"Sissyphobia":

Wow.

I'm glad that I've never come across/hang out with people like this.

calisouth- the people you keep mentioning sound very shallow... where do you come in contact with all of these people you describe in your posts?

 

As I've mentioned before, there are many reasons why people become shallow. Sad to say.

 

I wasn't asking the ways in which people become shallow... i think that's kind of an inherent trait or one that is picked up by hanging with the wrong crowd.

What I was asking was where do you meet all of these awful sounding people you describe in your posts?

 

I've met them in all my travels here in America and abroad in all settings.

 

I don't agree about the inherent trait but I haven't lived long enough to find out everything, but I will add that when shits happen, sometimes people have a way of closing off and start being negative and selfish.

 

In my experience, shyness knows no gender.

 

In America today, propriety gets mistaken for shyness. You've heard of the loud American...........

 

Awful is in the eye of the beholder. To repeat myself that when it comes to casual friends and sexual partners, I don't mind the games because it's really none of my business what goes on in their minds to get themselves aroused and what motivates them to work me out sexually. I'm more unattached emotionally when it comes to casual people. I buff harder too and less lovie dovie with a cuntie boi. I'm piggy that way. When it comes to serious relationship material, I'd certainly be thinking very hard who I give my heart to. I don't want any negative surprises later on.

 

At the risk of preaching - I'm only just over half your age so you've obviously got much more experience than me - I'd say you've got more chance of settling down with the person you want to if you choose your friends in the same kind of way. I don't know, I just feel like it sends a message to the world.

 

There seems to be a trend lately with younger gays and lesbians trying to attain a greater level of acceptance by transposing hetero rules to gay rules.

How and when the heteros settle down has a lot to do with the womans biological clock, or the guys ineptness at picking up

As a gay guy, settle down if thats what you and your partner want, but if you keep in reasonable shape, clean and tidy there's no real reason to settle down....well, until your penis stops working , that is, not until your 60s or even 70s and beyond. You're a gay guy into other gay guys, your never
really going to have trouble hooking up or meeting new potential partners (depending on how picky you are that is).

In short theres no real reason for him or any other gay gent to settle down in their 30s or 40s unless thats what they want. If they do, I'd urge them to make sure they are doing it for love, not what they think is expected of them

 

It's not about acceptance. We're people; people who fall in love and want to commit themselves to another person. It has nothing to do with prescribing to the "hetero norm". Personally I'd rather be with someone I love than be an old jaded fag still hanging out in the clubs and bars eyeing every good looking guy.

You're right, every person has the choice of whether or not they want to continue(or begin) living a promiscuous lifestyle or attempting to find a person with whom they have a deep connection with. Don't attach a negative connotation with a certain lifestyle simply because you don't agree or understand it. Every gay man is different just as every straight person is different. Neither lifestyle is better than the other. I can identify with one over the other, but I don't believe the one you're speaking of(not "settling down") is wrong, it's just not my preference.

If you don't agree with something then say it, but don't make assumptions about things that you don't understand.

 

^^^

So the "old jaded fag" comment isnt one of those negative connotations?


I certainly wasnt criticising anyone that wants a LTR, been there myself a few times

 

This is just a really depressing post. I already feel a bit old to be going out doing pills and trying to pull some twink every weekend, and I'm not even halfway through my twenties. I do not want to be looking for a partner when I'm 40. Apart from anything else, it looks really shit. I'll freely admit, I'm "guilty" of seeing guys in the 40s in gay clubs, false tanned and moisteurised in Topman workshirts and jeans, trying to brush up against guys half their age in the hope that one of them has low standards or that their daddy had boundary issues, and thinking "god, I hope I really hope don't end up like that". So what if my biological clock isn't ticking? Is the only reason to want to settle down because you've got no choice?

I don't think it has anything to do with "wanting to be hetero". I'm aware that there are some aspects of heterosexual dating/relationships that don't apply to us (most obviously: we very rarely knock someone up by mistake and get stuck with either marrying them or paying maintenance), but most of them are just as applicable. That's not to say that it's the only way to live your life, but it's important to a lot of gay guys that they are normal. They don't want the freedom to stay single and play the field way beyond the point where it's really embarrassing to watch, let alone be involved in.

