the stake as heretics for BELIEVING it wasn't flat. There are "so called" Christian republicans today that DEMONIZE Mormons as not being Christian, even though they worship Christ as the son of God. Those same "so called" Christians DEMONIZE Obama as not being a Christian because he has a Muslim name, even though he professes to be a Christian. So their BELIEFS condemn them. There are so many "so called" Christians that say "I BELIEVE in Jesus, so I'm saved." But Christ said, "There are many that will come to me on the last day and say, didn't I cast out demons in your name, and didn't I prophecy in your name?" And Christ will say, "I know you not, you are workers of iniquity." In the bible it says that God created ALL things. That means there is nothing that God did not create. God created EVIL! God created the Muslims, Jews, Christians, Hindus, Buddhists, Mayans and all the rest. The truth is in all, but it's human PERCEPTION that is lacking. That's why there is disagreement. The Catholics, Baptists, Mormons, Lutherans, Methodists, Presbyterians, and Pentecostals all say, "My God is better than your God, and if you don't BELIEVE the way I do, you're going to hell." The Sunni and Shiite Muslims are the same way. There are divisions in the Jewish religion too. BUT IT'S ALL HUMAN PERCEPTION! So "Seek the truth and you will find it. And the truth will set you free." But to say, "I have my bible, and that's good enough for me." is refusing to learn the truth.
     
  9. Asmodean

    Asmodean Slo motion rider

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    Happily they do not all say that, but a lot of them did. Refusing to learn the truth sounds a bit radical, I think that only counts for radical stupidity like proclaiming Obama to be a muslim because of his name and such. Proclaiming your god is better than someone elses is pretty lame as well, I agree. But some might just beg to differ with your truth. And righteously so. Where it comes to God not much seems absolute true to me.
     
  10. GardenGuy

    GardenGuy Senior Member

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    Maybe my choice of words was not clear, but saying that I follow the Bible's teachings to the best of my ability does not mean that I accuse others of not doing the same.
     
  11. rjhangover

    rjhangover Senior Member

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    " But some might just beg to differ with your truth."
    The truth is not mine. The truth is the truth. And being human, my mind can not contain God. The bible can not contain God. And like those that wrote the bible, the Torah, and the Koran, I can only express what I PERCEIVE as the truth.
     
  12. GardenGuy

    GardenGuy Senior Member

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    In addition to the Holy Bible, I also think that many people will enjoy the works of Gurney Norman, who among other things wrote the epic story of David Ray in the margins of the Whole Earth Catalog. It was a pleasure to share their journey back to D.R.'s homeland.

    Many hip people find great wisdom in Annie Dillard's book, "Pilgrim at Tinker Creek".

    And some would argue that Henry David Thoreau was the first hippie with his book "Walden" published in 1854.

    My older relatives tell me that "The Hobbit" by J.R.R. Tolkien was in a lot of hip backpacks in the late 60's. I enjoyed the book and am looking forward to the movie.

    And I love the poems and essays of Wendell Berry, another frequent visitor to the Whole Earth Catalog and gadfly and friend of Utopian dreamer Stewart Brand.
     
  13. rjhangover

    rjhangover Senior Member

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    Garden,
    I think you would enjoy the JOSHUA books by Joseph F. Girzone. And THE BRINGERS OF THE DAWN by Barbara Marciniak will give you lots to think about.
     
  14. rjhangover

    rjhangover Senior Member

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    "Nice, typical 19th century occult science."
    I got to thinking that Asmodean should be able and willing to give at least a couple of "typical" examples, because I haven't seen Blavatsky's equal since she wrote THE SECRET DOCTRINE over 120 years ago. If you please kind sir.
     
  15. rjhangover

    rjhangover Senior Member

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    Asmodean,
    Your name is very similar to this one. Any connection?

