NJ Civil Rights Offical: Ladies Night illegal Discrimination

Discussion in 'Women's Forum' started by dotadave, Jun 2, 2004.

  1. HappyHaHaGirl

    HappyHaHaGirl *HipForums Princess*

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    I never said I wanted equal rights! That's just bringing yourself down! I think men should be the ones bitching about equal rights so that they can climb the common sense ladder and be at our level. I love being a chick. I'm just as smart as any guy, and I can work just as hard to get what I want, but if I don't feel like it, all I have to do is shake my ass and it's done for me.... :D I don't do it very often, but it's nice to know that I can....













    Am I going to be attacked now??? :confused:
     
  2. Levi

    Levi Hip Forums Supporter HipForums Supporter

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    Are you for real? Men benefitted from ladies' night. Plus, if you honestly, deep down in your heart believe that this is a step toward equality.....Don't you still think there are more urgent civil rights issues the ACLU could be dealing with? Honestly?
     
  3. Megara

    Megara Banned

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    Frankly, i am amazed that they took the time to stop their anti christian blitzkrieg, their anti boy scout frenzy, and their forcing diversity by making kids say muslim prayers in history class stance to actually do something that that makes us "EQUAL."

    While i disagree with the necessity of the ruling, we all know what would happen if men were getting cheaper drinks..and it sure aint pretty.
     
  4. dotadave

    dotadave Member

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    :rolleyes: I'm really tired of hearing this gross mischaracterization. Religious Neutrality != anti-christian, even if christians think that anybody that doesn't endorse them over all others hates them.

    Check out this story:

     
  5. Megara

    Megara Banned

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    LOS ANGELES (AP) - The American Civil Liberties Union is demanding the removal of a tiny cross that is among historic symbols on Los Angeles County's official seal. The seal "prominently depicts a Latin cross, a sectarian religious symbol that represents the beliefs of one segment of the county's diverse population" and is an "impermissible endorsement of Christianity" by the county government, the ACLU Foundation of Southern California said in a letter to county officials this week. "Under clearly established law, the seal is unconstitutional," the letter said, warning that refusal to remove the cross in a "reasonable time-frame" would cause the ACLU to seek a court order
    Who cares about the big fat GODDESS POMONA on the seal...yeah thats not a "promotion of religion." Christ, Los angeles was founded as a catholic missionary town, it is historically accurate to include a TINY freaking cross on the seal. How this is a promotion of a religion is beyond fucking me. But yes, the ACLU wants it gone.

    the ACLU defends freedom of speech, in virtually every other aspect they want religion out of public life.

    http://lacounty.info/seal.htm

    there is a link to the most horrible cross that is modestly displayed and is among the smallest picture in the link, and is displayed next to the Goddess Pomona, why they dont want the goddess removed is beyond me.
     
  6. dotadave

    dotadave Member

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    Good for them. In both cases they are enforcing the "congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.." rule. Pomona is not a religious icon, she's a mythological figure of a dead religion. The cross is an endorcement of christianity since it was placed there to reflect the role of the church.
     
  7. cutelildeadbear

    cutelildeadbear Hip Forums Gym Rat

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    Happy, I didn't mean you personally wanted equal rights, I mean women in general. And I'm not going to attack anyone, that isn't my M.O., you are most certainly entitled to your opinion, but I do disagree with you.

    You don't see anything wrong with shakin' your ass to get what you want? I do. But there is nothing saying that you can't still do that. This isn't preventing women from using sexual power over men on a personal level, only on a public/business level, which is usually where rights issues have an effect on society.

    Maybe you should be barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen cookin your man some dinner so he can come home to you after screwing his secretary. Oh yeah and don't expect to go to college or have your own career either, because that is only for men. And you can't make any decisions about anything, not even what type of vaccuum to buy, its all up to the men. The only thing you would be good for is taking care of him and his kids. Hey if that is what you want for your life, good for you, best of luck, but I want more for myself than to belong to some man or to have my only function being a sex object.

    I think some people these days don't know how it really was when my grandma was young. It is sad. I don't see equal rights for all as going backwards. Just my opinion. To me equal means equal.

    And this isn't going to stop men from buying women drinks, and I highly doubt it will keep women from going to bars in New Jersey (or anywhere for that matter). If that is your thing, you will still do it, you just have to pay an equal price for it. I mean would it be fair to go to the grocery store and charge women less for food than men?

