libertarians posing as fredom fighters, progressives,leftists...

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Red Fox VII, Sep 25, 2013.

  1. Red Fox VII

    Red Fox VII Member

    ...or anything other than the corporate puppets they unknowingly are. :daisy:

    FREEDOM

    What is freedom but an obligation to doing what is healthy and right for the world, fighting the good fight, and keeping the evil goons of tyranny in check.

    Anything else is slavery to the Corrupt Evil Ones's, or a form of outright laziness.

    You libertarians say it'd be a free world if we had an unregulated market, but I say look how those bastards push the envelope as it stands already! The greedy shits do their best to shit all over the rest of us as is.

    What kind of freedom is slavery to corporate overlords in an unregulated free market? Who's to keep the beast in check if not for an equally big beast (government)?

    I say, fight tooth and nail for the little guy, with everything you've got, and the big un's will find a way to SOMEHOW get on by. :rolleyes:

    I say no more crying and whining about the infringed rights of those who have everything they need and more, and always will, who will continue to devour and exploit everyone and anything in sight unless reigned in somehow.

    If you're strong at all, your duty is to protect the weaker ones. What else are you even strong for?
     
  2. AiryFox

    AiryFox Member

    Too many people are too comfortable in their lives of servitude to do anything to better a corrupt country. Modern society is not like it was in the past, when people created revolutions to ensure a better life for all.
     
  3. Sig

    Sig Senior Member

    huh, I've never met a libertarian who claimed to be anything near left or progressive. Sounds like you're trying to simply box them into a definition that fits your own world view, regardless of whether or not that definition has any basis in reality.
     
  4. Pressed_Rat

    Pressed_Rat Do you even lift, bruh?

    The problem with leftists is that they're dumb enough to believe the criminals running the government could ever do something positive with the money they steal. The idea that the government will ever stand up for the little guy is something only dummies believe. Government is bigger than ever before, and there are more poor people than ever before. Go figure.

    Free market this and that is not even an issue -- it's a distraction. There will never be a truly free market when the market is rigged by the handful of people with the power to print money out of thin air, charging YOU interest for something that doesn't even technically exist.
     
  5. Pressed_Rat

    Pressed_Rat Do you even lift, bruh?

    Yeah, I don't get the title of this thread at all, since the poster seems to be spouting the same tired leftist rhetoric I am used to hearing by a few people on this particular forum.
     
  6. StpLSD25

    StpLSD25 Senior Member

    That's exactly it! Plus, Their views in reality would/is causing causing greater wealth disparity and problems.

    They also don't care (at all) to cut corrupt aspects of government. Or expensive programs that are wasteful and not beneficial. They also cannot defend their beliefs, when contested about spending/waste.

    "Spend more to make more?" Obviously that's just Biden's rhetoric. Anyone who knows anything about basic economics would know; A country 18 trillion in debt, can't spend it's way to anything, except a complete and utter collapse.


    This is why Liberals should think about what they really support. They say I see the world in black and white, yet mostly assume I'm conservative, AND assume all conservatives act a certain way too. Both are untrue. You've fallen into Obama's jargon against Republicans- which I believe he has said purposely, so Liberals wouldn't pay attention to us "Rightist."

    Yet, you don't understand, we're very similar socially, but Libertarians understand economics better. This is why you think the free market is gonna eat your babies. It wont, without government to wage wars.. It is GOVERNMENT that does the crimes and abuses their power. Corperations only sell you products.
     
  7. eggsprog

    eggsprog anti gang marriage HipForums Supporter

    Out of curiosity, STP, what definition are you using when you refer to 'liberals'?
     
  8. StpLSD25

    StpLSD25 Senior Member

    Exactly what Liberals are. Many want to abolish drug laws, which I'm all for. But they want to increase taxes and government spending, and that's not good for anyone right now.


    I know what Liberalism is, I just don't think they truly understand economic issues. On the Other hand, I agree with (some) liberals on war and stuff. There's Obama-supporting Liberals, than there are real Liberals who believe in Civil Liberties and freedom. I don't so much mind the second group, but to say I support these evil corporations is a bogus idea many Liberals believe with absolutely no facts or viable arguments to back this.

    Obama, gets billions from these evil corporations, yet Libertarians get none. (other than the Liberty PAC which was started by a kid with inheritance, NOT corporations.)Then, this kid calls me brainwashed?

    I don't have a problem with Liberals who really believe in civil liberties, but most of you don't, now that Obama took office. Then, plus, Liberals typically have anger toward people keeping their own money, and it's crazy! Taxes are too high for the average joe raising taxes and spending money on useless programs is not really helping us. We're being taxed and regulated into oblivion.

    Yet, Liberals support these programs like the EPA, FDA and, USDA; Even though they're all corrupt gun-toting assholes who charge regular families 10 k per day for having the wrong tree in their yard.


    My problem with the majority of Liberals is they wont even listen, when they realize they're wrong. That's practically the definition of ignorance.
     
  9. eggsprog

    eggsprog anti gang marriage HipForums Supporter

    I didn't ask anything about Obama, or Libertarians, or mention anything about some kid calling you brainwashed. I was just wondering what definition of liberal you are using. I'm still not really clear.
     
