Self-Sufficiency

its incredible, in this day and age, that you've managed to get 85% of the way there.

I can't really contemplate what it took but well done

 

a lot of effort.. its not as amazing as you think.. in a ideal climate a family of four can be fed on a quarter acre,we have 15 and devote about 2 to the gardens.. we have water on the property,a spring for drinking water,ample trees for firewood..
we even built our own log cabin here although we also have a conventional built house.. we raise goats for milk and meat and chickens for eggs and meat.. we have done away with propane as we now cook and bake with a wood fired grill and oven i built or a solar oven.. we use a solar dehydrator for preserving what foods we dont can..
we will soon make the switch to solar hot water..
the biggest thing is having the funds to buy the land,tools,fencing,livestock and seeds..

from there its just a lot of work,,but it is a labor of love for us...

 

There's a reason humans band together in families and tribes. It's an incredible amount of work to survive, let alone live abundantly by yourself, living off of what wilderness yet remains very few could do it. However, throwing your lot in and working together with OTHER humans, incredible things can be built. Intentional Community.

 

lol we gave up on other humans..
they are not worth the baggage they bring with them..

 

Well, starting with the fact that I grew up in the middle of nowhere, with no running water, no hydro lines, no phone on a subsistence farm gives me a much better idea then most what it is really like.

I sorta have to laugh at some of these people who try to attack on the basis that I am not currently living in the country and doing it. It's actually part of the reason I tend not to take part in these threads.

Just because I spent part of my adult life living in cities and am at the moment on the net a lot, the assumption seems to be that I don't have any concept of these things beyond talking and wasting hot air. Simple fact is not only did I grow up doing it, I have already made the transition back to the country more then once, both successfully and unsuccessfully. I've built windmills from scratch, both vertical and horizontal, I've looked after pretty much any type of farm animal to one degree or another over the years. I've milked cows and goats, did everything from shovel shit to castrate piglets. I've had parts of my body places I would rather not remember (but unfortunately will).

Living in the country, using the utility grids and living a 'conventional' life is hard. It's the hardest work most people will ever do... not just in the jobs that you have to do, but the fact that they have to be done every day in most cases. You will damage yourself, maybe lose a body part or two, smell things no living being should ever have to smell (and then have to handle the source of that smell).

Now, if you want to live there and do it in a sustainable manner ... you just increased the difficulty of setting everything up. You need a whole set of skills that most people don't even realize exist. You need knowledge based on what others have done before. but most importantly, you have to be willing to recognize that your life will be just as you make it.

Don't feel like going out and bringing wood in today? No problem, shut the fuck up when it gets cold. Don't want to dig that 250 foot trench for the water line? Fine... don't whine about carrying buckets and smashing through ice to get water (or even more fun, melting snow).

Living in a sustainable manner in the country is the hardest ongoing work you will ever find. It is also worth every drop of blood, sweat and tears (even the occasional finger) that you lose for it.

As for money, and such, you need some cash income as I already said and has been said by so many others... how much depends on what you want.

If you want tv, net, phones, and so on, you can have them... you just need to gear your life to fit them. Not just in terms of how much money you need to pay for them, but also in terms of energy.

I decided that this time when we go, we are doing it on our own, without the involvement of others in terms of starting up, because we don't plan on starting a forth time down the line. I chose a path that let me make sure that when it's started we have the minimums we need to set it up as we want, and have the income to cover it. In this, I will have a benefit over those who lived that life while getting those things, which is why I did it this way.

But with everything we are bringing with us, (lots in comparison to what hippiehillbilly would have started with), nothing compared to conventional life, it isn't going to change a simple underlying fact.

It is hard work, and for every toy we add to our list (computers, sat, etc), it gets a little bit harder.

Of course... I've already said that we are going back to start again this year, even if I had to do it with nothing but an axe and knife. Because anything is better then staying in towns and putting up with the people here...



On the matter of giving up on other humans...

I've seen one or two of your posts about at least one of those others and all I can say is I hope I have the patience to get the morons to town when they act like that.

The most common thing I have heard over the years and through the previous starts has been... "oh, you mean it's not already built, I wanted something that was"...

 

i honestly cant say ALL the folks that came through here were a disappointment..
however,,i think it is fair to say that EVERY SINGLE PERSON that came through here looking for a long term or permanent arrangement were beyond what we would consider a disappointment..

the folks that already had something goin in the city an just wanted to get away for a while,the college kids,the folks from other countries,,quite a few of them were very hard workers and understood ya couldnt get things done sitting around geting high all day after ya slept till noon..

the folks contacting us through ic.org were not worth the time it took to type back to them once they got here..

 

or toe,,

inside joke..

a truer statement has never been typed...

 

er... I may have a finger that isn't quite as long as it should be, that also was experience talking... lol

as for not everyone being a disappointment. I can agree with that, but the frustration of dealing with the 99-1 odds can be... wearing...

 

The "we" in that statement contradicts the rest of it. Obviously you're not living all by yourself. I submit that humans NEED other humans. Yes, many humans are lazy immature drainbows. We have more than our fair share of them right now, but they are mostly growing as people, and given some hard internal work, enough of us can move beyond that and work together to create something real.

With humans of the right intention, many hands can make lighter work, no? Either way, I'm not ready to give up on humans yet. Our community is still Welcome Home!

Love and Light,
Joshua

 

I see no contradiction... or at least not more of one then in your own statement...

