Schizophrenia

No - it just means I'm not seeing clearly. I am deceived by my senses. Mistaking one object for another. That isn't what I'd call reality.

 

No, you choose to exclude the fact that when you are driving on a highway you are in a bigger reality than just what you can perceive. Realities do not sometimes overlap or collide, they ALWAYS overlap and collide. That is so because reality is bigger than your own perception. What you perceive is only what you perceive: a part of reality. Deduction my friend. There is no way around it.

 

Not really, just my own advocate. Always remember: what I state is MY reality, not yours.

Foot or meter, kelvin or celsius, it doesn't matter. It is constructed, not something that universally exists. You can create measurements any way you like. They just need to be consistent. Check how many types of miles there are (and have been). It's frigging confusing.

 

You're expressing your opinion about reality - not reality itself - as we all are.

 

No it is your own take on reality, not your own reality. We share the same reality but perceive it subjectively.

Evidently.

 

That you cannot perceive meaningfully into the minds of others is a false dichotomy.

We share our thoughts.

I have heard voices. I recognize them as my nervous systems response to some kind of stimulus being interpreted quite profoundly as auditory.

Same thing with visions.

Schizophrenia is still being studied being itself disordered perception but understanding is increasing at the same time a proportionate sensitivity to people so afflicted is lacking by the general public.

The only useful purpose disordered perception can be put to is to straighten it out or guide it carefully. Too many resign the mentally scrambled as lost cause or crazy and therefor unapproachable or untouchable. We do know that institutionalization does not cure.

I think the argument that schizophrenia is visionary in a mystical sense is a poor one as the mystically visionary exhibit some coherence or context to real concerns and generally do not consider their own thoughts to be a plague nor do their thoughts cause them to plague others.

 

Look, the way to measure is constructed. It is indeed only a mean (sp) or way created by us to get to know something. We invented the metre and celcius etc. It is not about that. I'm not arguing that they are artificially constructed by us. It is WHY we use them that matters in regards to this thread. We use them because it is clear we share the same reality and by using these absolute measurements that we can't do with our own senses we expand our perception of reality.

 

We all see the same thing and we don't all agree on what it looks like. The thing that makes standard measurement useful is that it allows us to come to agreement and develop consensual perception or learn about the the world we share. The measuring device does not exist beyond our creation of it but it is useful in apprehending creation in a way we can all access with equal aplomb.

 

That's what I was saying albeit in completely different wording

What it is indicating though is that there is a commonly shared reality in which we are all living. It does not matter to reality wether you don't see a car crashing into you. You can proclaim it wasn't part of reality before it hit you. But you can not deny it wasn't there when you wake up in the hospital afterwards.

 

i can see that

 

To go back to the car crash example - to our immediate perception it appears that the car consists of one big lump of matter hurtling towards us on collision course. But we know that all matter is made up of atoms, which consist mainly of empty space. On the sub-atomic level it gets even more strange and removed from our normal sensory input.

 

Atoms and subatomic levels are not part of my reality, Bill! My perception and all :afro:

 

I like that but I can't think of any snappy comeback. :dizzy2:

 

So because something COULD be there but I don't perceive it you deduct that I'm doing it by choice?

When exactly did your reality last collide with that of a polar bear? Except for seeing on on TV that is.

Of course my perception concerns only me. I already stated that.

 

Exactly. Only I am stating that it's one and the same.

We use them because people like to agree on things. It makes them feel safer. It makes communication easier.

I think you misunderstand my point .... or maybe I just can't express it well enough. Maybe I can put it this way: until you open the box, Schroedinger's cat is both alive and dead.

 

So any opinion you have is to be taken as reality? That seems like a grandiose claim.

And if you take that position, how far do you take it? You'd have to be infallible to me to make such a claim.

 

Not by you - or anyone else for that matter. My reality is not necessarily your reality.

Sometimes they overlap. Sometimes they collide.

 

Some might say my reality collides with the reality of a polar bear every time I burn more fossil fuels, thus contributing to the demise of the Arctic environment that sustains them.

I can also recall seeing polar bears in a zoo many years ago and thinking how un-natural their enclosure was and how such creatures could only be miserable under such conditions.

If I wanted to I could travel to where polar bears live - I'd then have to be aware of their reality or I might end up as dinner.

There's only one big reality, although it has multiple aspects. We only see a little bit of it, and we can often be mistaken even about that.

 

Then we'll have to disagree. Different realities. [sharedmedia=gallery:images:70378]