    Here in Delaware, they just waive the cover for everyone who comes before 11pm. Makes it equal for everyone, even the business owners get something out of it.

     
  8. cutelildeadbear

    cutelildeadbear Hip Forums Gym Rat

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    I never said men didn't benefit from ladies night. I said that it wasn't equal. You can't charge one person something and someone else something else. How is it that no one see the logic in this matter. And do I think there are better issues they can be concerned with? I think there are many issues they could be working toward changing in our society. I think this just happened to come up and they decided to take it on, probably because they thought that they had an easy case (which they did). But you/I can't determine what is more urgent, that is subjective. I also think that they deal with an array of issues, they don't just drop everything for one case in New Jersey.



     
  9. cutelildeadbear

    cutelildeadbear Hip Forums Gym Rat

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    I agree completely!


     
  10. Megara

    Megara Banned

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    where do you see any religion endorsed? Los Angeles was founded as a catholic missionary outpost, it is historically accurate to include it. It is a small modest cross tucked away in the seal. It was placed there for historical reasons, not to show that Los Angeles is a catholic city. Is the ACLU in the business of rewriting history? Oh wait, yes they are. They are trying to wipe out christianity from public life. Prayer in school is an endorsement of religion. A small cross tucked away in the seal is NOT. God, its insane what we've turned into.

    Why is it that we are allowed to have menorahs during hanukkah and the islamic star during ramadan, but not the nativity during christmas in schools? Currently, thats how it is in New York City Schools. The ACLU doesnt give two shits about that. They are all for forcing Judaism and Islam on us, but god forbid they actually follow the constitution and allow christian symbols be placed also.

    Heck, lets force LA to change its name, after all its name DOES mean the city of the angels....
     
  11. cutelildeadbear

    cutelildeadbear Hip Forums Gym Rat

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    Hi Megara,
    I don't see anyone forcing Judaism or Islam down anyone's throat. Maybe it is just the place that I live. Maybe Christianity has been forced upon us for so long, that they have moved on to a new religion. And I agree, if something honestly does have historic value as this cross that you talk about, then I see no reason why it should be removed, but there is a difference between that and prayer in school, or saying "one nation under god". I don't think the ACLU is trying to wipe Christianity out of public life, I think they are just trying to make it more of a personal decision rather than something the government endorses. I mean you have people in high power making decisions, not based on what is best for everyone in this country but based on thier own personal religious beliefs. That is just not right.

     
  12. Megara

    Megara Banned

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    I agree there is a huge difference between THAT cross and the prayer in school. I dont think we should start classes with a prayer, let kids pray to themselves if they want. The government isnt establishing any religion with that cross, and for anyone to say so is a complete farce.

    There is no excuse that a menorah or an islamic star can be placed in new york city public schools, but a christian nativity scene can not. The ACLU does not care though.

    And ironically, it is high powered people making decisions based on their own personal religious beliefs and imposing that on all of us. They are called judges.

    Oh, the constitution says freedom of religion, not freedom from religion. Most people dont seem to understand that. As long as no religion is banned or barred from public display, then all should be allowed. I.e. a christmas tree in schools, as long as a menorah, islamic star and others are allowed too. A christmas tree on public property too, etc etc.
     
  13. Levi

    Levi Hip Forums Supporter HipForums Supporter

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    So...um, there go the senior citizen discounts. And cheaper bus fares and amusement park admissions for children.

    Now...that's justice!
     
  14. cutelildeadbear

    cutelildeadbear Hip Forums Gym Rat

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    Hi Levi,
    I'm glad that you brought that up, because I agree, these things are unfair as well. It is age discrimination. I am not certain what can be done about it though. For senior citizens I understand it, because most of them are on a low fixed income. I imagine that can be corrected by changing social security, but that isn't going to happen any time soon, and I'm not running for office, so I haven't any ideas on that. The children thing, well, children usually eat less and use less features. For example, how many rides could a child use compared to an adult at Six Flags? So I can understand where it comes from, but it is not exactly fair.

    At one particular grocery store here in my town, they have a sign that says parking for mothers with children. I am not sure I understand the point of it. I park there anyway if I am in the mood to, and I haven't got any children. To me that is not fair, and I highly doubt they are going to do anything about it.



