Spitting on Vietnam Soldiers

The doctors all go there to support killing not to save lives.If my best friend got killed while we were trying to rob a store it would be the same thing.The point is not to blame them for what we do.If my friend got killed it would be my fault not the percieved enemy.It's our fault we're in Iraq.The taliban is in Afganistan and Pakistan yet we attack Iraq.It was our fault we were in Nam.Most innocents are killed by our bombs not hand to hand.We do surgical strikes which doesn't get to our concious.Killing is reality allright but so is peace.It's our choice.

 

To say that "the hippies" did this is a meaningless generalisation. "Hippie" is simply a very loose fitting social label given to a group of people who adopt a particular kind of lifestyle, wearing tie-dyes and taking drugs, for example.

Don't become a hippie or anything else, just be yourself and let other's judge and label you as they wish. If you're free and independant, then in the end, what do anyone elses negative opinions really mean?

 

There are two sides to every coin, the ying and the yang of the universal flow. Without one there can not be the other.

You say yes
I say no
You say Why,
I say I don't know
OH NO
You say goodby,
I say hello.

What's going on, what can we do about it...No one knows the answers, not one man/woman. We just do our jobs and try to get along.. We don't have time to save the world, we're bustin' our asses supporting it.
The darkness that lives in mankind is in Light our salvation. For what would move us so as to be faced with making a dicission of a life and death nature. Your own, your mate's your children's and your family and friends. Who's to say in the face of real danger what we are capable of. Our instict would take over and we would stand our ground or run, as we were programed to survive by any means necessary to protect the species/seed most would stand. To say what one would do in any circumstance with out having experience/knowledge in the nature of it, is mearly speculating and has no basis from which to speak. Otherwise it has no foundation and cannot not support an issue.

Condemming a person for what they have to learn is counter productive, not showing a way out, to set as an example as to what you would like to the world to be is the first step to gainning enlightment. It's what the intent has in it's body that makes right and wrong.
We each have to live by and with, how we feel and the intent given. We judge ourselves more harshly the any one else could, bc, we know our own darkest places. We have a desire to be forgiving as not to be judged to harshly ourselves.
When we 'spit on the VNV's we are spitting on ourselves. I did not spit. I cried and mourned for the loved ones of the dead. For the limbless and the PTSS and Agent Orange that our Sons, Brothers, Husbands, and friends had/has to endure.
It's the Power hungry and the Ego ridden side of humanity that runs this planet, off kilter and totally out of balance. There is no justise. Only Chaos.
It is up to the individual as to what difference is made. It starts from within and moves outward. What we put out is what we get back in the Karmic balance of Nature.
Karma has a way of finding the place from which it came. Those who come from a place of best intent will be under grace from the Karmatic Flow of Universal Justise.
So is my belief and what I hold sacred.

 

The doctors go over there to save lives... they often work to save the lives of both foreign and domestics... get your facts straight . Blame them from what we do? Hell... they kill their own people. They're focusing on Iraqis, not Americans.

Did you read or watch the news concerning our reasons for going Iraq? Do you know why we went to Vietnam?

Oh... hand to hand really isn't the biggest thing. Sure it happens... but hand to hand ends up with people having small injuries or being restrained.

Iraqis use a lot of bombs too. Bombs in public areas, firing mortars in public areas, etc. Their bombs hit more innocents than ours do.

As for that... yeah. Peace is a reality. But it's less desirable to humans.

I don't know whether war is an interlude during peace, or peace is an interlude during war."
- Georges Clemenceau

"It is war that shapes peace, and armament that shapes war."
- Thomas Fuller

Check out a few history books

 

our reasons for going to Iraq were bullshit.Watch the news.There were no WMD's.As far as Viet Nam,i lived in Westminister now known as Little Vietnam.I've worked alongside and talked to the refugees ate at their tables and attended their events.We went there cause the French were losing their stronghold and it was our way of fighting communism.Nam also had oil.The way (this talking to refugees that were officers)to achive high rank in the South Vietnam army was to by it with gold.The Chinese supplied the gold.Go figure.Now you tell me why we're over there.Say it in your own words without repeating the words of others.I've watched the news, read the history books,love the history channel,but most importantly i've talked to people and made up my own mind.
As far as having to have lived war in order to have an opinion that's like saying i've never spit on a vet so i can't condem that either.You don't have to kill to know it's wrong.

 

Were those hippies who had fled to Canada or were those hippies who continued their education and became teachers?

 

not if they teach war

 

Not everyone had the ability to further their education and not everyone was willing to flee to Canada and leave their whole life behind them, never to return, even if they were able to do that as well.

This was also a much more naive populace and we believed more then about the governments credibility and accountability. This was a war far different than any of this countries experience before or since and it took awhile before people began to realize all those facts and lose the naivity.
It did pave the way to questioning authority and not take everything the government says at face value.

It also paved the way to the media being able to have more access and ability to report whats going on in the world today without as much interference because back then they were not allowing reporters in many areas or allowing certain information to get out to the public. It took awhile for the truth to get out to the masses and even then as I see now, so many blindly believed and wouldn't accept the facts as they were told.

