Nietzsche Forum.

Discussion in 'Existentialism' started by Bilby, May 9, 2004.

  1. Brocktoon

    Brocktoon Banned

    Well Said Stan.

    I actually do give a 'measure' of credibility to the popular sentiments of Nietzche being a 'Devils Advocate'.

    A small measure.

    To me its clear Niezche realised he could not be taken seriously by outright attacking his 'opponents'.
    He would throw in enough 'Devils Advocate' to give himself that 'out' whenever needed.

    Neitzsche has another thing working to his current popularity advantage - he is relatively easy to read and follow.
    This makes him far more 'accessible' to the average college kid who wants to find a philosopher to hang his or her hat on.

    Further to that.. its 'romantic' to believe one is a 'Rebel' and 'Going against the Status Quo.'
    Nietzche certainly would have been BACK THEN.

    Now its pretty much standard 'Think Speak' to be opposed to 'Religion'.

    I still say he is over-rated.
     
  2. Brocktoon

    Brocktoon Banned

    I cant get enough Stan Grossman these days!

    OH SHIT.... That was fast - Stans name now says 'BANNED'

    Can anyone explain why Stan Grossman is banned?
     
  3. BlackGuardXIII

    BlackGuardXIII fera festiva

    No, but if I could, I wouldnt cuzz


    You wouldn't understand
     
  4. MattInVegas

    MattInVegas John Denver Mega-Fan

    You guys might be thinking of the "Quote of The Day" thread in Old Hippies.
    There's lots of Neitche there.
     
  5. Floris

    Floris Member

    Nietzsche went insane from syfilis (just found that out, don't know why I didn't think of it myself...)

    Nietzsche didn't start a new way of thinking... he was also inpired by others... Ockham for example, a monk in the middle-ages had theories that resemble Nietzsche's very much... Now if this post isn't a paradox I don't know what is...
     
  6. thumontico

    thumontico Member

    All philosophers build on concepts of others.
     
  7. amiera

    amiera Member

    I've to read:Die fröhliche Wissenschaft. The English title of this book is a bit odd. Does somebody know more Nietzsche forum on the web? They are especially imporant if they criticize Nietzsche.
     
  8. Zaruthustra

    Zaruthustra Member

    If anyone asks me to direct them to a good overview of the many misconceptions had of Nietzsche (especially by people who've never read him), I'll know to direct them here.

    True, Nietzsche had suffered quite a bit. But he didn't exactly bring it upon himself. And regardless of what he his personal experience and life was, his philosophy often reflected something quite different. He thought love was man's greatest danger? Now here is just an example of outright manipulation of his words. What you are thinking of, I'm afraid, is pity, which is quite a bit different than love. And here his arguement against pity is anything but pessimistic or hateful. It is this: that we base our relationships on shared joy, and not shared suffering. He all too often upheld the ideal of the comic, of the child, and of laughter. In the last few aphorisms of the Gay Science, he begins making fun of himself for being "too tragic" and to lighten up.

    It is just plain ignorant to compare him with Hitler and call him the Nazi's semi official philosopher. First of all, Nietzsche lived and died well before the advent of Nazism. Second of all, he made a point of showing his disgust with anti semite Wagnerians and the proto fascist tendencies of Bismarck's Germany, something quite unusual for a German in that time.

    Yes Nietzsche attacked faith, Christianity, morality, as well as reason. He posed the question mark of the value of such things which so many readily assume to be absolute certainties. Sure, today there is nothing remarkable about attacking the archaic institution of the church, but Nietzsche hardly stopped there. He questioned both the conservative traditions of the day as well as the beliefs and intentions of the liberal reformers.

    I'm not saying he was flawless. He had many faults, the most despicable being mysoginy. But so many of your attacks on him are the same unfounded and unoriginal ones being made for the latter half of the 20th century.
     
  9. Bilby

    Bilby Freerangertarian Staff Member Lifetime Supporter Super Moderator

    I have not read Niezsche but as I understand it he was not against people having any relegious faith per se but against people drowning their problems in a feel good church service or getting drunk.He believed in engaging and comming to terms to with your problems instead.The paradoxical thing is the latter is something preached in many modern churches.
    As for Nazism , he was no Nazi but as a person he and his ideas were appropriated by the Nazis. Great Britain had produced Issac Newton and France had produced Voltaire so Germany needed its own original thinker.
     
  10. Brocktoon

    Brocktoon Banned

    Zarathrusta:

    Do not refer to 'The Thread' as if this was a group of people 'You' are commenting on.
    There are a whole variety of comments and critisisms here (and some silly) but there is no 'You' commenting to 'Us' here bud.

    If you have a counter-point by all means address it to the individual posters.
    Thnx

    *That goes for all of you poster including your Zaruthrusta

    ;)
     
  11. Brocktoon

    Brocktoon Banned

    In case it went unnoticed.. i was being 'fun' by refering to 'all you posters'. :p
     
  12. Zaruthustra

    Zaruthustra Member

    Actually Bilby, Germany had produced quite a few original thinkers, who Nietszche was not very fond of. His writing style was meant to reflect a "Southern" spirit and to distance himself from traditional Germany philosophy (Kant, Hegel, Schopenhauer). I believe he spent quite a good time in Provence, France, like Van Gho. He was quite disgusted with Bismarck's Germany and the rise in nationalism and anti semitism. There's actually an aphorism in Gay Science where Nietzsche talks about how his contributions to philosophy should never be attributed to the German spirit.:)
     
  13. quotient

    quotient Member

    Nietszche's problem was the same as all others who follow the path of naturalism to existentialism to nihilism. Morals. The logic doesn't hold. His personal letters show that it is at least possible that he did not believe or live as if he believed his own philosophy. Besides the truth of it can't be proven any more than theism or deism.
     
  14. skeatesy

    skeatesy Member

    i am nietzsche's supermanthe second coming of christ revelations 12 wo to man for sin against woman all males are to be castrated to protect the earth .c p skeates the new jerusalum canberra australia
     
  15. Mountain Valley Wolf

    Mountain Valley Wolf Senior Member

    Nietzsche looked at the world in terms of the interplay of Dionysian and Apollonian forces. The Dionysian forces are those wild uncontrollable forces of nature, left unchecked they can lead to the excesses of gluttony, drunkeness, unfettered sex, chaotic violence---but nonetheless it is the natural dynamic of growth, expansion, creativity, vitality... The Apollonian forces are those, often man-made, forces of rationality and reason, of management, control, manipulation, and policing, but they are of a dynamic of repression, oppression, controlling, slowing, and it tends to limit the spark of creativity and vitality.

    In dealing with Nietzsche's anger, or what I often felt of as a strong sense of Germanic arrogance, or some of the other criticisms of him found on this forum, it often helped me to keep in mind that he embraced the Dionysian forces.

    Therefore, in regards to Naziism, a clear case of dominant Apollonian forces at play, they may have name-dropped Nietzsche to further their cause, but they were nothing in the way of being Nietzschean, other than a bad case of the Will to Power moving in the wrong direction. The hippies on the other hand, were very Nietzschean in that they also embraced a Dionysian force----they were undoubtedly the closest yet to any concept of Nietzsche's Superman.
     
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