Legitimite Gurus

Discussion in 'Gurus' started by jnanic, Nov 27, 2006.

  1. xexon

    xexon Destroyer Of Worlds

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    True gurus are not people you can judge. You can't even know them as gurus if they don't want you to know.

    A true guru can be anyone. They exist beyond stereotypes. It can be a beggar on the corner or the school janitor. You will not know them for who they are unless you are ready for what they offer.

    You cannot seek a guru. They will find you when you're ready.

    Most who seek are not.

    They will get the fakes. And even the fakes ones will be guru for a while, because they will teach you the power of discrimination.

    Work on yourselves. The teacher will appear when you're ready.



    x
     
  2. repro-bait

    repro-bait a real reprobate.

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    the very idea of a GURU is both appalling and at the same time hilarious.
    for any intelligent person to be so enthralled is beyond my comprehension.and that includes the guy called jesus.
     
  3. xexon

    xexon Destroyer Of Worlds

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    You're a creature of the mind then?

    I don't wish to offend you when I say that. Everyone has a spiritual side to them whether they know it or not.

    You're in love with your computer. The one between your ears. But it's abilities are limited to this world only. You're no better off than a tadpole in a tea cup. Your world is small.

    A true guru will set you free of the mind and it's limitations. You won't know you've been a slave to it until someone knocks off your chains.

    Most people, you see, don't know they were born into slavery.



    x
     
  4. Bl4ck3n3D

    Bl4ck3n3D Member

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    Because it is beyond your level of comprehension is why it is hillarious to you. However, that does not mean guru's do not exist, as we exist whether you want us to or not.
     
  5. crankyelbow

    crankyelbow Makes Music

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    People are who you accept them to be.

    Everyone should seek to be a guru themselves - if you are lead blindly you cannot truly know where you are.
     
  6. ChiefCowpie

    ChiefCowpie hugs and bugs

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    exactly, i want to be a guru and enlighten others
     
  7. BlackBillBlake

    BlackBillBlake resigned HipForums Supporter

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    I want to be a spaceman.
     
  8. ChiefCowpie

    ChiefCowpie hugs and bugs

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    outer spaceman or inner spaceman?

    or is there not a difference

    or is there a difference?
     
  9. BlackBillBlake

    BlackBillBlake resigned HipForums Supporter

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    I meant let's go find a guru-free planet. I'm not sure there's much long term future here.

    When I was about 5 I used to think that by the time I grew up, I could hope to be a spaceman. I even used to own a plastic ray gun, not dismilar in design to the one in your avatar pic. Maybe when I do grow up, I'll give up the idea. Perhaps I'll become a priest instead - at least then I'd have a secure income.


    As to inner and outer space - seems to me it's probably all one continuum.
    To move in different directions - in or out - needs different means.
    Maybe the further out we go, the further in we go.

    Sounds like hippy talk that last bit....
     
  10. rak

    rak Senior Member

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    Jesus would not fall under your category. He didn’t do his followers. His speech was clear.
     
  11. enlightenment-karma

    enlightenment-karma Member

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    I completely agree with you - Its easy to spot the false guru, most of their purpose is to make money, they sell tapes and books and have many courses that they charge for. All the great teachers taught the truth as their duty, they did not ask for anything - although in some cases they were supported with the minimal necessities from their followers so they could teach.
    But there have been true gurus in the past, the proof of their righteousness was in their words and actions, such as Jesus, Socrates, and Buddha - they dedicated themselves to teaching the truth, they had zero interest in profiteering, they did it as their duty. I have came across many gurus and I could easily discount them in a moment. That was before I met Tathagata.
    I have known him for 18 years and during that time I have seen his tremendous effort and struggle to teach truth to people. He travels the world teaching, he asks for nothing in return and he teaches that you are your own messiah, you have to look after yourself, by the law of karma /cause and effect. He teaches do good - don't do bad, yes it sounds very simplistic, but the truth is simple.

    A bean comes from a bean and you come from yourself and are making yourself throughout many lives. If you do good then you will make yourself better - if you do bad then you will make yourself worse - and you need wisdom to know if your actions are good or bad - you need to observe the world, watch yourself.

    Tathagata says he has attained the perfect enlightenment
    http://www.tathagata.co.uk

    After his enlightenment a small lump appeared on his forehead and he calls this the eye of wisdom, or also the third eye, and says its the physical proof of enlightenment. You can read his teachings online and ask him any questions you want, his website does not sell anything at all, just gives free teachings.
     
  12. Chodpa

    Chodpa Senior Member

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    That's a fucking joke right? Hahahahahhahahhahahahah
     
  13. ChiefCowpie

    ChiefCowpie hugs and bugs

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    i don't think it makes any difference in one qualified to be a guru if one was born legitimate or out of wedlock

    i might even prefer the one born illegitimate cuz they would know their real legitimacy is in their cosmic birthright and not their history
     
  14. crankyelbow

    crankyelbow Makes Music

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    "Even though the teaching of the Enlightened Being is very easily taught, people who don't open their eyes to the truth of the world always have difficulties in accepting the teaching and practicing it."

    The man knows what he's talking about.
     
  15. mara-aum

    mara-aum Member

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    i believe every person's guru is within & synchronicity will lead each of us to different people throughout our lives that act as mini-gurus...you know "when the student is ready, the teacher appears" -these mini-gurus come and go as needed throughout one's life--it could be as simple as a stranger saying something that altars your perception about a thing for life--for a moment that person was a guru.

    but really the guru is within us all.
     
