religious reasons for being exempt from vaccinations

Moonflower, I totally respect your opinion, but I'll just say that Brian's aunt has polio. She's been paralayzed almost all of her life. And in the beginning, he was adament that Moire eventually get at least, her polio vaccination.

But after much research, we found that in our day and age, with vitamins, cleanliness, and so much medical knowledge, Moire's likelihood of ever getting polio is pretty nil. And if she, for some odd reason, did get it, the likelihood that it would cause paralysis or any other major problem is EXTREMELY nil.

Like I said, though, I respect your opinion. Just letting you see the reasoning for our choices.

 

I lived in a country where polio was everywhere. Beggers laying in the street with it and just about every other "cured" disease in the world.

IMO, just because a disease isn't common in the country you currently live doesn't mean that it doesn't occur in other countries. If I could be sure that Mandred would never leave the safety of our little corner of our safe G8 country then I probably wouldn't vacinate.

But who can be sure that their kids will never travel? I know I plan on advocating travel to my kids, and we are looking into to taking our kid(s) on a trip through SE Asia when they are in elementary school.

 

is it possible to vax your children after their brain went through the major parts of developing?

 

is it possible to vax your children after their brains went through the major parts of developing?

 

When we decide to travel to areas of the world where vax-protected diseases are prevalent, M will be vaccinated. No question. But as of now, while she's tiny and developing more quickly than any other period in her life, especially neurologically, we want to keep her vax-free.

 

Yes, delayed vaccination is an option some parents choose, after the child's immune system has developed and strengthened.

Here's some interesting info about vaccines...

http://poisonevercure.150m.com/ingredients.htm

http://www.vaclib.org/index.htm

Most of the diseases we vaccinate against are no longer considered fatal, measles, mumps, rubella, and chicken pox are simple childhood diseases that may be uncomfortable for a few days (but anyone who has vaccinated a child knows that vaccines can make them mighty sick, as well), but provide a life-long immunity if the child actually has the disease. I think most of us grew up when they used to have chicken pox parties, when one child in the neighborhood got it and all the kids went over there to play. The above mentioned diseases may be deadly in adults, though, so personally, if my children have not been exposed by their teens, I will get them immunized.

 

I wouldn't be so sure of that.......

1 in 500 US people has autism or an autism spectral disorder, 1 in every 150 children has some form of autism. Every year the numbers of children with autism increases.

4.2 million children between the ages of 3 and 17 have been diagnosed with a learning disability.

25 million people a year seek treatment for chronic depression.


10% of the US population has an attention deficit disorder. (Just an anecdote, but when my son was in pre-K, which are 4 year olds, in his class of 21 children, 13 were on behavior modification medications for ADD or ADHD)

12.8 million Americans are substance abusers.

50 million Americans suffer from a mental illness.

Then, which I can't believe hasn't been brought up as yet, there's the connection between SIDS and vaccines...

http://www.vaccinationnews.com/Rally/Sids&VaxCoult.htm

http://www.vaccinationnews.com/DailyNews/December2001/FedClaimsCourtVax&SIDS.htm

PHP:

the chances of a serious adverse reaction to the DPT vaccine were 1 in 1750, while his chances of dying from pertussis each year were 1 in several million

http://www.childbirthsolutions.com/articles/postpartum/dispelling/index.php

And if you have time

http://www.nomercury.org/media/haley/haley_files/default.htm

 

Yes, why was that, oh yea vaccines.

Yes, well said. You might not have to travel to find them soon with the anti-vaccine push. They could reappear here. Then the statisics will show the benefit of vaccines much like they did when they were first invented.

You are blaming all of that on vaccines? Where is the proof?

What you are showing is not proof. Correlation does not relate to causation. You could say that auto accidents went up from the 20's. Pop consumention went up over the same period of time. Therefore consuming pop increases your chance of having a car wreck right. It doesn't work that way.

 

I totally respect yours too. I didn't mean to come off like I didn't if that's how you took it.
I just am too paranoid to NOT get Alexis vax'd.

 

Oh no, I just didn't want you to think I was attacking you!

As far as paranoid, I'm a total paranoid freak. That's why I'm NOT vaxing. Funny how we all process in different ways.

 

Did I say that? Where?

What I AM saying, in rebuttal to your claim that;

is that there is a disproportionatly large number of the US population with very abnormal brain development. You don't think 1 in 150 children (vast majority of whom are vaccinated) strange or worrisome or in need of further investigation?

Your analogy is unapplicable to this situation (and completely out of the blue). What would be a correct analogy would be to say as the number of vehicles on the road increased, and as the number of drivers increased, so did the number of automobile accidents.