    22. And I Solomon, on hearing this, bound him more
    carefully, and ordered him to be flogged with thongs
    of ox-hide26, and to tell me humbly what was his
    name and what his business. And he answered me
    thus: "I am called Asmodeus among mortals, and my
    business is to plot against the newly wedded, so that
    they may not know one another. And I sever them
    utterly by many calamities, and I waste away the
    beauty of virgin women, and estrange their hearts."
    23. And I said to him: "Is this thy only business?"
    And he answered me: "I transport men into fits ofmadness and desire, when they have wives of their
    own, so that they leave them, and go off by [21] night
    and day to others that belong to other men; with the
    result that they commit sin, and fall into murderous
    deeds.27"
    24. And I adjured him by the name of the Lord
    SabaƓth, saying: "Fear God, Asmodeus, and tell me
    by what angel thou art frustrated." But he said: "By
    Raphael, the archangel that stands before the throne
    of God. But the liver and gall of a fish put me to
    flight, when smoked over ashes of the tamarisk28." I
    again asked him, and said: "Hide not aught from me.
    For I am Solomon, son of David, King of Israel. Tell
    me the name of the fish which thou reverest." And
    he answered: "It is the Glanos29 by name, and is
    found in the rivers of Assyria; wherefore it is that I
    roam about in those parts."
    25. And I said to him: "Hast thou nothing else about
    thee, Asmodeus?" And he answered: "The power of
    God knoweth, which hath bound me with the
    indissoluble bonds of yonder one's seal, that
    whatever I have told thee is true. I pray thee, King
    Solomon, condemn me not to [go into] water." But I
    smiled, and said to him: "As the Lord God of my
    fathers liveth, I will lay iron on thee to wear. But
    thou shalt also make the clay for the entire
    construction of the Temple, treading it down with
    thy feet." And I ordered them to give him ten waterjars
    to carry water in. And the demon groaned
    terribly, and did the work I ordered him to do. And
    this I did, because that fierce demon Asmodeus
    knew even the future. And I Solomon glorified God,
    who gave wisdom to me Solomon his servant. And
    the liver of the fish and its gall I hung on the spike of
    a reed30, and burned it over Asmodeus because of his
    being so strong, and his unbearable malice was thus
    frustrated.
     
  16. rjhangover

    rjhangover Senior Member

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    Garden said, "In the demonic world, multiple spirits can inhabit a single human being.

    And He (Jesus) asked him (the man), "What is thy name?" And he answered, saying, "My name is Legion: for we are many." Mark 5:9"

    The testament of Solomon enslaves many of these demons to build the temple.

    51. And I praised the Lord God of heaven and earth,
    and bade another demon come forward to me; and
    there came before me one in the form of a lion
    roaring. And he stood and answered me saying: "O
    king, in the form which I have, I am a spirit quite
    incapable of being perceived. Upon all men who lie
    prostrate with sickness I leap, coming stealthily
    along; and I render the man weak, so that his habit
    of body is enfeebled. But I have also another glory, O
    king. I cast out demons, and I have legions under my
    control. And I am capable of being received1 in my
    dwelling-places, along with all the demons
    belonging to the legions under me." But I Solomon,
    on hearing this, asked him: "What is thy name?" But
    he answered: "Lion-bearer, Rath2 in kind." And I said
    to him: "How art thou to be frustrated along with thy
    legions? What angel is it that frustrates thee?" And
    he answered: "If I tell thee my name, I bind not
    myself alone, but also the legions of demons under
    me.52. So I said to him: "I adjure thee in the name of the
    God Sabaoth, to tell me by what name thou art
    frustrated along with thy host." And the spirit
    answered me: "The 'great among men,' who is to
    suffer many things at the hands of men, whose name
    is the figure 644, which is Emmanuel; he it is who
    has bound us, and who will then come and plunge
    us from the steep1 under water. He is noised abroad
    in the three letters which bring him down.
    53. And I Solomon, on hearing this, glorified God,
    and condemned his legion to carry wood from the
    thicket. And I condemned the [29] lion-shaped one
    himself to saw up the wood small with his teeth, for
    burning in the unquenchable furnace for the Temple
    of God.
     
  17. Asmodean

    Asmodean Slo motion rider

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    Hehe, yes but indirectly. I took this name from a fantasy book by Robert Jordan (Wheel of time) and I learned later that the name for this character was derived from Asmodeus indeed.

    By the way, I was just appreciating that part you posted. I do not claim to know her equal, just that it seemed typical 19th century to me. :2thumbsup:
     
  18. rjhangover

    rjhangover Senior Member

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    Wheel of time sounds ominous, yet intriguing. Demons give me the willies.
     
  19. Asmodean

    Asmodean Slo motion rider

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    Have to admit I'm not so fond on the name as I once was :p I also still have to finish the Wheel of time, since when I read those books it wasn't complete yet. Only read the first 9 or 10 books, I think there are 12. It kind of drags on a bit too, I'm not sure I would recommend it in this thread. I'd recommend it to fantasy fans though.
     
  20. PeatBog

    PeatBog Member

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    A few hippy books you might consider are "Game of Life" by Timothy Leary (tarot), "Ecotopia" by Ernest Callenbach (environmentalism), the Whole Earth Catalog, "Doors of Perception" by Aldous Huxley (drugs), "Capital" by Karl Marx (communism), and "The Mustard Seed" by Rajneesh (commentary on the Gospel of Thomas).
     

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