     
  15. Levi

    Levi Hip Forums Supporter HipForums Supporter

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    Are you kidding, cutelildeadbear? I was kidding! I think senior citizens should get discounts at Denny's, etc., (They've earned it!) and kids should have reduced fares and I think ladies' night is far from an important issue. Unless you are joking please don't mistakenly think that I agree with you.

    You know why there's parking for mothers? I am guessing that it's because mothers of really young kids have to carry them, and try to carry groceries and keep the kids from getting hit by cars as they cross the parking lot.

    You know why kids' admission fees might be less? Because they can't go to the parks alone, they need a paying adult, and because charging less money for them actually draws in business.

    Please, please don't mistakenly believe that I think older people getting discounts at restaurants and the movies is age discrimination. That's bullshit.


    Civil rights are not about taking away discounts for the elderly, in my opinion. With what they have to pay for prescriptions, what the hell? These discounts also generate business for the businesses that offer them.

    Next are you going to say that it's not right to have signs on the bus asking that people reserve the seats near the front for the elderly and disabled? Get a grip.


     
  16. cutelildeadbear

    cutelildeadbear Hip Forums Gym Rat

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    I think that you need to get a grip, and calm down a bit. Deep breath in, now exhale. I said that senior citizens should be allowed to have discounts because they are on a fixed income set by the government which is entirely too low in my opinion to take care of them. That would indicate to me reading someone's post, that they think that senior citizens should have a discount. Ok next point, I do believe that I stated that children usually pay less for things such as amusement park rides because they do not use all of the rides, and in eating establishments, they eat less, therefore they are actually only paying for what they are using. That would also indicate to one reading my post, that I completely understand why there is a child's fare. Are ya with me so far?

    Next I go on to explain that there are parking spots here at the local grocery for mothers with children that are closer to the door. That concept I do not grasp, and I could go on to explain that it is so embedded in our thinking that women have to get married and have children which you will never understand that some of us don't want children and don't like children and don't see why we would be punished because of it(not that I actually see this as a punishment or even an injustice, I was simply pointing out how ridiculous things have become). Regardless, I park as far away as possible when I'm able to because I don't want my car scratched and I enjoy exercise very much, and try to get in as much as possible in my busy schedule. Maybe they should have special parking for those of us who work a full time job, take full time classes, and volunteer, all the while being homeless. A mother can carry her kid to the damn store just like my mother carried my sister and I when we were young. It is called Americans are fucking lazy is all, and they think they are entitled to everything they want under the sun. It has absolutely nothing to do with sex or age or anything else. If you all want to stand around and fight over parking spots, dinner at dennys or getting nasty ass watered down drinks for $1 off at a dive bar in New Jersey of all places, you go right ahead, but I've got so many better things to do with my time.


     
  17. sadeyedlady

    sadeyedlady Member

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    I agree with just about everything cutelildeadbear said.

    Although it's discrimination, it benefits men, too because when women get in free, more will come, and you won't have bars filled with an uneven male-female ratio.

    This is not a feminist issue. Don't make it one, it only makes people think feminism is a silly, frivolous cause.

    Oh, and I agree that women don't usually buy their own drinks, anyway. Which is not to say that they can't or shouldn't, but if you're going out to a bar and you're female, you're going to get offers for drinks, and men usually don't. So there's no basis to justify additional discounts for women.
     
  18. jiimaan

    jiimaan Banned

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    You're assuming that allowing women in for free evens the ratio, when all it does in fact is maintain a similar ratio, but increase overall attendance, which of course translates into higher revenues for the establishment's owner(s). It's the latter who benefit, not men.

     
  19. sadeyedlady

    sadeyedlady Member

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    And you know this how? How do you know that there aren't usually more men in bars on average and discounts for women bring more in and balance the ratio? You didn't look up any statistics (Please don't) so you're really just talking out of your ass and stating this as fact.
     
  20. jiimaan

    jiimaan Banned

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    You're not reading very carefully: I'm not disputing the fact that there are more men at bars where there's no "ladies" night, what I'm saying is that I find your assumption that by having a "ladies" night, the ratio is somehow evened up. I think "ladies" nights simply increase increase patronage, thus benefiting the establishment's owner(s)--not the men.

     

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