Real reasons behind the "Fatherhood Crises"...

Oh and I direct you to just about everything that Green and FFF have posted. Green always seems to be on a personal mission to convince the world that American women are evil harpies that want to emasculate him and take all his money. FFF has some obvious bitter issues regarding single mothers. Maybe his mom was like Norman Bates' mom.

 

Well, i'm glad you haven't fallen for the feminazi/men are scum and deserve everthing they get/2 wrongs make a right/who cares about fathers and husbands when there is still a glass ceiling/put the sins of the fathers onto the sons/stop crying men you still make more $/cosmic gender karma... propaganda.

How does the unfair treatment of men fix the unfair treatment of women?

 

dang, ur good, dude!

hi, cynical_otter, all i can do is speak from my own experience...to me this isn't about gal-bashing by a long shot, even tho i know some guys just can't seem to help themselves.

remember, the suffragettes got plenty angry before they were heard, so cut the modern-dude just a bit of slack, ok?

it's about how suffrage was an issue of equality, not about getting the vote, then taking the vote away from men.

it's about going too far...just like you personally were never deprived of your right to vote, the contemporary man shouldn't be made to pay for "the sins of the father."

but he is, over and over. most of the time, he's at a loss to figure out what it is he did to deserve it, just like the ladies of old wondered why they weren't being treated equally.

legislation and corporate policies are strong influences, and since right now you gals are getting off on the guy-bashing and paying good money to see it, i don't see an equal-ization happening anytime soon.

at this point, i suspect it's gonna have to be a female that cries "enough is enough, i think they got the message!"

how 'bout you, maybe?

i'd bet those "sisters" that worked so hard to make your life better than theirs was would be disappointed to see what you're all doing with your equality.

 

Now, if you want to talk about fathers who chose to not be around, this a good place to start:


http://www.hipforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=189586


Seperate topic, seperate thread...

 

Back to the initial article. I'm confused, and I really would like some clarification. How are the fathers who are doing what they should - (spending time with their children, and paying child support - let's not talk about alimony at this point since it is about fathers and not exes - the ones that are depicted in the article as being "perfect" and upstanding citizens) - how are these men arrested and "violated"?

I just think that the article is slightly one-sided, which it has every right to be, I just happen to disagree with it. I don't think that because women can and do file for divorce more now than they have before that it is causing men to be wrongfully accused of being a "deadbeat dad".

I know this isn't about men or women bashing, but rather government or 'system' bashing, however, I still think that the so-called facts are a bit skewed. Like the rest of you, I can only go on my own experiences and what I have seen, and I've never seen anything like what was described in the article. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but I honestly don't believe it is as prevelant as it suggests.

 

Poetic Justice, friend.

 

It was an effing joke. I was kidding. The unfair treatment of men does not justify the unfair treatment of women. But women are sick and tired of falling through the system cracks, and if that means that we even out the playing field with men who tend to fall through the cracks, then so fucking be it. It's not a perfect world.

 

if i may...this article New American Bar Association Article Points to
Crisis in False Paternity Judgments addresses the issue in a more responsible manner, imo.

it might could breath some life back into an issue that warrants (zappa-whisper) scaa-roo-tinee

 

Now see, here we are presented with an actual problem and there is a completely logical way to correct it (paternity testing before ruining a guy's life). Has nothing to do with bashing either sex.

 

Ummm no, what I meant was for the state or county or whomever is forcing the guy to pay, to give him a paternity test before making him pay. Doesn't seem that difficult. I mean I would imagine that the guy would jump at the chance to prove he is not responsible if he doesn't want to pay, and any good upstanding man, like you guys all claim are being falsely "imprisoned" would stand up and "do the right thing" without having to be forced.

The issue wouldn't have to come up while the couple is happily together, but only after someone files for divorce and child support is an issue. Otherwise he should keep his mouth shut if he doesn't want to sleep on the couch. It would be simple, the woman goes to court and demands child support. The court says ok, we'll make him pay, but only if he is the real father. So, we will bring the child in and the father in, do the test and figure it out. If he is not the father then the bitch is shit out of luck.

