Question for Transexuals

Discussion in 'Transexual and Transgender' started by straightguy, Jul 7, 2012.

  1. Invisible Soul

    Invisible Soul Burning Angel

    Springfling does add a very good point there. In some parts of the world, once someone has fully transitioned, in the eyes of the law, the gender transitioned to, is considered their actual gender in legal terms. And it is also possible in some parts of the world to have the gender markers on your birth certificate changed to the opposite sex of that which was assigned at birth.

    Why would anyone go through all the heartache, upheaval, embaressment, and turmoil involved in that process, unless it was to be recognised completely as the gender with which they identify? Like I said earlier in this thread, expecting people in this category to "admit" to being a gender that they don't identify as being (and possibly also a gender that they are not recognised in law as being) is expecting them to participate in their own oppression.
  2. Kinky Ramona

    Kinky Ramona Back by popular demand!

    Well, I'm sorry my answer offended you. The issue with how my opinion has been formed is that I have not known any transexuals in my real life. I'm sure I would understand your point of view much better if I did. I have been enjoying reading this thread because it has been very educational and mind-opening. I guess I just would find it strange to have any chunk of my partner's past in the dark or unknown. Maybe if there was love there, it wouldn't matter anyway. Thank you for your reply.
  3. springfling

    springfling Member

    I don't know that your answer was offensive. The thing is that if I had HIV or AIDS I would tell you about it. But being a transsexual doesn't compare to that. It's not a disease that can be transferred to another human being. My transition is about me and only me. Once I've begun transitioning I need to be prepared to lose everything and that includes my friends and my family. Life can be absolutely miserable during transition because there is so much uncertainty with relationships. It takes so much effort and planning and so much money to make passing consistent that if I told every person I came in contact with about my journey I would be defeating the whole purpose.

    As far as meeting a transsexual is concerned that's the easy part. Either go online to a site that caters to transgendered persons or find a support group within your neighbourhood and go to it. Laura's Playground is a good site for transgendered people but if you just google the topic you will find some of the answers you are looking for.

    But if there was love there I might be tempted to tell you about my past ..................................
  4. mugwande

    mugwande Member

    We normally take things differently but that is why people are different but according to my understanding, I would like someone to tell me everything including status and sexual history because history repeats its self. I thing telling everything before and give a chance to your partner to decide what to do can be a good idea...
  5. Invisible Soul

    Invisible Soul Burning Angel

    Precisely. Most people who transition do so not to be seen as a transsexual, but simply as a member of the gender/sex with which they identify. Some in that situation have no choice but to be seen and known as transsexual, but I'd say that most who do have a choice, simply want to disappear into society and participate in it fully as a member of the gender with which they identify. Telling people you're "transsexual" does defeat the whole purpose of transition, at least for a great many people in that situation. Most people do not see transsexuals as complete members of the genders that they identify as being, and this also includes those who do not discriminate against transsexuals. So, if you want to be accepted completely by society as the gender you identify as, then telling people you're transsexual would defeat the whole object.

    As for telling potential partners, I think it all depends on the individual. I think for late transitioners who have had relationships and sexual partners as their birth gender, and have lived "a life" as that gender, then it's something they probably should reveal at some point during a relationship, as that is a huge chunk of your life to keep a secret from your partner. For those who transitioned earlier in life, never really lived "a life" as the gender they were assigned at birth, and never had relationships/sexual partners in that gender, then you're not hiding anything from your partner really. Some trans-women have lived lives "as men", whereas others have not.
  6. springfling

    springfling Member

    sexual history? you mean how many lovers I've had and what their genders were? No? Then what is sexual history?

    Status? What, you want to know if I'm treaty? Not saying I ever would, but does everybody who sleeps with you fill out an application? Basically it's wysiwyg.

  7. Kinky Ramona

    Kinky Ramona Back by popular demand!

    See, I guess that's where my problem was, for some odd reason, it didn't occur to me that some transition young enough that there really is no past to be known or kept "secret". I don't know why it didn't occur to me, I definitely know better than that. I guess issues could occur when the subject of children might come up, or in the case that the surgery had caused any issues that may arise during sexual intercourse, ie- an inability to orgasm. I did read somewhere that surgery doesn't necessarily take that away, but it's possible. I might be completely uninformed, I just feel like there may be situations in which it makes life a little bit different than someone who was born as the gender they identify with. It definitely does not matter at all if there are no plans of serious relationships or feelings getting involved, because it doesn't matter really, but when feelings get involved, partners do care, and it might really worry them if something was different from what they know and understand.

    I see where everyone in the thread is coming from, and I guess the posters and readers need to understand that I am attracted to people, not gender, and while this is something unfamiliar to me, I'm just bringing up questions that I myself might have. I think it would be heartcrushing and terrible to have someone leave you because of your past or judge you because of it, regardless of what it is, but do you want to be with someone who would do that? I guess it's not as easy for transsexuals as it is for people who identify with their gender and find themselves of the heterosexual or even homosexual persuasion to pick and choose like that, but I guess I'd just want someone to love me for not only who I was, but embrace the shit I've gone through to get there. Please don't take anything I say as judgmental or rude, because I don't mean it to be, once again, I'm just trying to understand from another point of view.
  8. Invisible Soul

    Invisible Soul Burning Angel

    I'm not necessarily saying that trans-women who transition later in life (and so have lived lives "as men") have an automatic obligation to tell partners about their pasts, but I do feel they probably should, as it is a very large and significant aspect of your life to keep secret from someone.