I think there are things that have nothing to do with whether you're gay or straight that affect people's desire to settle down or not. A big part of it is age. Regardless of whether my ovaries are withering away, I am going to die at some point, and given the choice between spending the second half of my life with someone or looking for someone, I'd rather be with someone. And really, I think the problem is that, as guys, we're pretty shallow. The fear I feel has nothing to do with wanting to be straight; it's that I know, at some point, I'm going to lose my looks, and that's when I'll wish I'd settled down with someone a few years previously when I had the chance. I know it sounds harsh, but cmon, you've got more chance of catching someone's eye, getting to know them and settling down with them when you're young than when you're old. There might be a few younger guys who have fetishes for older men, but they tend to be shallow little cunts who just want to go from single mummy to sugar daddy without ever having to do a day's work in their lives.

I can't claim to know how the older gays feel relative to the younger gays (and neither can you, really, considering how you're reading their different attitudes), but I think the difference comes mainly from gay liberation simply not having the novelty value that it once did. While I'm in no way claiming that homosexuality is 100% accepted now, there's other clubs for us to go to, other things for us to do. The scene hemorrhages appeal once the novelty value wears off and you've been screwed around by a few jerks, and (perhaps) unlike previous generations, we don't have to put up with it; we can meet potential partners through circles of friends, or even in non-gay social situations. I've only met one of my boyfriends in a gay bar, and that's out of quite a few over the last 8 years. I've had a fair few one-nighters, but anything that's lasted has been built on more mutual commonalities than sharing a sexual orientation, and I think that's a direct result of how I've met them. The "gay lifestyle" just isn't that appealing on much more than a surface level. Yay, we're men who like men, so we don't have the gender difference in the way and can just ask each other for sex whenever we want! Whoop-de-fucking-doo. That gets so fucking boring when it's socially acceptable, which it basically is. Maybe if I'd not been able to do it as a kid, I'd still be wanting to do it well into middle-age, but I find it kinda hard to imagine. How many times can you have sex without it meaning anything? I mean, wow, maybe you meet a guy with an interesting kink... but how long's that going to be interesting?

I feel like I'm being an asshole at this point, but I also don't see why gay people have to live "the gay lifestyle" just because it's an option. So what if we're not risking impregnating anyone we sleep with? So what if we're not going to have babies? Is that a reason to acquiesce to a stereotype? Part of me gets annoyed when people say I'm "the least gay gay person" they know, because who the fuck is deciding what gay should be? I fuck dudes sometimes, that should be enough, but no, apparently I'm supposed to have completely different priorities and indulge every sexual whim I may have, just to live up to the legacy that my gay forefathers have left me. I wonder if that's it, if the older generation feels we're taking the freedom they fought for for granted every time we spend the night snuggled up together or working through our problems, rather than treating each other like cattle and seeing how many cocks we can cram into each other.

[/rant]

On an aside though, I'm not sure how this relates to what I said that you quoted. I was saying that, if you are selective with your close friends, rather than just having loads of acquaintances whom you tolerate, you'll seem like you can afford to be a bit choosy. Confidence is attractive, after all. I'm a little confused when people who have a massive range of friends (as in, different types of people) don't get why they can't get a serious relationship. It's pretty obvious, really.

 

Wow, I wrote way more than I wanted to. Maybe if I had more cocks in me I'd be more concise? I also figured out the reason why the dude quoted me, and I guess I was a little harsh, but I do mean everything I said. I just find it weird that me choosing not to live "the gay lifestyle" equates to me trying to "live up" to the straight lifestyle. I think the younger generation don't make the distinction. Straights are taking leaves out of our book too, they're doing those awful traffic light parties (with hilarious results) and suchlike... it's just about doing what you're comfortable with, and it seems kind of an assumption to suggest that gay guys would only want the same as straight guys because they're trying to be like them. People are people, and we all want to be love.

 

Welcome to gay reality. Total gay experience. Unedited.

 

Agree, "old jaded fag" is a fighting statement.

