Socialism Is The Future

Discussion in 'Socialism' started by unfocusedanakin, Jul 15, 2017.

  1. stormountainman

    stormountainman Soy Un Truckero

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    Valdimir is right. I would describe Trump's administrative achievements as dismal and his behavior as criminal, including his attack on Portland's peace and civil rights protestors. Trump defended the gunslingers who invaded and occupied a federal installation in Oregon. And he encouraged the gunslingers to go and protest the Governor of Michigan. And he said the Virginia Unite The Right KKK marchers were fine people. Trump got the endorsement of David Duke and The North Carolina KKK and the Proud Boys.
     
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  2. stormountainman

    stormountainman Soy Un Truckero

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    Very True
     
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  3. Rehab44

    Rehab44 Members

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    British Republican who pays taxes to support your benefits and rent for your social housing which you suck out of the state you hate.
     
  4. Lodog

    Lodog ¿

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    I'd say your job will choose you yes. A new age of reason and growth. Ideas and working together. It's gotta work I need a robot to laugh at my jokes.
     
  5. stormountainman

    stormountainman Soy Un Truckero

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    You sound like that Sebastian Gorka who runs his mouth on Alex Jones' website when he is not sniffing Trump's trousers.
     
  6. Rehab44

    Rehab44 Members

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    Close to Trumps underwear are you?
     
  7. stormountainman

    stormountainman Soy Un Truckero

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    It sounds like the gist of what I said went right over your head, huh?
     
  8. 6-eyed shaman

    6-eyed shaman Sock-eye salmon

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  9. Balbus

    Balbus Senior Member

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    6

    Again we get the politics of crap memes and rubbish slogan

    So come on then 6 let’s see you 'working out' and explain the statement – I bet you can’t, because i'm guessing you posted it without giving it any thought. LOL
     
  10. M_Ranko

    M_Ranko Straight edge xXx

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    Just some facts and examples here:

    French Armed Forces: 5th largest military budget in the WHOLE WORLD, has nukes. Has performed many successful military operations outside its borders. STILL a welfare state.

    Norwegian Armed Forces: Has a military expenditure of over 7 billion dollars per year, the highest per capita in Europe. STILL a welfare state.

    Finnish Defense Forces: Has a universal conscription for all adult men. Has a reserve of 900,000 troops, over 30,000 of those are active duty at all times. Considered well trained, well performing and highly motivated. Finland is not a NATO member, and maintains all of this on its own at a cost of over 3 billion dollars per year. STILL a welfare state.

    The existence of comprehensive social safety nets does not mean the absence of adequate defense capabilities, and these are not mutually exclusive. That Germany has problems with their Bundeswehr mostly has to do with their past war time history. Many Germans still feel that overt militarism = Nazi. But even they still fund their military with about 50 billion per year, proving that if they really wanted to, they could once again be the European military power house from 80 years ago.
     
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  11. Balbus

    Balbus Senior Member

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    The idea that some right wingers push that the US was somehow forced into spending so much on its military because its allies were not is just untrue.

    It has to be remembered that NATO was one of the pillars of the US’s attempt at global hegemony and to counter the rise of soviet Russia after WWII (other examples are the global financial institutions set up by the Bretton Woods settlement) another part of that was astronomically high military spending.

    That expense was a US political choice it was not forced upon them.

    They could have gone for a less aggressive and controlling approach and a more reasonably sized military budget and used the money saved to see to their own citizens welfare needs but it did not.

    And just as the US hijacking and corruption of the Bretton Woods proposals ended up cost the US dear so has its high level of military spending.
     
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  12. unfocusedanakin

    unfocusedanakin The Archaic Revival Lifetime Supporter

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    The part about the military is not really true. Germany and England both have large military despite their tax. And even here in tiny Belgium there fighter jets and tanks that cost several million Euros each. Were the country attacked they could easily defend it. We just don't have the huge standing army that is only good in war because as I am sure you can appreciate it's wasteful goverment spending.

    Did Europe at one time count on the USA for defense? Yeah we thought you were our friend but since Trump military spending has gone up here.

