Poverty is an act of war

My attitude might seem to be one of apathy. I'm sorry if you interpret it that way. It's not hard to feed a family of 4 in the US. If you're not able, by all means, accept assistance. And I am a Socialist, but I'm a different kind of Socialist. I don't believe in total redistribution of wealth as a cure for poverty. There are people in this world who don't feel equality is equitable. And there are others who will give up their lives before they give up their wealth.

It's not a viable solution, or at least one I want to be a part of.

 

An honest discussion of poverty should also include a discussion of wealth, and its creation.

 

but wealth and poverty are brothers

 

I'll stick with what I see, as a Taoist...

Is there too much poverty in the world?

No, there is always just the right amount.


Make soup, not war.

 

I have a bit of a different spin on this subject because of who I've lived with for the past 17 years.

I think poverty can also be a 'learned' circumstance. My S.O. (aka: Mr. Wonderful) was raised in a family of 8 siblings and only one working parent - the father. Over the years I've heard many a story about their family life. It is the polar opposite of how I was raised (upper middle class with a maid every two weeks and a weekly gardner, starting around the age of 12).

He talks of his dad scrounging for furniture in the dumps, drafty two story homes (Mass. and Maine) in the dead of winter, siblings leaving half a sandwich they couldn't finish in case anyone else was hungry, lamp shades decorated with Christmas ornaments because they couldn't afford a tree, 4 kids to a room...and it goes on and on.

In the years I've been with him and around his family I've taken note that none of them seem to have grown past this poverty mindset to acomplish anything more than aquiring menial jobs in their lifetime. Granted, times are tough with the current situation - but I'm talking 17 years of watching this clan scrape around for just the basics of survival.

I don't think anyone ever told them (ie: parents) they could have more, be more, be better off than they were raised, get an education, try harder, etc. My family, sent all those messages to myself and my brother, even though we were well off. My parents always told us we could be more and do more than they did. And they did pretty damn good.

All I'm saying, is some people are raised in poverty and never outgrow it. Even thought they could. I'm a witness. I see 8 kids, raised by two poor parents that don't have the slightest inclination of how to make a difference in their outlook of 'what could be' for their lives. It's pretty sad.

 

Hannah, I was one of 9 children and I know that scenario all too well. But in my case it's not a matter of someone not telling me that I could aspire to more. In the words of Robbie Robertson, "we take what we need and we leave the rest".

 

Poverty is a tactic.

 

So much of our current anti-poverty dogma is less about the deprivation of the poor than it is about envy and class warfare against the well-off.

Who in the industrialized West does not enjoy a heated dwelling with running water , flush toilets and electricity.

Envy of someone who has done well is bad karma; I can say that on a Hippie Website.

If politicians of the developing world are pimping out their nation’s resources to the highest briber, shouldn’t those politicians face the same blame as the corporations?


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*Swoons over Robbie Robertson*

I hear ya. I think that is much how my S.O. looks at it. He just doesn't have the want for the things I was trained to want/strive for. It was really interesting when we first moved in together - melding these two worlds. In the long run we've both come to appreciate the others perspective on the issue, though we both stay pretty true to our roots.

 

Thanks for that post. A lot to think about in there.

 

As for poor countries that got rich, well the right answer is that all rich countries started poor. Maybe you mean contries that were poor starting in the 1900s? Or post WW II? In that case South Korea, Hong Kong, Singapore, several Gulf states, Taiwan. Japan and Germany went from complete ruin to prosperity, does that count? Do eastern european countries (the Czech Republic, Slovenia, Slovakia, the Baltic states) count? Did they start poor enough or finish rich enough to count? Does Israel count?

Countries like Thailand, Malaysia, and Chile have made some progress - so have Turkey, Argentina, and Venezuela - they aren't rich yet they look like they could get there.

 

I guy I went to high school is now a Billionaire.
His net worth is somewhere between the GDP of Zimbabwe and Belize.
He lives in a $20 million condo and drives around in an armoured car.
He made his money in steel in the former Soviet Block countries and other parts of Eastern Europe and Asia.
Last I heard he had over 50,000 employees.
Has his immense wealth increased poverty in the world or helped alleviate it?

 

Great choice! Expect to see ya down on the Ranch at some point to visit with us poor hippies.

Heads up: Watch out for the State Tax Feeders (greenshirts). Keep the name "Starcher" in mind...

Also you might need a tee shirt that says "I Am Not Jack Hardway". Live here a while, you'll understand... :cheers2:

 

That would largely depend upon the poverty level of the people who put that money in his pocket. Had he made his money in sugar cane by paying his Honduran workers $2 per week I would say he contributed to the issue. If he's selling steel to China and it's being made into guns and other crappy products in slave labor factories, he bought himself twice the usual bad karma. If he bought shitty steel in the FSU and sold it to GM, and those cars are now rusting out (as happened with Japanese cars in the 70s) I would say he is helping to alleviate it but contributing to the trashing of the earth. If he bought American steel and sold it to Asia and the FSU, he's a liar because it would be far too expensive.

It's a mixed bag of variables.

 

I'll be building on the mountain that looks down on the old RV park where the Dancing Pig Pottery studio is. Will be living in my RV at the park while we build. Looking forward to meeting you all.

 

Damn Zoom! That's only a good stout 2 1/2 mile hike thru the woods from here! You weren't kidding about neighbors... Welcome to the neighborhood. More the better.

 

It's difficult to tell your children they can have anything, be anything they want to be, if they dream hard enough they can achieve anything they want, when, as a parent you just can't provide for them, nor can you provide those kinds of opportunities for them. If a child whines that he wants a new teddy bear, he's going to realize quick at a young age in that type of household that having desires and wants are part of their misery.

This is the cycle of poverty.

 

When the big, shiny twinkie shows up this Spring, stop in.

 

We can also look at a rich country that became poorer: Argentina.