    The reason why I think this situation is different depending on how early/late you transitioned, is because for genuine transsexuals, their gender identity is their gender, and I certainly don't see it as "lying" for them to present publicly completely as that gender. So it's not a case of me thinking that late transitioners should tell potential life-partners about their pasts because their gender presentation "isn't genuine". It's because it's such a huge, significant portion of your life to keep hidden from a partner. And like you say, late transitioners may have also had children in their assigned-at-birth gender, which again, is a massive secret to keep from a partner. Early transitioners do not have that baggage, and therefore there's not really any "secrets" being withheld from partners in that situation.

    I don't really think that being unable to orgasm is a sufficient reason for someone to tell a partner about their "trans-status". Many non-trans women can't orgasm, or have great difficulty in achieving it. And no, you're not completely misinformed. lol It is possible to completely lose sexual sensation as a result of reassignment surgery, but the risk of this happening is low if the surgery is performed by a good surgeon. The quality of the surgery carried out of course plays quite a big factor as far as sexual sensation post-surgery goes.

    It is true that transsexuals generally, find it much harder to date, and find love than non-trans people. And it is also true that being rejected as a romantic partner because you are now being viewed as a gender with which you don't identify is heartcrushing, and humiliating in a way that no non-trans person could possibly comprehend. Being rejected for any reason by a romantic interest, can be hard to take, but being rejected for that reason certainly adds to the pain and humiliation felt by the individual in that situation.

    The issue as a whole, is quite complex, and I don't think there's one right way that it can be handled. I think most people are guilty of assuming that all trans-people are the same, and their histories likewise. This is of course, far from the truth of it, and because of that, I think it's very much down to individuals, what is the best path to take as regards to the thorny issue of relationships.

  9. describe genuine

    and many young transitioners just had the ability to transition early after many late transitioners carved the path..
  10. Invisible Soul

    Invisible Soul Burning Angel

    Well, "transsexual" is a actually a medical term, for a medical condition. Unlike "transgender", transsexual is not an umbrella term. Some feel the latter is an outdated term, though that's getting into a whole different debate...

    What you're saying about late transitioners is perfectly true (although it is probably wise to assume that not all late transitioners share similar life histories). And I wasn't trying to deny that by saying what I said. Early transitioners are lucky that they do not have the baggage that late transitioners do, but that doesn't alter the fact nonetheless, that they do not have that baggage. And I was simply stating that it's a pretty big thing to keep all that baggage a secret from your partner. Again, I'm not bagging on late transitioners who do not disclose their pasts, as they have every right not to do so. I just feel there is at least a good reason for them to do so, as keeping such a large chunk of your past hidden from your partner isn't exactly ideal in a relationship.

    It is probably a good idea now to point out, that another very good reason for trans-women not to reveal "the truth" about themselves to partners, is the very real threat of violence from potential partners upon them making that "discovery". This is a very real problem facing heterosexual trans-women when dating men. If you tell the wrong man that information, you could easily wind up seriously injured in hospital, or in a body bag. Or at the very least, be publically "outed" when you have no desire to be "out".
  11. Ranger

    Ranger Hip Forums Supporter HipForums Supporter

    All this while true is also all the more reason for early disclosure. People prone to freaking out upon making such discoveries seem to freak in direct relation to how badly they feel they've been made fools of in the eyes of thier peers.

    For what it's worth my background incudes twenty + years crisis interven work in the Castro/Haight district of San Francisco including during the worst days of the aids panic that cost the lives of many friends.
  12. Invisible Soul

    Invisible Soul Burning Angel

    Yes, I think with those men who freak out upon discovering they were attracted to a trans-woman, it's far more to do with how that fact will make them look in front of others (gay, weird, or whatever), rather than actually being attracted to a trans-women in the first place. Many men see trans-women as being really men (although this is at least in some cases, more down to peer pressure than anything else), and so finding out they were unknowingly attracted to a trans-woman, makes them feel like they have been made to question their sexuality. Which is something that enrages them, and is the main driving force behind violence directed at trans-women by straight men.

    I do think that pre-ops who want to date, should disclose, although I can perfectly understand why they wouldn't wish to do so. But, if there's a high likelyhood of the man finding out anyway (such as initiation of a sexual encounter), then disclosure should occur before that happens. The situation is clearly different though for those who have had reassignment surgery however, especially early transitioners.