    Ask why they can afford anything the US has. We have literally the same equipment you do because like I said we used to be on the same team.

    The US military has not really been needed since WW2. There is no point to its size but American arrogance. So I don't really see your point. An army can be raised when needed for cheaper than maintaining a large one. Europe does not need you as much as you think it existed long before America. It just prioritizes human rights over endless war. Does not mean they have not gone to war. Read a history book. America itself owes their existence to socialist France for example.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2020
  13. Figgnewton

    Figgnewton Members

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    I'm for pulling out of Europe and NATO. Lets see how long you last when Russia, China , Iran and even North Korea start there journey to take over Europe. Who will you call?
    The ghost busters? Tell me one thing that communist Russia has provided for the WORLD ie; medical,consumer goods,car manufacturing just to name a few? Capitalism has been the driving
    force for the world for the past several hundred yrs. Yes it has it's problems but far less then a socialist state or dictatorship that controls you .You work hard and reap what you sow. My
    parents were poor, five us us lived in a 3 room apartment.My father was lucky he had to nickles to rub together but my parents gave us love, affection and worth of knowing hard work pays off
    and earns self esteem. I graduated from high school and went into the US Air Force and after four yrs got the G.I. Bill and furthered my education in the field of electronics. Long story short,
    married, 3 children grown up, they all own homes work hard . I'm living a decent retired life with my first and only wife, 40 yrs. Hard work, patients is a virtue .As others said here , everyone wants instant satisfaction, free and i me mine. There are no promises in life, no one owes you anything.For those of you think that socialism, fascism ,communism or what ever ism you want they don't deliver the freedom, the choice and future that CAPITALISM can bring !! Yeah there is always some control in every type of government but look at most of the Billionaires that came from nothing.
    Not saying all of them are good but in a free enterprise the world has prospered from there freedom of ingenuity. After WW2 the USA has helped many countries become powerhouse industries, free markets so that you people on here can bash the USA , Capitalism etc. Without the USA where would the world be? Speaking German, Japanese or some other foreign tongue that would enslave you at that moment of time. We are doing better , sad to say wars have happened but that's the mentality of humanity. Sadly lots of people protest , hate cops, government and military. FREEDOM IS NOT FREE and no one is taking your freedom away when you are bad mouthing your own country that gave you the freedom , the right to protest not to destroy your own neighborhood. One last thing , once you cross the line of socialism there is no turning back the clock. Reap what you sow. I am seeing the beginning of the end but i won't be around to see the terrible end that most of you want.
    Sadly my children and grandchildren will live in the cesspool of life that you all want !!!
    I babbled about Europe, the USA and in general the world. There are no sure fixes since most countries want to rule the world ( Tears for Fears ). In the USA The Democrats are very far left liberal which will lead to socialism and one party rule. Not the greatest fan of TRUMP but will VOTE for him AGAIN !!! He has some of my views as with Mike Savage " boarders, language culture ". Loose any one and you have nothing. I M O !!
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2020
  14. soulcompromise

    soulcompromise Member HipForums Supporter

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    @Figgnewton, I see what you're saying about capitalism leading the way.

    I would like to point out that you can have capitalism with socialism in a way that's appealing to voters and society, etc.

    It's just a matter of deciding that "ok, we're not doing the winner takes all health insurance anymore. everyone gets health insurance free" or tuition. Or any other number of things.
     
  15. unfocusedanakin

    unfocusedanakin The Archaic Revival Lifetime Supporter

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    You are aware that it was Communist Russia's front of the war and their size that won the war right? If Hitler only has to fight the UK and USA a land invasion of Europe is not possible. We barely managed to get in there on D-Day and it cost so many lives.

    And it's debatable if Hitler would have been able to capture the UK. He tried for a few years and never gave up on the idea. Maybe if several more years had passed in the war they would be weaker but on D-Day America was not the only one strong enough to fight.

    Actually the capitalist west owes it's existence to Communism. The USSR's cold approach to troop management meant young men were thrown at Hitler until he had no young men to throw back. The Americans themselves were worried about this troop management in the Cold War. We want our boys to survive so we make smart choices. We know the Russians will let 10,000 of theirs die if they can take 11,0000 Americans with them.