When medical history and statistics show that prior to wide-spread vaccinations, SIDS was virtually unheard of and so rare as to not be mentioned in ANY medical journal in the world, and as vaccinations became mandatory, there was a steady increase in babies suddenly dying without explanation while sleeping, and as the numbers of babies getting vaccinated increased, so did the numbers of babies dying within hours, days, or weeks of receiving a vaccine, you have a pretty clear cut case of association.

What the pharm. companies, APA, and FDA are saying is, well, babies who die between the ages of 3 weeks and six months, at the time when multiple routine vaccinations are given, is just a coincidence. Babies of that age are at a higher risk of dying, anyway.

Can you imagine any other drug linked to any other number of deaths being dismissed so casually?

Lets look, for example, at fen-fen, that controversial weight loss drug pulled off the market for it's association with the deaths of 38 people. 38 people is no where near the number of infants who have died from SIDS shortly after receiving a vaccination. As the makers of fen-fen argued, the people who are taking fen-fen are obese and at a greater risk of dying from complications of obesity, including heart attack, stroke, and pulminary hypertension. Yet, it was removed from the market and numerous lawsuits awarding damages.

YOu have no idea how much revenue pharm co's and pediatricians make from the sale and distribution of vaccines, or how powerful a lobby they make. Think about how much we know breastmilk is a superior food for infants, it has been proven over and over that without a doubt, formula is less than perfect food associated with a higher risk for diabetes, hypertension, weaked immune sytem, and higher susceptability ot infections. Yet in every hospital in America, formula is given to mothers for free, new mothers are inundated with formula samples and coupons in the mail, in their post-partum hospital gift bags, and one can barely turn on the telvision without hearing how this formula or that formula is "closest to breastmilk". Entire hospital nurseries, maternity wards, and pediatrician offices are gifted millions of dollars worth of free furnishings, medical equipment, office supplies, and even "seminars" in Vegas or the Bahamas in ritzy hotels, all in exchange for promoting and reccommending their brand of formula or vaccine.
The bottom line IS the bottom line. These special interest groups have billions invested in selling us the idea that formula is nearly, if not just as, good as breastmilk, and that vaccines are perfectly safe, despite the ever rising deaths, permanent damages, and lifelong afflictions that are related to their use.

It's all politricks, my friend.

 

Haid. Do some research. Educate yourself. Get yourself a copy of the CDC pink book.
Have you ever read the package inserts that come with the vaccine vials? Do you have any idea how the pharmaceutical industry works? Did you know that some vaxes are given the "fast track" to FDA approval without extensive long-term clinical testing? Why do vaccination standards change every year? Do you know how many of these vaxes contain lead, mercury, human diploid cells, formaldehyde, msg?

 

My son was damaged by vaccinations. Do I have medical proof? No, and I'm probably never going to find any. The medical profession stands behind the pharmaceudical companies because that's where their funding comes from. It certainly doesn't come from one dissatisfied mom. None the less, I know my son was damaged by the prevnar vaccination. We had said before we adopted him that we would not vaccinate. Then, because he had already had so many, we decided to finish out the main ones and just not do the chicken pox and mmr. Well, he was damaged by the prevnar. He was a healthy happy little boy who suddenly became asthmatic and was throwing up everything he ate. He went from having no food allergies to being allergic to almost everything except rice. He was so sick that the doctor decided that my healthy chunky little boy had cerebal palsy. Anyone looking at his strong healthy build could see that he did not have cp but she insisted on it. She was filling his little body with steriods and doing all kinds of medical tests on him to prove her point. When I wanted to take him to a chiropractor she screamed at me on the phone to do no harm. How was a chiropractor going to harm him any more than she was? Within 1 day of beginning the herbal treatment the chiropractor recommended we were able to throw away the zantac he was taking twice a day. Once we took him off milk we were able to wean him off all the steroids. It took two years of strickly watching every bite of food that went into his mouth and treating him with herbs to return his system to normal. He is now finally able to eat almost everything without any health problems. Now he is a healthy 51 pound four year old. And as long as I have any say over it, he will never have another immunization. Is his hyperactivity a result of his vaccination damage? We'll never know that. I'm sure that if he were in public school he would be one of those drugged up four year olds that Brighid mentioned. That's just one of the reasons we are homeschooling him.

If you are going to vaccinate your child, than be sure of your decision. Get the research and you decide. Don't let anyone else, either the medical profession or those of us who have definite opinions about it, change your mind. But if your gut tells you it's wrong. Don't do it.

And my brother also had polio. He went on to serve in the Marine Corp afterward.

Kathi

 

Who says these are abnormal brain developments. We know that they have at least genetic pre-dispositions. Some of these diseases have only been defined in the last couple of decades. So who is to say that 1 in 150 still wouldn't have these problems if no vaccines were given. There is a jump in logic here without proof. Once again just to make it clear I support other parents in making decisions they feel are right.

