Liroy, Meagain did answer it finally a few pages back: http://www.hipforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=235991&page=13&pp=10
God is a being in all, there is no satan. Satan is a manifistation inside of yourself, thats what jesus was trying to say. idiots
Who you calling an idiot? So if Satan is a manifestation of yourself, it's just an artifact of the ego. So why all the lies and fear surrounding the devil? Let's call it what it really is, in scientific terms, and deal with it in a WHOLISTIC way. It's a part of us, in that having an ego imparts a set of physical needs and we sometimes feel GUILTY about those because Christian Puritanism has made us feel thus. But it needn't be that way, and the path towards liberation requires you acknowledge this self-truth, but we must transcend it and not get attached to this ego game, which is ultimately what ALL organized RELIGION is about.
Believe it or not, I agree. I think Satan and Santa have a lot in common besides the similarly spelled names and red suits--neither exists as supernatural beings acting in the real world. Of course, we know that "yes, Virginia, there is a Santa Claus", the spirit of Christmas. (we don't know how satisfied Virginia was with that copout answer.) As I and others have said, it's possible to take the same approach with Satan and say he represents the spirit of evil, and there's certainly lots of that in the world. (that's what I was trying to get at in an earlier post). Is it helpful to do that? I don't think so. Of course, if my dog's head starts to swivel, and he starts babbling in Aramaic, I might change my mind. And if I end up being roasted over a firepit for all eternity, I'm sure I'll be singing a different tune--in high C.
Perhaps Satan and Santa are just two sides of the same coin? One hands out presents, the other lashes. Both of them seem awfully concerned about whether we are being bad or good, no? And that is REALLY the bottom line. Are you following your Christian Leaders commandments, or are you being bad, bad, bad? If so you do not pass Christmas, do not collect Santa's gifts, and go straight to HELL! Isn't that a lovely punishment? So what are you waiting for? Flip that coin!
Speaking of the Devil, some modern bible scholars claim that the image we have of Satan today is a composite of possibly separate characters:the serpent in the Garden of Eden, the Adversary who wagers with God over the fate of Job, Lucifer (the Fallen Angel) driven out of heaven, and the fiend who tempts Jesus in the wilderness. The authors of the Old Testament may not have considered these to be the same dude. The Adversary seems to be a somewhat overzealous prosecutor in the heavenly hierarchy. Some early Christians (heretics?) of the so-called Gnostic school thought the serpent was good in trying to bring insight to humans. Other Christians viewed tham as snake worshipers. Some New Agers today think well of Lucifer--opening themselves up for fundamentalist Constance Cumby's attack on the New Age Movement. Satan, meaning "The Enemy", was the Evil One by Jesus' time, when he showed up in the desert to tempt the Lord. Any toughts?
Uh, what a typical, false Christian-centric response. If you had done any research you'd know that Satan is the spitting image of PAN, the nature god. The god of pleasure, especially sexual. A fertility god was Pan. Pan is STILL worshipped today by pagans and wiccans. Of course Christian mythology would have none of this, because they tried to wipe out all Pan cults in the early days of Christianity. So they vilified Pan, and made him out to be an EVIL BEING, which NEVER WAS THE CASE. Once again, Christianity brainwashed its followers with lies to keep them in fear and clinging to their church and clergy. But wait, if Satan is just an ego manifestation, then it's obvious Jesus was hallucinating, not unexpectedly, having been in the desert without food for 40 days. So he only met his inner demons, not a physical/fallenangelic presence. BTW, that is nearly exactly what Native Americans do for their vision quests. Except they don't meet the devil, because they don't believe in one. Instead they meet their totem (if they're lucky), who becomes a positive symbol for their rest of their lives (rather than keeping Satan around). All this negativity and fear surrounding Satan are merely the Church manipulating its flock so they follow the strict teachings and don't stray. Here is PAN, NOT SATANIC AT ALL.
Further research might have turned up other possible extra-Christian influences besides Pan. In the Dharimepada, there's an episode in which Mara (Papiyan) tempts the Buddha that's very similar to the Jesus in the Desert story. Maybe the Buddha was also hallucinating. Or maybe the story was an allegory. The Egyptians had Set, who is still worshipped in the Temple of Set in California (a breakaway faction from the Church of Satan). And Zoroastrianism and Mithraism had Ahriman, who comes close to the Satanic model. Guys, it's been fun. Have a good life. Enjoy your conversation. I'm outta here. movin' on. Satan is boring. Adios.
Ahhh thank you Skip for pointing that out, and thank you Meagain for looking that up If that was a reply to my post FedUp, Then no, I am not satisfied, but thank you for the reply though I know exactly what you are saying and it's the same I believe, but you and I both dont believe in god, and I think you have to believe in god in order to believe in satan. I was looking for a answer from a true christian =) @Piney: Why is Pan a demon? @wayfaring_stranger: lol... goodbye then
No you just need to believe in Jesus, because Satan is supposed to be the Anti-Christ. You can't have one without the other. So by accepting Jesus into your life, you must also accept Satan into your life, no?
That would be the logical conclusion, yep. @FedUp: Yes well... same thing when it applies to this thread.
And the LOGICAL course of action when presented with such a fact (that Satan comes along with Jesus), would be to REJECT Jesus, so you don't need to deal with Satan in your life, no? I think all wannabe Christians should be forced to take a course in LOGIC. Because Christianity is one of the most ILLOGICAL concepts to ever be devised by the mind of man. And it follows that anyone who would accept the ILLOGICAL premises of Christianity would likewise fall for any ILLOGICAL sales pitch so long as there's some profit to be made in it, or so long as it "allays" the fears that have been drummed into them since childhood. Any Christians out there want to buy a few used WARS? We're selling them cheap! Iraq, price slashed! Afghanistan, old model reduced for clearance! Iran - latest model, place your order now to ensure you get some of the action!
Let me put in my two cents on the description of Mara in a previous post. That was taken out of context. (S)he was not a Satanic force, rather, a force of delusions and illusions. Now back to Satan. I don't believe in evil in the world, there are only wholesome deeds and unwholesome deeds. To put into gardeners terms, weeds and flowers. The acts that many will claim to be the work of "Satan" are nothing more than the result of delusion and ignorance. Satan is a mythical figure, just like the Christian god. Peace and love
I was curious, so I Googled Mara. Wikipedia said: "Mara is the demon who tempted Gautama Buddha by trying to seduce him with the vision of beautiful women who, in various legends, are often said to be his daughters." I read elsewhere where Mara was the personification of temptation. Hope this is useful.
Thanks! I read that story a long time ago, but forgot the name of the temptress. I believe she could also be a metaphor for maya, because she's symbolic of all the temptations/illusions of maya.