 

yup. logical & fair outlook, logical & fair solution.

problem is, so is the child shit out of luck. believe me, it's no fun having
an angry "bitch" for a mother.

this reinforces the point that we need more women to start admitting to equal culpability & taking more responsibility before conception..."she" has most of the (bio/socio/legal) choices in "her" corner & should be a bit more careful wielding those "weapons," eh? the most
effective weapon/choice in a womans' arsenal is the word "no"...but that one's not being
used enuff these days, im(old-timey)o.

btw, what's with the "all you guys" stuff? is that a (shudder)generalization i see there?

 

if they get a divorce, and the child is suddenly without a father who took him as his own child for the entirety of that child's life, i can imagine that that kid will be feeling horribly betrayed. once you take responsibility for someone, bitch mother aside, you owe that child your devotion. you made a pact with that child. leaving it because it's not your blood would be cruel.

 

...so i guess you're saying guys should be thinking ahead and say "no" more often, also :H

"wrap it up" every time, brothers...no foul, no harm :sunglasse


Protect Children from Alienation
unfortunately, the "bitch" mother will usually keep even the best-intentioned "dads" away
from the child for spite, but your point stands strong on its own merit, mynameiskc.

 

well, i've got a sister in law who did that. my brother didn't fight at all. as such i wanna kick his lazy ass. my husband's son is not his blood, but he's never ever given that boy up.

 

and yes, i've learned, don't ever trust a woman. ever. i don't care how much you think she's straight up alright. unless you wanna have a baby and pay for it, never ever trust your woman to take care of the birth control. she may not even deliberately get pregnant, sometimes the pill gets forgotten one day (truly by accident). we're not infallible, no matter what we try to tell you.

 

FatFreddyFreekowtski, cutelildeadbear...& the "sleeping on the couch" bit.

mandatory testing across the board (one copy to each parent or suspected parent) solves that prob: "i'm pregnant, hunny-bunny...my ob/gyn says we'll do the dna-thingy during one of my checkups." healthcarewise, a pre-natal dna-thingy wouldn't be a bad thing to have around, anyways.

if it's a happy couple, that paper's always gonna mean something good.

if it's a "rocky" couple, well, just who winds up "on the couch" will be quickly settled, eh? maybe the document makes a good difference, tho. maybe they finally bond.

if it's just 2 dead-beats having fun, then both bio-parents can be held equally accountable from the very beginning of the childs' life and thru to young adulthood. this means that even an unwanted-child abandoned to the system at least gets a system that can afford to do a better job.

i guarantee there'd never be another false-dads' name on a birth certificate, ever! and as mynameiskc addressed, the loving non-biodad guy who says he wants to be dad can choose to legally-bind himself or not.

we could take it a step further...now, "poor" but loving & deserving parents could adopt also, because they'd be able to rely on child support from the legally bound bio-parents.

i know, i know....i'm pipe-dream'n agin...(cough) ooh...lookit all da happy kids....

 

of course, that brings us to: Respect a Man's Choice, Too

i thought this authors' credibility & presentation would help the thread...don't worry i'm not gonna bombard u with links, just wanted to showcase a good source.

 

A man soon enough will have more choice as soon as the male birth control pill becomes widely accessible and acceptable as a form of contraception.

 

i agree it's soon, but it's been fought for years. it's about $ in this case, too, imo. the "glenn sacks" site i've been linking to addresses the fight to bring such a pro-male contaceptive to market, and it does it fairly. i'd keep putting links here if i knew peeps wouldn't mind, but i think g.s. speaks pretty well about the subject, without my help.

 

augidog, I have never seen anyone object to links on hip forums. Waht I object to, but haven't written about yet are links without posting teh subject matter, usually it is something I just wasted 2 minutes going to. I have no opinion on male birth control pills.