Support the troops?

Interesting observation...... I have met several troops returned from Iraq recently. When I meet new people I tend to keep mouth shut and ears and eyes open. I step back, watch and listen. EVERY ONE of them, coincidence or not, was exceptionally cocky, and ignorant acting. They continued to wear their camo get-ups, as if they were still there, and spent alot of time bragging.

I have a friend/acquaintance who is in the National Guard and was forced to do some time in Iraq. She HATED it and says she NEVER wants to go back, by the way. But my daughters and I went out dancing a couple weeks go, and she went with us. She got completely, ridiculously plastered, and when we took her home, she SERIOUSLY beat up her husband, causing internal bleeding...

So, take this observation for what its worth.
The ONLY war vets I have EVER met, from ANY war, who seemed like really good and intelligent folks, are the ones who developed serious Post Traumatic Stress Disorder.....

 

I hope you're either joking, or can post a link that proves your claim; you've already posted all sorts of other rhetorical links.

The whole premise for waging war was the "suspicion" that Saddam was hiding WMDs, none were ever found. Not only did Bush overstep his authority by bypassing Congressional review, he fabricated a lie to invade a country.

looks like someone on this board has some serious denial issues.

 

which is pretty much the same.

Military is a business, period. Why else would "officers" wear ties?

 

This issue is a little more complicated than any one of us here could make a decision on. The fact is that the legality of the Iraq war falls in a very murky legal area. If this case is ever brought to international court, it will be a lengthy trial. It is also true that there currently isn't enough data (public) to determine if the United States was attacked or was under the threat of being attacked by either Iraq or an organization linked to Iraq. It is also possible that each coalition country could be charged seperately, which different outcomes at each trial. Example would be that the United States action was justified as self-defense but the action of the United Kingdom was not. There currently is no "official" ruling as to whether the Iraq war is legal, and any claims to such are just opinions. Documents recovered from Iraq have recently been posted online and are currently being translated by countries all over the world. In the next few months we are sure to find out more information about Iraq and the Hussein regime that will be of interest. Perhaps some of the documents may contain information about possible relationships.

 

The reasons for going to war were shit but the outcome of ousting Saddam was a pretty reasonable return.

In my opinion the mistake was made 10 years earlier when Iraq invaded Kuwait. Instead of sending Iraq back across its own border and leaving it at that the allies had just cause to go in and finish it then.

 

Who put Saddam in power?

Peace & Love

 

I don't know who put Saddam in power and its a pointless argument because I'm sure whoever did didn't say to him....

Your remit whilst in power is to rape, pillage and murder your country. Then once you are finished work on the country next door.

 

Under a tyrant, life in Iraq was bad but tolerable. Now, under occupation, Iraq has become one of the worlds most desperate nations. thanks alot mr bush, liberation just goes hand in hand with starvation.

 

Actually, it does matter. The US put him in power to fight the Iranians. The US gave him the biological weapons that he later used on his own people. Perhaps do a little research?

Peace & Love

 

The US is great at supporting fascist tyrants.....there is a new one comming up in Iraq in about 3 years, most likely he will turn on the Americans too, the americans will invade again, and itll all go down once more in the name of profit.

 

Of course, the US supported Fidel Castro till he turned against us and went red...

Peace & love

 

unfortunately, i don't have anything to add.


you covered my beliefs entirely.

 

Okay, let's say it is as simple as saying the US put Saddam in power. And the US gave Saddam chem/bio weapons that he used on his own people. Wouldn't you then say it is the responsibility of the US to remove the tyrant that they put in power and to assure that the weapons they gave him were confiscated or destroyed? Or should the US say "Well, we put him in power. Now we have to continue to allow him to rape, murder, oppress his people, and collaborate with global terrorist organizations." Just want to make sure you aren't having your cake and eating it too.

 

by the seemingly fickle way this admin asserts itself with regard to foreign policy (i.e. threatening sanctions against Iran, then offering to talk to them regarding Iraq, and explaing "well that's a seperate issue"), it wouldn't be far-fetched to assume that Bushco wants to have the cake, and eat it too.

first Bush drops billions into defense preaching a need for greater homeland security, then attempts to sell our ports to a country that also caters to the people he calls "terrorists", it kinda makes you wonder what his real intentions are.

