obama doesnt even know how many states there are..

An unnecessary amount does. And I agree that's ludicrous bullshit.

Another really large chunk goes to agricultural subsidies which is ludicrous. We subsidize so sugar can't compete with corn, and now corn syrups in everything.

Theres a lot of corruption in the government. And Obama's not going to change everything.

But I don't believe you when you say they have the exact same agenda. I could write a list of dozens of important protocol differences between the candidates, and they are things the president does have the power to get accomplished.

 

Do you know what socialism is?? It's control by the state. So in this case it's merely more control to the state which is controlled by the corporations Obama is in the pockets of.

Obama is an establishment yes-man, just like Bush, McCain and the rest of them. It's rather sad to see so many people falling for this.

 

of course i know the current state of socialism. i can see why you'd say this but i really don't believe it, at least not entirely... i would say he is, at the very least, a step in the right direction. he has spoken out against lobbyists and corporations... of course he is still manipulated by them - we all are - and that is something mccain has no intention of changing.

 

Hasnt anyone learned anything from Ralph Nader?

 

Obama may speak out against lobbyists and corporations, but you know it's only lip-service when he takes money from the very same lobbyists and corporations he claims not to.

This Counterpunch article does a good job in highlighting Obama's hypocrisy.

Obama's Money Cartel

http://www.counterpunch.org/martens05052008.html

 

Ron Paul isn't going to draw any supporters away from anyone who would vote democratic.

Not from anyone who had any remote understanding of the issues anyway.

 

Well, people can identify with Ron Paul being the only candidate to be outspoken against the war. However, unlike most people who want the government to manage their lives and give them all sorts of freebies, Paul was the exact opposite in standing for minimal, CONSTITUTIONAL government.

 

I want 'freebies' like education and healthcare for everyone in our society, yes.

I do not seek to return out government to the state it was in the1840's. Most liberals don't because they support educational loans and healthcare.

 

Yeah but the whole war thing..... is huuuugee.....

And then the drug thing... I mean people who vote democrat are typically more liberal then those who vote republican... and yes, i know all about true republicans and stuff but im talking about your typical person who votes republican and is conservative, a christian, that type of republican...the type who would vote for bush or huckabee.

I'm just saying.... Ron Paul will take away many more democratic votes then republican.... even though that makes little sense to those who actually know anything about politics....
That is not your average person so it doesn't have to make sense....

 

yes i've read articles like that one. it makes me wonder... and i don't doubt that there is truth in them. but he still has my vote over mccain because i like his policy better than the same ol' same ol' bullshit mccain is trying to disguise as something more liberal. i'd rather vote for the better man than sit back and see someone i hate win with the knowledge that my lack of vote was in fact a vote for something i don't at all believe in..

 

So you want more Federal funding of indoctrination (I mean, education)?? Do you know what has happened to education in this country since the Department of Education was established in 1980?? The more Federal funding of education, the worse education and the dumber the public becomes. That's why we have high school students that cannot even locate the US on a map. Under Clinton we had 'Goals 2000', and under Bush we have 'No Child Left Behind', both socialistic programs to federalize and thus completely control the education system in this country. I always chuckle when I hear libs talking about "more money for education."

 

i'm with lucky... we don't need another nader....

 

As far as I'm aware, he suspended his campaign. That means that he's not a write in canidate.

Stupidly enough, if you're not registered as a write in canidate, a ballot for you will be thrown away.

Anyway, I'm not fond of his politics at all. He's a paleoconservative. He is at least genuine in his libertarian beliefs however. Which is something I cannot say about the libertarian canidate this year.

 

so what instead? do away with standardized testing? vocational school for people under a certain income bracket? heh just kidding about the last one..

 

Do you have evidence to support that kids are getting dumber, or do you just use that as a statement to support your beliefs?

Heres an article that suggests that education improved greatly during the 80's.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa3673/is_199604/ai_n8750262

In fact partly through increased federal funding, the number of college bound students has greatly increased since 1980.

 

My mom has been a teacher's assistant for years at an elementary school and loved it.... under no child left behind..... she handed in her notice and quit her job this summer.... she also teaches music lessons and even though she just bought a house on her own and really thought she needed the benefits she got from working at a school she is just going to teach lessons now.... a lot more of them and buy her own insurance and stuff....

The reason being is that she said instead of learning to learn things ALL they ever do is learn how to take those tests so the schools don't lose federal funding.... like literally all they do. She said it's the most ridiculous thing she ever saw and honestly, if she finally quit because of it.....

The school she worked at may be a bit different then other schools but she said the reasoning behind it is last year they didn't pass the testing... so they would have to next year to keep the federal aid....and that it will be worse next year then last year was.....

One reason the school didn't pass was because they lump all of the students together- so the special education students are expected to pass the same testing.... which is just ridiculous.

 

I agree completly that no child left behind was a complete failure.

 

http://media.www.dailytrojan.com/me...ank.Compared.To.Other.Countries-1005055.shtml

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/artic...archive/1998/02/25/MN54903.DTL&type=printable

Also keep in mind the US keeps lowering the standards of what is acceptable. Look into what is called OUTCOME-BASED EDUCATION.

Sure this country churns out lots of people who can program computers and work mindlessly in cubicles, but do they have the knowledge to think critically for themselves??

George Carlin said it best when he said they want the public just smart enough to operate the machines, but just dumb enough to not realize how badly they're being fucked up the ass, which is exactly what we see today.

 

Without sounding partitioning Rat, the way you say 'critical thinking' in threads sounds synonymous with 'agrees with me'.

And I'm not going to argue with you that our education system is a success, because it's not at all. Schools are just babysitting in the US.

 

Obama doesn't know his states, Mccain can't tell the difference between a sunni and a shiite, Ron Paul hates women and Hilary is tangible evidence of evil.

All of the candidates suck, and it comes down to voting for the lesser of the evils.