That because SIDS wasn't considered a medical condition then. As long as people have had babies some have died young. This is not new and if anything has been greatly reduced. Ok, you mention statistics. This is what I want to see. I have a degree in business stats and can garantee you correlation does not equal causation. Show me a study that has linked SIDs or any other medical conditions with vaccines that show a statistical significance(not correlation). I read through what you posted before and it said because SIDs increased at the same time vaccines did then vaccines are to blame. Not true on a statistical level. Like I said so did the amount of cars, exhaust in the air from machinery and factories, pesticides in food, less exercise in the population, etc. Based on what you call evidence anything that increased while SIDS did could be considered at fault.

Most drugs on the market have been shown to cause rare reactions that can cause death. I still give my children medicine when they need it. The risks of a reaction are low the benefits outway them. The same as vaccines.

So what is this number. How many kids got the vaccines but didn't die in the same period. Are all the deaths proven to be from vaccines? You are presenting your argument as fact with nothing to back it up.

Yes, I do but that doesn't make them unsafe. How much would the pharm co's make selling drugs to the infants who died over their lifetimes? Again not proof and unrelated unless you can back it up.

Again, where are the studies that prove this. Just because you think it is that way does not make it true enough for me to put my child at risk of catching a virus that is easily protected against. Again I am sure their are rare reactions but if you avoid everything someone could have a reaction to you wouldn't be able to consume anything. I know peanuts cause deaths but my kids still eat them and thats without the PROVEN benifits vaccines provide, like virtually wiping out Polio and small pox in the world.

 

Haid, are you currently up to date on all of your vaccinations?

 

Ummm, physicians? Neurologists?

Why would anyone need to define a disease or disorder that doesn't exist? They haven't been defined, described, or diagnosed before they actually came about. They would have, at least, had a different name, like what used to be called "leprosy" is now known as "Hanson's disease"; "Mongoloidism" is now known as "Down's Syndrome"; and what used to be called "fits" is now known to be a seizure disorder. No one is claiming Hanson's disease didn't exist before it was known as "Hanson's Disease" just because it was called "leprosy".

A lot of things have "genetic predispositions", however, most need a catalyst to evolve into the disease or disorder. Schizophrenia, which we all know has a pre-disposition, has been linked to exposure to toxoplasmosis, for an example. Perhaps, and there is strong evidence that this is so, pumping an infant full of known neuro-toxins at 6 week intervals is the catalyst for autism.

Whaaaaaa? Are you saying that back in the day, people just assumed or thought it was normal for otherwise healthy babies to just go to sleep and die? I'd LOVE it if you could quote your source! We're talking less than 60 years ago, not colonial times!

But no medical background....if you did, you would know that the correlation of symptoms, environmental factors, onset of symptoms, and Hx is crucial to a diagnosis. I think, despite your degree, you are confusing correlation with coincidence....Statistics are an important part of my job.....I have to compile statistics every year in order to keep my license. I'm no stranger to statistics .

But anyway, here you go...
http://www.whale.to/vaccine/sids1.html

http://www.whale.to/vaccine/articles.html

http://www.newswithviews.com/Howenstine/james.htm



and you can research further if you wish, but somehow I think you'd rather not know.

Over 3,000 infants a year. That's nine per day. In the USA alone.
Is that an insignificant number of deaths, in your opinion? Just "soda pop and automobiles"?

Autism?
14,000 cases of onset of autism after a vaccine every year.

This is interesting
http://www.vaccineawareness.org/information/VAERS_statisticsnov01.htm

Haven't all of these created known diseases in human beings? Cancers, diabetes, hypertension, etc, etc, etc,?

The key words are rare and most. Drugs on the market that cause frequent reactions that may cause a death are removed, unless the risk:benefit ratio is in favor of the drug. The risk of a child dying from chicken pox is virtually non-existant. The risk of a child developing a severe reaction to the vaccine is 67.5 per 100,000.

Interesting info from the packet insert of Varivax, the most commonly used chicken pox vaccine (just for starters)
http://www.merck.com/product/usa/pi_circulars/v/varivax/varivax_pi.pdf

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Peanuts don't cause death unless there is an allergy. If your child was allergic, would you still let him eat them?

Every major medical organization in the world cites improvement in sanitation, water quality, and hygeine as the number one cause of the reduction of deaths from infectious diseases in the world. Once people started washing their hands, diseases declined. Vaccines get a nod, but it is not listed anywhere near the top 10 reasons.

 

Here's a pretty good list of vaccine ingredients

http://poisonevercure.150m.com/ingredients.htm