 

It was actually Iran that claimed sanctions were a "seperate issue". Iranian Oil Minister Kazem Vaziri-Hamaneh said that if sanctions were called on Iran over the nuclear issue, his country would not halt oil exports. He stated that economic sanctions could affect the oil market and prices could go up, but it will not affect the decision to continue their supply. It looks like Iran is having their cake and eating it too. Their yellow cake.

 

this is just ridiculous.

its like a fucking drama play unfolding, unfortunately, one that costs us all a great deal of money, and some, their lives.

support the troops? fuck no; and I have family in the military. I don't support the cause, but unfortunaely, my taxes go towards it, I have no choice in the matter. it's either that, or jail.

I'd like to find that stupid songwriter Lee Greenwood, and kick his ass.

 

Again does it really matter....

When the US gave him the power to fight the iranians and gave him biological weapons did they say....

Hey Saddam we have a problem with the Ayatollah over there so go for your life.

This is possible....

but I bet they didn't say....

When your finished you see them Kurds over there, they told me you were looking a bit chubby, feel free to use the rest of your weapons on them.

Ok so the Americans were irresponsible because they handed a nutter a weapon but at the end of the day it was the nutter that used them and the US have simply taken the arms away and locked him up in a cell.

It would be like the police handing a gun to one of the officers and whilst off duty he goes mad and shoots up half the town. The police gave him the gun for part of the work that he was involved in. I'm sure when they realise he was unbalanced they would take the weapon away and lock him up.

 

The US didn't put him in power, and he was a leading figure in Iraq for more than a decade before Iraq invaded Iran. Futhermore, nobody gave Saddam biological weapons, and he never used biological weapons on anyone.

 

"You're not paid to think," LOL I can't tell you how many times I heard that one while I was in the military. I don't mean any disrespect to those who are in, but how can you say they're not drones, when a statement like that is so common? Don't think for yourself, do what your told without question, that's absurd! And you wonder why I got out...

Now I've experienced both the military and corporate America, and, while one might argue that the two are similar in the sense that is conformity to some extent, the similarities end there (and BTW I'll take corporate America ANY day!)...

Corporate America thrives on competition and being good at your job. If you suck at your job, you get fired, simple as that.

In the military, keep your nose clean, do what you're told, and you're fine. I can remember all kinds of losers who somehow managed to play the game, and made it to retirement after 20 years. We used to have the joke that, instead of Non-Commissioned Officers, NCO stood for "no chance on the outside." It was ingrained in us that we wouldn't be make it on the outside. After I separated, it was an adjustment, and it took me a while, but I did pretty well, I just had to come to terms with the fact that now I needed to make my own decisions, since they wouldn't be made for me.

There's this sense of comraderie in the military, sort of a false sense of security that you're part of a group, now that your individuality has been stripped. It was kinda cool in a way, I mean we were buddies to the core, right?, we spent most of our waking hours together, we worked together, we drank together... And the drinking, OMFG, good thing I got out or I would've been a hard core alcoholic like the rest of those lifers. Not that you couldn't get all kinds of other goodies for yer head, you just couldn't get caught. No, it was the boredom and the lack of anything meaningful that gave us the overwhelming desire to party our asses off, not to mention the self fulfilling prophecy of all the locals everywhere we went expecting us to rape and pillage...guess what, self-fulfilling prophecies are often fulfilled...

No, I'm not real proud of my military years, I just tell it like it is, that's all, but I'm not against those who choose to serve. Don't get me wrong, it's a personal choice based on the options you have in life, but it's not a smart make at this time, that's for sure.

I might suggest they change the banners in their yards to read:

Support our Troops, End the War

And yeah, for those who aren't up on their history, Saddam Hussein was a monster that WE created, we trained him to be a killer to fight against Iran, that is, until he stopped serving OUR best interests.

Now how 'bout Afghanistan....

 

The US didnt come riding in with a black horse and put the drown on Saddams head, no, but they did back him financially, and without the US backing it is doubtful Saddam could have taken power and less likely still he could have retained it. Billy Bragg said it best:

Saddam killed his own people, just like General Pinochet
And once upon a time both these evil men were supported by the USA
Whispering even Bin Laden once drank from America's cup
Just like that election down in Florida, this shit doesnt all add up.