    I think for those who intend to have reassignment surgery, but do not want to be "out" as "transsexuals", they should wait until after surgery before trying to enter into the world of dating and relationships. I know life isn't always that simple or cut and dried, but ideally, I think that's what should happen. It's not really fair I know, but it would be very difficult to have your cake and eat it in that situation. If you're pre-op and you want to date, then I think disclosure is something that has to be accepted will have to happen at some point.
  13. springfling

    springfling Member

    Well put, IS. There's nothing wrong with just waiting a while. Probably the safest thing to do.
  14. Invisible Soul

    Invisible Soul Burning Angel

    I'm not saying it's an easy thing to do, but it's definitely the safest thing to do. It can be heartwrenching to pour cold water over the chance of love and romance when in normal circumstances (Having a physical body which matches your gender identity) you would pursue it just like anyone else, but like I said, it's very difficult to have your cake and eat it in that situation. If you're pre-op, and you don't want to "out" yourself, then steering clear of romance/relationships is just a necessary evil.
  15. well i am a 15 yr long post op who never was attracted to men gaggghh and so i never worried about threats or violence. Then of course i was only attracted to others like myself be they MTF or FTM however most were too sexual too soon so i just went my own way.. I have stayed single and celibate and never did find another trans which hasn't cut into me living my life. I get enough sex in my dreams and so i get to do so many other wonderful things in life without having sex on my mind every 3 seconds.
  16. Invisible Soul

    Invisible Soul Burning Angel

    It's not always about sex though, is it? I've never had sex, or been in a relationship with anyone ever. Which is something that hurts me, but it's mainly because of the lack of love in my life that it causes me sadness. That fact hurts me far more than the lack of sex. Celibacy suits some people but of course, it doesn't suit everyone. And it's worse when the celibacy has been more or less forced upon you.

    Also, many people find love when they are not looking for it, and normally in that situation, they grab hold of it. If someone is attracted to you, and you are attracted to them, in the normal course of events, you would pursue that. So it's very difficult to be in that situation and feeling forced to shut the possibility of love/romance down because your physical body isn't aligned with the gender you are inside.
  17. springfling

    springfling Member

    Well I really am not in a position of having to decide whether or not I should have to disclose my past to the world because I've been with the same gal for 26 years. And sex has never been a controlling part of our lives and that was largely due to the way that we felt inside. The majority of our friends are from the trans community, some are single and many of them are coupled. If I was single I wouldn't be looking for a sexual relationship because I am still an intersex person.

    Over the years many of my friends have disappeared into the woodwork because they preferred to live in stealth and just live the life that they have always known inside. Because of this their secrets may never be told, but if they are it would never be in the early part of a relationship. And any person that thinks otherwise has a lot of growing up to do. When you profess to love someone it has to be for who they are and not for who they were. We are not ashamed of who we are and we don't have to explain it to the world.
  18. Invisible Soul

    Invisible Soul Burning Angel

    That is definitely one of the reasons why I have been a loner all my life. It's the best way of ensuring that I don't develop feelings for anyone, and likewise, that nobody else could develop feelings for me (as unlikely as that is). One time though, I did let my guard down, and did develop feelings for someone, but the immense pain I felt as a result of that is something I don't want to experience again, so I'm being even more cautious now.

    I don't have any friends. I feel a disconnect both from trans, and from non-trans people, so I've never had any more desire to make friends with trans people than I have with non-trans people. I've always felt very alone as I don't feel I fit in anywhere. Because I've basically lived a "non-life" or "an existence" I don't really have any "secrets" to "keep from" a partner if by some miracle I ever did find one.

    I had no choice in how I was born, or how that was dealt with by others, so I can't be ashamed of that. However, I don't like it either. I don't hate who I am, but I hate what I am, and what I was made to be. Or at least, what I was made to look like in the eyes of others when I was a child.

    I completely agree with you that if a trans-person were going to disclose their secrets to a partner, they would generally at least, not be disclosed in the early part of a relationship. As a lot of trust would need to be built up beforehand, especially if the trans-person has no wish to be "outed" as "being really" a different gender to the one they are living completely as. Like I said, telling the wrong person could ruin your life, or even have it ended completely.
  19. springfling

    springfling Member

    Well I was born xxy. I had a female body and, in my opinion, a female brain but because I had a penis I was a male in the eyes of everyone else. I had a difficult time with life from puberty on. I tried without much success to fit in with the male population. It seemed that every time I opened my mouth it was to say the wrong thing. I just couldn't keep any friends. When I was in my fifties I was told I had to start taking testosterone and when I did, that reinforced my desire to dress and be the female that I'd always believed I was. That was when I officially began my transition.

    Until that time I had very few real friends. The friends that I did make I couldn't hang on to. That was until I met another xxy person and until I got involved in some trans support groups and made some lasting relationships. I have also been married twice and gained many friends through those marriages. I considered all of those friends to be my wives' friends but I found out years later that just wasn't so.

    I have found that throughout my life, I could not exist without any friends. I just couldn't bear to be alone with my feelings. For sure I would have done myself in a long time before I realized that xxy was the reason that I was so messed up and so insecure. I needed to have at least one friend that I could talk to about me.
  20. Ivory62

    Ivory62 Senior Member

    Wow. Anytime I think I've got it bad, I'm gonna re-read that post.

    Invisible Soul, I cannot feel what you feel, but I extend to you whatever virtual hugs I can.

    It's a shitty world, sometimes. I wish I could help more, as I'm sure lots of others do as well.

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