 

"This was also a much more naive populace and we believed more then about the governments credibility and accountability"

good point

 

Yeah...kinda reminds me a bit of when kids find out there's no Easter Bunny/Santa Claus. I remember many peoples shock then denial about the duplicity they finally found out about.
It was not like their daddy's war...there wasn't a grand or honorable cause to rally behind. There wasn't the straight forward battles being fought and won. And the one reason I hate, loath and despise Bush's rally cry of "We Support Our Troops" He found a way to sell it to the american sheep I mean people. Reminds me of the same naivity that I saw then. Because I won't willingly spout off slogans to help support the american agenda does that mean I want bad things to happen to the men over there? HELL NO!! I want them all home, safe and sound with their families and not helping to escalate terrible matters and recruit new martyrs to a cause.

 

I have a point that I want to make not entirely on subject is my strong dislike for the government and recruiters...
I have no problems with soldiers. Most soldiers were drafted and had NO choice.

An army recruiter came to my high school senior year, and gave a speech. Afterwards he passed out all sorts of questionaires, basically asking if you'd ever be interested in signing up and the like. Mine was clearly marked "No, I would never consider it." And, as he went around collecting them, he stopped and gave me a big lecture. This man showed VERY LITTLE respect for others; I understand what his *mission* was in coming to our school to recruit, but he went on to ask me WHY I would never consider joining the military, etc. I simply told him that I could never sign myself up to possibly kill another human being...he became VERY angry with me, and said "It's people like you that I try to target. You're like those damn hippies back during Vietnam who would protest and spit on soldiers.." blah blah...
And, I understand why that was heartbreaking for him and the other soldiers, however... at this time there is no draft, and I'm a woman, and there are no laws yet that women must sign up for the draft either... so it was NOT his place to lecture me. Joining the military, for me, would be a choice, and my choice is to not fight a war...and he should have respected that.

 

Absolutely! A healthy dislike of any govenment and most certainly any recruiters will be the best lesson learned of any ridiculous war fought in the past.

Iraq, or the fact that Germany up to this minute still drafts its young men into its military service, shows that governments and Soldiers never learn learn!

I feel sorry for those young men which where forced to Vietnam by the bullshitting cowards in Washington and any other capital supporting the US those days and didn´t make it out of the country in time - however, I wasn´t there (thank god!).

The lesson I learned (from my own countrys history, from Vietnam and for that respect from the war in former Yugoslavia), is to f*** off as soon as possible should there ever be someone telling me I´d have to go anywhere to fight for "my country" or "freedom" or any other silly thing with a gun in my hand.

 

I thought the question should be if i shit on a vet or not so i answered yes.

 

I too am a Viet Nam vet, although I didn't get spit on, but when we came back to the states, as a whole we didn’t get the red carpet rolled out for us. My draft number was low so I volunteered for the Navy and was stationed on the air craft carrier, USS Constellation. We were sailing in the South China Sea on Yankee Station in the Gulf of Tonkin. So hey, homebudz welcome home brother.

 

well voided if you grew up while your dad was at lajune then we might know some of the same pepole but for you to say (seeing how you have never been put in the same kind of situation) fuck you) then i say to you the same ! and i still hold to my original post that know vet coming home from war should be spit on!! if you got the balls to spit then you should have the balls to fight!! because that is how it can start!!!!

 

hey voided i dont know if i read all of your posts in this thread or not!! i dont even know what prompted me to post in it again! i beleive we can be freinds! the thing with the internet is it loses something in the coversation the lack of body language and the inflection and tone in a persons voice the look in their eye! i beleive we are all guilty of furthering these evil deeds you spoke of with out even knowing it!!! but there is ample time to disscuss that in another place i dont like this thread at all ! but i would like to ask you what yrs you were at lajune ? my brother was there 78/9 and a family that i was close withs dad was a staff sgt. 60s and early 70s and his dauhter in early 80s hope to talk with you again peace!

 

hey voided im just saying hey i got bunches to do ! but i wanted to say thanks for the reply ! i got alot to do and all i want to is go to bed i might any way but we will talk some if you choose too !! may peace always be within your heart and soul !!

 

I don't think anyone is suggesting to delete the military arm of the government. I think the issue people take with the soldiers is the reasons for war. In Vietnam it was a government-orchestrated lie to make people think they were under attack by communism. In Iraq, it's about oil and money republican ideals. We haven't been attacked since Pearl Harbor (save 9/11), and no war since has been in defence or even retaliation. Sure innocents get killed, but they wouldn't if these stupid wars weren't started and fought for these stupid reasons.

 

If there were no soldiers there would be no war...

 

I haven't read all 30 pages of this horseshit thread-- just enough. I lived in SF and NYC from 66-68-- never saw it, never heard first-hand of it. I believe it's a stupid urban legend. Most of the guys back from Nam were already turned on and fit right in. Some weren't, but I worked with Nam veterans who knew I was a phony 4-F'er and they said they would do it too (fake homo-ism) if they had to do it again.


It was real easy to beat the draft in 1966--later, it got harder, but not impossible. 70 per cent of my friends did it; three of my friends who didn't are dead.

Why don't we put this dead horse in the fucking grave where it belongs instead of incessantly and fruitlessly beating it?