 

i see no contradiction either i said "other humans" as in past the 2 of us.. that does not contradict itself in any shape form or fashion..

we gave up on "families" on "tribes" and "other humans"..
as i stated its easier just to do it ourselves..
do we need each other?? i submit that either of us could survive without the other therefore,,no we dont "need" each other.
we choose to have a partnership...

 

y'know....yeah you do
when dealing with Intent it is important to distinguish Intent from intentions (the way paved to hell because they are not followed through with) whereas Intent is a focus and desire so burning that without which you do not feel whole and will never be satisfied until you Grow to it,
And therein is what one must look to....usually the likeminded we speak of does not have to do with wanting to hang around getting stoned...it has to do with a burning need within to be true to that without which we feel this is not the life desired.
And experience repeats over and over that those Being true to following Intent are few and far between and usually so focused on it that sometimes they do not See another who may be of likemind....whereas those with good intentions abound, but their intention must constantly change as they use them only as a feel good guage rather than something they are committed to.
And so discernment becomes paramount because seldom can community happen with those of good intentions who are not willing to follow through. And those being true to their Intent must be able to See each other and honor our Connections.

On the other hand for those who have experienced the joy of joining in resonating Intent , such a powerful experience...and even becomes one we wish to have in our live as a constant...even while the individuals it encompasses change. (yah that damn constant) - Change...Bless it ! with reverend thanks.

yee hah
Life Is

Peace, Blessings, & Love

Namaste

 

one reasoning i have never been able to understand in the forums is people saying they want to get away from people yet wanting to live in close proximity to others who feel likewise in a commune ................an oxymoron??

 

Shouldn't be too hard to understand. The desire to not be around the majority of people, have nothing to do with the desire to be around those who feel the same.

There seems to be a misconception that if someone wants to build a community, that it has to be open to any and all. It isn't true in any situation I have ever heard of. Each place sets out criteria of what they find acceptable or not in the behavior of others and either extend or withdraws welcome depending.

For those who say all are welcome, I would prefer not to go to a place where child molesters, rapists and the like are allowed. Of course, thats just my opinion on it...

 

If u want to buy some cheap land in the western states in the middle of nowhere
www.radiusland.com

 

I think humans need other humans to stay sane and be mentally healthy.

Look at really rural places where people only interact with inbreed cousins or those crazy old miners and ranches. It keeps people cultured to interact with people.

I think most people don’t realize how intense interact in a commune is though.

It is like having 50 roommates.. You can’t do anything without interacting with someone.
I have lived on communes and very small towns and this point of my life it’s not for me. I don’t like to constantly worry about my roommates or neighbors. I just want to worry about my family and me then just go socialize with my neighbors. Just have a BBQ and talk about fun things. not who didn’t work enough or who lost the community tools.

About self sufficiency good luck unless you have a huge bank account..

I know people that have inherited land and infrastructure that do it but it took their grandparents and there parents generations of hard work to build. And they work their asses off faming huge fields or breeding horses or cattle.

I have never seen hippies be self sufficient from making candles or tie dies..

Most farmers and rancher I know say if they had to go out and buy their land they would never make a living off of it. You invest a million dollars in land you will need to bring in $100,000 a year just to stay a float. That is no pleasure game that is hard work and business strategy.

But it can be fun to experiment buy a thousand dollar acre a camper and $200. of rice and beans you will probably learn more then $20,000 of collage.

 

we are not rich and we did not inherit our land and as i stated before,we are now 85% self sustaining..
if we cut the power and phone off and dropped our homeowners insurance and the insurance on the trailer,i am totally confident that we could make enough off of what we do here on the property to be 100% self sustaining..

so obviously you havent met us hippies...


was it a easy row to hoe? no it wasnt but that doesnt mean we aint livin it an lovin it...

 

So do you guys have things you produce and sell for extra $ ?

What’s your main source of meat?



I believe it can be done it is just years of hard work and it is just getting harderd and harder with the global consumer economy.

My grandparents worked for a year and a half in a factory when they were first married and then opened there fist growing business and were self-sufficient until the day they died. It took them a lifetime of hard work to build and pay off all their land but they did it.

I live in Boulder the land of rich hippies and tons of hippies go out and buy land and make art and jewelry but they are mostly just living off of a trust fund, must be nice..

 

as i already stated in this thread, we raise goats for milk and meat,chickens for meat and eggs, we raise all our own food besides grain ,that we are beginning to do this year(another couple % then can be added to the 85%)..
we save all our seeds for the next years harvest as we grow only heirloom crops.

we have ample timber to sell firewood and if we needed we could also sell surplus crops. as i stated if we did away with the bills that i mentioned we would need less than 4 thousand a year to pay the taxes here and the rest of the incidentals..

yes its taken me about 20 years here,16 living here full time to get to this point. and yes i still have a full time job,although i work construction so this year i will make about what i did 15 years ago..

that being said,because of our lifestyle and our fiscal responsibility we are still living comfortably and are still able to put back a little cash each week so when the SHTF we will have something to fall back on till we identify our market for the goods we will sell to earn the monies needed to exist without a real job...

being self sustaining has been a goal of ours for as long as either of us can remember and we take great pride and joy in knowing we have done it all on our own with no help from anyone else..

 

zihger, I see a lot of 'this person told me this', 'such and such a person did that', 'the other guy tried something else', combined with a lot of, "you can't do that', and 'it isn't possible' and so on...


What do YOU do for a living?