  16. gdkumar

    gdkumar Member

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    Hare Krishna!

    From Mara-aum

    i believe every person's guru is within & synchronicity will lead each of us to different people throughout our lives that act as mini-gurus...you know "when the student is ready, the teacher appears" -these mini-gurus come and go as needed throughout one's life--it could be as simple as a stranger saying something that altars your perception about a thing for life--for a moment that person was a guru.

    but really the guru is within us all.

    xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

    Very well and truly said, thank you. God is omnipresent, He is outside and inside us as well. So, it is always better to go for the nearest best Guru - God , who is within us. But it is the most difficult thing to do as we, as aspirants, cannot see, hear or feel Him. That is why we look outward for a Guru (As His representative) of flesh and blood.

    Love,
    Kumar.


     
  17. radareyes

    radareyes Member

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    If we're talking about identifying legitimate gurus in the strictest and most concrete sense of the term (i.e. individuals who are fully enlightened and only wish to uplift the consciousness of others in whatever way they're capable of doing), then we have a difficult task ahead of us indeed. IMO, the majority of gurus out there are fraudulent and/or charlatanistic in one way or another. These include:

    Osho
    Swami Muktananda
    Adi Da Samraj
    Chogyam Trungpa
    Prem Rawat (Maharaji)
    Andrew Cohen (as well as his cohort the "Pandit" Ken Wilber)
    Frederick Lenz
    Maharishi Mahesh Yogi

    Then there are the "spiritual teacher" types who I don't think would claim to be enlightened but by definition teach diluted versions of fundamental spiritual principles (and that's not to say that these people can't be beneficial to some individuals at certain intermediate stages of their spiritual paths -- they just don't represent the pinnacle of consciousness):

    Dr. Wayne Dyer
    Deepak Chopra
    Ram Dass
    James Redfield
    Neale Donald Walsh
    Anthony Robbins
    Michael Murphy
    Dan Millman
    The Dalai Lama
    Thich Nhat Hanh (unsure as to whether he claims full enlightenment)
    Cheri Huber
    Alan Watts
    Pema Chodron
    Lama Surya Das
    Mary Baker Eddy (Christian Science founder; No doubt in possession of great insight and probably supernatural abilitiies. Too dogmatic and bound by orthodoxy to be fully enlightened)
    Krishnamurti (Very progressive for his time, but too fixated on cerebral realms and didn't exhibit many "transcendent" qualities aside from being generally mild-mannered and good natured)
    Don Beck (Spiral Dynamics perpetuator and arguably co-founder. Egomaniac.)


    My own personal jury is out on these guys:
    Paramahansa Yogananda (went through many hierarchal transformations of consciousness in his autobiography and I was always unsure if he was professing to be fully enlightened. Also has some pretty rigid, borderline fundamentalist teachings interspersed with his many profound and pioneering ones.)
    Gurdjieff ("shocking" people into enlightenment possibly a little extreme?)
    Sai Baba (many scandalous accusations against him, orthodox approach in terms of teachings, possibly overly reliant on divine "parlor tricks" (assuming of course that they are legitimate manifestions, which is a definite assumption))
    Sri Aurobindo (Too much fixation on philosophy and specific manifestations of higher consciousness at the expense of the fundamentals?)
    Babaji (True 5000 yr. old avatar or myth?)
    Ammachi (maybe a saint but not enlightened?)
    Carlos Castaneda/"Don Juan" (too "out there"?)

    I personally believe that the following are completely and legitimately enlightened as well as trustworthy (but of course the ego is always capable of distorting truth if the ego-bound individual permits it):

    Eckhart Tolle
    Gangaji
    Ramana Maharshi
    Shunryu Suzuki
    Eli Jaxon Bear
    Roshi Philip Kapleau
    Byron Katie
    Neem Karoli Baba
    Morihei Ueshiba

    I have no doubt that there are more legitimate ones, but I wouldn't want to get overly speculative about gurus who I haven't scrutinized intensely (as I have for the above). I've also omitted many historical teacher/gurus/avatars who were very likely enlightened (e.g. Milarepa, Rumi, St. Francis of Assisi, Daruma, Krishna, etc.)

    Travis
     
  18. xexon

    xexon Destroyer Of Worlds

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    If you're going to judge gurus, where are you going to start?

    If you did not know them personally, all you have are the words of others. The "others' are not likely any more qualified to make this judgement than yourself.

    Be careful of preconceived notions. A true guru is an individual thing.



    x
     
  19. radareyes

    radareyes Member

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    Ridiculous. I have their books, webcasts, videos, and satsangs. And most importantly, I have my discerning and perceptual faculties.

    I was basing my assessments on the parameters that I established during the opening sentence of my post (hoping that it may discourage redundant posts like yours -- no offense). As others posts have already established, a "guru" (which in sanskrit simply means "dispeller of darkness") could be an experience, an idea, or even a charlatan. The omnipresent nature of enlightened consciousness cannot be bound by external conditions.

    It is very likely that your unwillingness to devote yourself to truth in and of itself prevents you from taking the risk of utilizing your discernment. Just a thought...


    Travis
     
  20. damiennotloc

    damiennotloc Member

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    There is only one true Guru I give any credibility, and that is David Bowie. That man is more remarkable, groundbreaking, revolutionary than any I have seen the like of. Sorry if I have taken the topic of this forum out of context, but if there was anyone I believed in enough to dedicate my life to following, and believed that he saw with a clarity so greater than my own that my judgment would be rendered obsolete in comparison, than it would be him.
     

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