Modesty in conflict with nudity and nude sunbathing

It is interesting that, in my experience, there seems to be a double standard regarding women within the nudist community. Even though everyone is completely naked, women still feel the need to present themselves similar to when they are clothed. Meaning that they still are expected to continue their habits they learned while growing up in the textile world, and pinning their knees together for fear of exposing themselves in a skirt while men, similar to the textile world have no care in the world how closed or spread their legs are.

 

I’m guessing there are two reasons…1) force of habit from years of modesty.
2) I think some nudist have more of the exhibitionist tendency than others. Those very low on that exhibitionist scale will have those knees superglued together. I’m not saying all nudists are exhibitionists. It’s a trait shared by some and acted upon in varying degrees.

 

Agreed

 

I wasn’t really speaking to the exhibitionist side though. I think the exhibitionist side is more someone that wants attention and in some cases prefers to be the only one naked for that reason. I am speaking to freedom and owning and or taking control of their own bodies and not bowing to societies pressures to be submissive and “lady like”. The point is that they should feel empowered by nudism. I know that sometimes any extra attention is or can be uncomfortable. I have the same issue with my piercing and many times remove it just for that reason. That that I feel I need to, but simply because many people can’t refrain from asking about it, and “how bad did it hurt” etc. But many times I leave it in and just brush off their comments.

 

Many years ago my first wife and I had a conversation about modesty with an "old school" nudist. She believed that posture for women was important; and that an "exposed" posture was "unladylike." My "easily impressed" newbie wife adopted the same philosophy; until one day when she actually almost fell over while trying to get up from her lounge chair - with her legs firmly closed. After thinking about it, she ultimately decided to reject the notion of "ladylike" postures; as it was not only impractical, but also contrary to the idea of body-acceptance/freedom.

But it's an ingrained notion that can be very hard for some women to discard. And I do sympathize with those who clearly struggle with it. Some eventually do discard it; while others don't or can't. We have a friend who, much like my first wife, has completely rejected these notions of modesty. She sits and lays in ways where her vulva is often completely "exposed"; even while socializing. Some may consider her "exhibitionistic"; but I know that she isn't trying to get attention. She is simply uninhibited and carefree. My (current) wife and her a great friends; but my wife's "learned modesty" will sometimes "kick in" and she will respond negatively (to me) to our friend' vulva being in "plain sight" while interacting with her. I then remind her that it's "technically" no different from seeing male genitalia; which is always "exposed." Not only that; but my wife is not exactly prudish either. There have been plenty of times where her vulva was clearly "seen" while lounging, socializing and doing activities at the resort. And she's ok with it. Yet her "learned modesty" will still get triggered when she becomes overly conscious of it.

In short...it's complicated.

 

It is complicated for those women still bound by modesty and those that still do not see themselves as equals.

 

Yeah. "Clinging to modesty" by sitting in the back of the pool area, legs/ankles crossed, being constantly guarded and self-conscious, is an option, I guess. Even my wife, who did the same on her first trip to a nudist resort, felt afterwards that she had missed an opportunity; and requested we go back and have a "re-do." After all, the nudist resort is THE place to explore being "unbound" by societal "norms." "Clinging to modesty" in that setting is to me a bit like going to a gourmet restaurant and ordering an orange juice with a slice of toast. You've passed on a learning opportunity and a fun experience.

On that note.
I also do feel others (and I'm not just talking about men) have a responsibility there. I've talked about our friend who is really comfortable. Well, no matter how comfortable she is, I make it a point to always keep eye contact - no matter what. She could be doing an open-legged handstand right in front of me: I'm keeping eye contact. I joke; but you get my point. Because you can't tell how comfortable they actually are, double/triple takes while walking by might confirm to them that they have good reason to remain modest. We're all curious people; but it shouldn't be detrimental to others.
My wife might not be the "least modest" in our group of friends; but having had interactions in various (exposed) states, without any particular attention being brought to it, has helped her accept and become more comfortable with it. Which has allowed her to explore and embrace activities like paddle-boarding; without much concern about how "exposed" she is during that activity. Also; she didn't get that "free" overnight - she had to work at it - but she felt it was a worthwhile pursuit to venture outside her comfort zone. And it paid off.

I also think that people that espouse this "ladylike" notion of modesty should keep it to themselves. This is 2023, not 1950. I've talked about the "old school" lady. The ironic "twist" is that she ended up being fully "exposed" in front of me; albeit accidentally, while sitting on the top ledge of the hot-tub and leaning back. So she couldn't even practically stick to her own "value system" of modesty.

Anyway; those are my thoughts about it.

 

Personally, I feel sorry for the gals who blue their knees together. By contrast, the gals who don’t have the “perfect” body but could care less what is seen ….earn my admiration.

If you hide stuff..it’s had to say that you’ve fully embraced what you look like or that you are fully enjoying freedom from societal norms and expectations. An opportunity squandered!

 

Modesty may be one part of it. But, I've often read on forums like this that many women don't have a great relationship with their vagina.

These women hate how their vagina looks and probably don't want others to see their flaws.