    Only Americans think they won the war. The Europeans say it was Russia while also saying they don't want to be Communist too.
     
  16. M_Ranko

    M_Ranko Straight edge xXx

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    Great. Enjoy not being able to launch attacks to Middle East anymore, when you lose access to military bases in European NATO partner countries. Hey, maybe Egypt or something will let you borrow their bases when you wage your oil wars against their Arab brothers...

    North Korea realistically does not have the muscles to pull this off. Their army is a joke outside of their own turf. Likewise, China doesn't have very good capabilities to maintain sustained operations on foreign soil. They don't have the supply lines to maintain their troops far away from home. A case could be made about Russia, but even they don't have the means to take on all of EU which, let's face it, would have to react if Russia were to suddenly invade a member state. Plus, what do you think you'd gain by letting Europe get taken over by the Russians? EU is a major trading partner for you guys. Do you expect Russians to buy your shit? You'd lose a sizeable portion of your trade by letting Europe get taken over. That'd smoke your own economy when a sizeable portion of your GDP would melt overnight.

    As far as Iran is concerned, they're not invading jack shit. Israel would nuke them on the spot. And then you'd join in to support them anyway, NATO or not.

    A lot of that is actually now provided to you by communist China, courtesy of capitalism, which shifts production to where ever it is cheaper to produce things. Meaning some chinaman now has your factory job, and you probably even voted to support this.

    So you earned your study privileges by long distance push button killing foreign civilians from 10,000 feet above in distant countries which names you probably can't even pronounce. How sweet. We here in Europe don't have to murder foreigners in their own countries in pointless wars to earn the right to go to school.

    Only if your boss is nice enough to not kick you out to the curb and replace you with cheap Asian labor.

    Only because their bosses didn't sack them and take away their paychecks. You know, boss? That person who ultimately decides whether you get to work (and get paid) or not.

    Actually, if your country expects you to play by its rules and follow its laws, it then does owe it to you to at the very least feed you and provide you with shelter and medical care, and preferably also affordable education, so that you'd remain a well being, functional member of your society. Socialism and derivatives provide all this either free of charge, or subsidizes it to be affordable to all. Capitalism kicks down everyone, who can't keep up with the rat race and pay for the often artificially inflated prices of the private sector. When you have too many people with nothing, you have too many people with nothing to lose, and they will begin to behave as such, which leads to an unstable society.
     
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  17. Figgnewton

    Figgnewton Members

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  18. Figgnewton

    Figgnewton Members

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    Europeans, You are free because of the help of the USA. All wars are unwanted, so maybe we should have stayed out WW2 and you more than likely would not be here or speaking German or in a liberal sense you would n't be here to complain..It's nonsense to think the world can be at peace. Look around you, China, Russia, Iran, No. Korea etc., they all peaceful nations? sit back and let them come in and enslave you? There are many countries that want the USA to fail and when we do you follow since you don't believe in standing up to the enemy. Europe will be no existent in 10 yrs, you already see whats happening , need i say more? In that regards the USA will be happy to sit this one out as you bow to the east.
     
  19. Tishomingo

    Tishomingo Members

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    I agree. If we'd followed the Republican isolationists, we might be goose stepping to the Horst Wessel song or gathering dust in a gas chamber, depending on our level of racial purity. The wars fought to contain Soviet expansion were also worth it, although we made some real blunders--leading eventually to the collapse of the brutal Soviet Empire. If we hadn't fought those you and I might be speaking Russian and toeing the party line. As you say, "
    Where you go off the rails is in attributing this problem to Europe, when it is American voters who sold the country out to a stooge whose adulation for dictators, Commie and otherwise, is palpable; who treats the pathetic FSB apparachik Putin as his bosom buddy, not to mention the demented monster Kim Jong un; and who steadily weakens the Nato alliance that's kept the Russian tanks out of western Europe for several decades.
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2020
  20. Tishomingo

    Tishomingo Members

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    They are social democracies--welfare states with universal health care and great long term care for the elderly. The U.S. could do that too, even while keeping up the Nato alliance, which is on our interest, as well as theirs.
     

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