 

Contrary to your beliefs and depending what clubs you go into, us older guys over 40 are a commodity. Many of us are quite a catch. I can only voice out my humble opinion that I'm very goodlooking with money in the bank, a house that's not rented, a great car, stocks and other investments. I'm still a great dancer unlike most kids today. I wear nice clothes. Dependable guy with good health. Sexy nice guy here and collage educated with excellent future prospect. Before I forget, I have a nice dick too a little more than 8 inches. I've been told I'm great in bed and very romantic. A great date. I don't cruise young guys but young guys can't help themselves brushing up and down against me.

 

Embarrassing to watch? You sound uptight. You really need to get laid soon. I'm glad I'm a male gay and over 40 without giving offense to you. I've dealt with many of my baggage. You wait 'til you reach over 40 and see if you would still feel the same about what you just wrote.....................

 

Speak for yourself.

You assume right away that when a young guy goes with an older guy he's automatically a golddigger. Wrong. To tell you the truth the younger guys I've dated with paid for the dinners and I find that younger guys are great with gifts. They're very generous compared to some older guys I've dated with. Many older guys have high standards just to let you know. They've been around the block and they know a bullshitter when they see one. Keep this in mind that most older guys know how to defend themselves. The victimized older people are only victimized because they choose to be in that relationship. Most older gay guys like myself are ahead of the gay games, but you're still young. You have a lot ahead of you to look forward to including heartbreaks.

You've heard of the Stonewall riots? Before Stonewall many gays met their partners through friends and secret private clubs. They also met them in bathrooms, porn shops and parks! Gays back then did things outside of the gay arena like fishing, travelling......... So what's so new about today? Yes you are sounding like an asshole because there is no such thing as one gay lifestyle because the gay world is so diverse.

Hey, count me out as part of your stepping stone. You wouldn't be writing this ignorant rantings if I had anything to do with your gay upbringing.

 

I think you're misreading me. I'm not saying that anyone over 40 is repugnant. I'm just saying that I don't understand the appeal of gay clubs to someone that age. I'm hoping that, by the time I get to that age, I'll be into different things than I am now, just as, 20 years on from being 4 years old, I am glad to say that I no longer wet the bed.

Well no, I'll speak for you too, sweetheart. You seem happy enough to speak for me.

Aww, nice of you to slip that in at the end. I look forward to those heartbreaks.

What's new today is that there's no need for secrecy, there's no real need for a "gay arena". Yet still it persists, in its guise as the local meatmarket. The "gay arena" as I've seen it amounts to little more than obsession over one's own sexuality. I suppose that's inevitable when a group is united by that common element, but that's precisely why I steer clear of it, to be honest; I don't see why I'd have anything in common with someone just because we were both gay. I don't see the point in fighting for equality if we end up basically doing the same old shit we did when homosexuality was a criminal offense.

I don't really understand your comment at the end about the gay world being diverse. My point was that gay people are diverse, and that the lifestyle offered to those who wish to identify as gay is, by comparison, banale. Unless you believe that we are as individuals the architects of our own culture - which I'd strongly disagree with - I don't see what you're getting at. When I said "gay lifestyle", I refer to the lifestyle that's presented to us, the one that you seemed to be describing before. I didn't notice much mention of anything other than hedonistically hanging out in bars looking for "potential partners". Maybe the bits where we work hard, contribute to society and don't let our difference from the norm dictate everything we do just went over my head.

What exactly do you mean by my "gay upbringing"? What shock revelation would you have laid on me that is obviously too terrible and life-shattering to recount here at this moment? Or does it only work if I've just come out and haven't experienced the gay scene yet? Would it persuade me that the bits I just endured as a teen were worth it, or even somehow enjoyable? Would you have engendered in me an appreciation for the pseudo-fascistic motorik that underpins it all? I hope so.

Do you think anyone has the right to be critical of the gay lifestyle? I found out recently that a lot of LGB folk are very disdainful of one of my favourite authors, William Burroughs, because of the way he presented and discussed homosexuality in his books - basically because he didn't make it out to be some beautiful thing, anymore than heterosexuality is.