In short, they weren't raised right. Their parents failed to explain to them the beauty of their vaginas. So, they carry this burden with them into adulthood.

 

Yes...there's also that.
The first time my wife went to a nudist resort, she saw a woman tanning "wide open", with her vaginal opening visible. And her reaction was along the lines of "Ugh...gross..." She was relating this to her own vulva (she has labia hypertrophy) as "unsightly"; at least compared to women with "tiny labia", where a "slit" is all you see. It would take her seeing other women "built different down there" and not being shy about it; and people "catching" her with her vulva exposed - and not reacting to it - before she started becoming less self-conscious of it and not caring as much about people noticing her labia hypertrophy.

It can take a lot for women to stop caring whether their vulva is "unsightly" or not for them to be comfortable with others noticing it.

 

Is your wife still self conscious of her labia, or does she realize that are are all built differently (and that's OK)?

 

She's still somewhat modest some of the time; but it has nothing to do with her labia hypertrophy. As a matter of fact she started shaving last year, which actually accentuates her labia; and she's well aware of it. And it's got a lot to do with being around other nudist women for a while now; and seeing that they really do come in all shapes and sizes.

 

I am not trying to start anything, but likely referring to her normal labia as “labia hypertrophy” does not help. It sounds like a defect. I get that medical terms can sound that way, but the reality is that, “average” does not equate to “normal”. She just has larger than average labia. No different than having larger than average breasts or a larger than average penis except they don’t have a term for those conditions that sounds like a defect, or least that I know of. There are many people that find that very attractive, myself included. Then again I find almost every variation of the female for beautiful.;-)

 

It's inspiring to hear stories of people that have grown to accept and love their bodies.
It sounds like your wife is going down the right path.

 

I've been thinking of responding to this. Finally have the time, having thought it through a few sleepless early mornings...
Anyway as a man my first reaction is predictably that my most intimate parts are also the most visible, literally "front and center". So I could somewhat crassly think what's the fuss... But I don't think that. I in fact am very sympathetic with degrees of exposure for women. And of course we know that men have their own special "situation" in that regard, but we won't go there today...some very cogent observations were recently made on another thread.

My wife of now over four years had a hysterectomy at age 41. (Disclaimer: I am NOT a doctor. This is NOT medical advice. But absolutely true and accurate information for you to evaluate. And discuss with doctors as you see fit.) Then hormone replacement therapy- the other HRT, not the FBI's Hostage Rescue Team! Anyway, then the hyperplasia. Then surgery to "correct" the hyperplasia. Then - oops- never an orgasm after that. A nerve got knicked most likely...Did HRT cause the hyperplasia? Then breast cancer and a successful lumpectomy. Then NO MORE HRT, as estrogen likely the cause of the cancer. HRT was the big pharma mare's urine kind. (I learned about Bioidentical HRT with first wife.) Then osteoporosis from no more estrogen. Fun, huh...
Bioidentical HRT is worth learning about if you don't know about it.

So to everyone, Nudony in particular: Your wife is beautiful. All of her. Age happens. Medical stuff happens. God made our bodies to be beautiful. To be appreciated by ourselves and others. The entrance to our digestive system serves multiple functions, is truly a wonder, and is often beautiful. The exit... The Creator engineered that rather appropriately too, agreed?! Smart Guy! Good for Mrs. Nudony to accept her beautiful body, all of it. And think carefully about skipping a mammogram.

Until next time.

 

Nude sunbathing. My, at first reluctant, wife came to the realization that she doesn’t ever want to wear a bathing suit again, or deal with tan lines. She loves the unexpected outcome and results she never even thought about. A WOW moment for her.

When you want that all-over and even tan, well, it doesn’t happen by keeping your legs closed while sunbathing. She’s in public, she’s nude, and she’s shaved. If you’ve seen her, you’ve seen her areolas, her nipples, her labia, and daresay I, her asshole. You’ve seen all of her fem parts without her having spread her legs.

SO, knowing that everybody has already seen every inch of her, and the ONLY way to get that “all-over” tan is to spread her legs so the sun can do its job, she has no problem doing so.

She has no issue with it, neither do I. If some guy thinks it’s a great view and enjoys looking, so much the better.

 

sounds hot

 

Unironically, I think this is probably the healthiest approach to "exposure anxiety." The nudist women that I know who have taken the approach of "not worrying about it", are clearly more relaxed and easy-going than the ones concerned about "how much" other people can see, while they're sunbathing or socializing.

But, the best we can do as nudist husbands is to provide assurance that it's completely safe and ok for them to tan in whatever posture they want. It still comes up in conversation between my wife and I from time to time; and I'm always quick to tell her that not only she looks good from any angle, but her seamless tan is well worth the "exposure." Of course she already knowns it; but she appreciates the reminder.

 

My partner doesn’t think about it. I’m in recovery so don’t drink of toke, she does occasionally and if invited to imbibe with people she generally sits on the uphill side with her legs crossed and then will lie down with legs open but not spread eagle

 

I think it’s a combination of things, one that has been already stated years of learned modest behavior. The second might be biological, the mind trying to naturally protect the body’s reproductive organs. I think the second would be more common on females who started practicing nudity later in life.