  10. Red Fox VII

    Red Fox VII Member

    I'm referring to "leftists" like spt that just want to do drugs.
     
  11. eggsprog

    eggsprog anti gang marriage HipForums Supporter

    I don't think I would ever refer to him as a leftist.
     
  12. Sig

    Sig Senior Member

    Yeah, same here.
     
  13. StpLSD25

    StpLSD25 Senior Member

    You're just (deleted) (like you always are to me.)

    I said (very clearly) Liberals support extensive spending on programs we don't need, because they believe it's for the greater good. Furthermore, I didn't say you mentioned Obama, I merely said there are two kinds of Liberals. Liberal who support Obama, and Liberals who believe in Civil Liberties. You cannot support Obama and believe in civil liberties otherwise you're stupid, or you're not paying attention to his policies.

    I'm as far from mainstream Republicans, as I am from mainstream Liberals. Because Liberals have been supporting the war on terror, supporting Obama's unconstitutional laws and, I really see Liberals as the brainwashed ones, cause you actually believe spending and stealing more will magically correct the flaws in government.


    The problems are brought about by government in bed with corporations. Obama is just as bad as Bush. The Bush Doctrine has continued, and our debt spikes up every year. It's due to both Liberal and Republican spending. We are living above our means, with bully-programs such as the EPA; which doesn't truly protect the envoirment, but again it's a tool for larger corporations to get rid of competition. That's NOT how true capitalism works!
    And Red Fox, you don't want to be agreeing with a Libertarian like me..
     
  14. MeAgain

    MeAgain Dazed and Confused Staff Member Super Moderator

    Are you talking about constitutionally allowed taxes? If not, what?
    What about student loans, Social Security, Veteran Benefits, public schools, CHIP, Medicare, SBP, etc.?
    How are these directly related? Are you saying that if we do an across the board reduction in Federal and State governmental programs the number of those below the poverty level will automatically fall?

    Are you suggesting that we go back onto a gold standard? How would that work exactly? What interest am I being charged if I don't borrow any money? I don't understand.
     
  15. MeAgain

    MeAgain Dazed and Confused Staff Member Super Moderator

    Pretty broad statement. Are you saying that all Liberals are corrupt and all Liberals support all wasteful, non beneficial programs?
    Is your opinion in all cases?

    What does that phrase mean? Spend how much more, in what areas, for what reasons? And in what areas should spending should remain the same or decrease? Be specific please.

    All corporations are good, all governments are bad? This leads me to believe you are against any form of government including the Constitutionally allowed forms.
    Am I wrong, and if so in what ways? Are there any bad examples of corporate actions or any good examples of governmental actions?
     
  16. StpLSD25

    StpLSD25 Senior Member

    The only tax allowed by the Constitution, was one for the Revolutionary war. However, the congress does have the right to tax, but part of the reason we left Brittan, was over-taxation. I pay 100$ for every 500$ to taxes. That is money I EARNED for hours I've work. That means 1/5th of my work ethic was entirely for government.

    Everything under government costs too much, and accomplishes very little. Take student loans as one example; The government got involved, the prices sky-rocket. Then, the get out of college, there's no work, but they owe the government 100 k, whereas otherwise colleges would compete by LOWERING prices, under government they've become an expensive monopoly.
    every dollar you've ever held, is debt. The government gives the federal reserve an "IOU" everytime a dollar is taken. Jp Morgan and Goldman Sachs run our country VIA the fed. So, yes, a gold standard. We could still have paper dollars, but they would actually have real value. We just came off in the 60's-70's. A silver dollar today is worth 40$, so prices would drop significantly.

    (I know you weren't talking to me, but you were asking interesting questions.)
     
  17. Red Fox VII

    Red Fox VII Member

    I just see libertarianism as being at it's best hopelessly idealistic, and at worst, playing into the hands of the elite, giving too much corruptive power to companies (which have the rights of human beings).

    At least the government is keeping itself in check by being divided against itself.

    A corporation is not like that, it can just do as it pleases.
     
  18. Red Fox VII

    Red Fox VII Member

    The government is corrupt to a degree, as its comprised of somewhat wealthy humans, but not as corrupt as a corporation with the rights of an individual that is just terrifyingly powerful (and therefore corrupt) as a unit.

    The corporation represents too much power concentrated within one entity.
     
  19. MeAgain

    MeAgain Dazed and Confused Staff Member Super Moderator

    This is what confuses me, didn't you just say in your last post that corporations only sell you products? I assumed you meant that they therefore can do no wrong as all they do is offer products.

    From which corporations and how much for what reason?

    Not me I like my money! As far as taxes, I hadn't heard about raising any taxes on the average Joe. All I hear Democrats talking about is raising taxes on the rich in order to lower it on the middle class.

    So corporations will self regulate in regards to pollution, impure food and drugs, unsafe cars, factories, and machinery, and they won't "cut corners" to save a buck on something like an offshore oil rig? And what is this 10k a day thing you keep repeating?

    I'll listen, address the concerns I've listed.
     
  20. Sig

    Sig Senior Member

    Corrupt to a degree? And you think libertarians are hopelessly idealistic....
     

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