Is There Middle Ground, Between The Two Extremes?

Discussion in 'Vegetarian' started by Jimbee68, Nov 4, 2016.

  1. Jimbee68

    Jimbee68 Member

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    Actually, something I have been wondering for some time now. But are vegans and vegetarians missing one vital point: They should work for middle ground, at this point in history. PETA, for example, wants the abolition of all meat.

    Why not just work to have animals slaughtered more humanely?

    It may not be what they want. But they will get more support, with that less-radical stance.

    And then, as time goes by, technology may come to the rescue, as it often does. Meat production already isn't very economically viable. Most of the money you invest, ends up in the waste. Some day (and this is something other trekkies like me can attest to), we will have meat made artificially by matter replicators. And before that, maybe it will be grown in a Petri dish. Even now, 3D printers might have some value in that area. See what I mean?

    Anyways, sadly, though I do agree with vegans in principle, I just think they need to temporarily moderate their views--if only to get more support.

    But I would love to know where I am wrong about this. As I said, my views, for one, ON EVERYTHING are always evolving anyways.

    :scholar: :toilet: [​IMG]
     
  2. drumminmama

    drumminmama Super Moderator Lifetime Supporter

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    No such thing as humane slaughter.
    Perhaps humane lifespans, but a bolt to the skull will never be humane, nor will electrocution.

    And frankly, veg*ns don't need omnivores saying we need to find a middle ground. It originates in either religious ethics, personal ethics, or liberation philosophy (in the hardliners), and to take on philosophy and say "you need to be more moderate" is not a useful tactic.
    I'm a veteran of many, many years on this board (my original join date was in the 1990s, prior to the 2004 crash that reset the board), several herbivore and animal welfare and animal rights groups, and a fair amount of other political involvement. I was a reporter for many years. Plus, I've a minor in social movements of the early 20th c, and outsiders saying calm down doesn't get anything accomplished, except shine a big bright light of privilege on the person saying calm down, be moderate.

    It's our plate, not yours.
    Do you know the terms mansplaining or whitesplaining?
    What you are doing is carnisplaining.

    It isn't for those who cannot control the impulse to eat flesh to tell those who do, or must, abstain HOW to abstain.
     
  3. Irminsul

    Irminsul Valkyrie

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    I think the bolt to the head is pretty human. They don't know what hit them and isn't that the way to go?

    The last dog we put down of old age, he was my gorgeous German Shepherd we took all the way to Australia with us and after old age hit him, I think he was about 13 which is good life for a GSD we took him for the green needle. The green needle is quite a common expression especially around breeders of all sorts. I kneeled beside the boy and I remember the vet asks my daddy if he'll bite. Daddy said oh he might take one last bite and the vet wanted to muzzle him. I said no! I have him. And he layed down exhausted, leg shaved. Daddy told me not to lose it because then he would. So I'm looking around the vet at anything to get my mind off it reading ingredients etc. I couldn't not be upset. I teared. I didn't let it come out much and the needle went in.

    Now the relief in my dogs eyes at that time was unbelievable. I spoke yesterday in another thread about how your dog few times MIGHT show you it's soul. Well he showed me his soul and it was relief. In that moment, the dog was smiling. Happy. His eyes closed and he was gone.

    People mightn't like the injection but in this case it was the only way and the dog thanked us for it, no doubt. If you saw his eyes you'd see it too.

    We walked out. I was shocked. I had to leave him there on the floor (tearing up remembering now) and as we walked away the vet wanted to give my daddy a bill. We just walked out and ignored it. I don't think he meant to not pay but we were done emotionally too.

    That probably doesn't have anything to do with the OP or anything but it popped in my mind so now it's on the forum. :)
     
  4. OldDude2

    OldDude2 Newbie

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    Vegans are a cult. You can't stop extremism in cults, that's how they work.
    Might as well try to tell Christians not to go on about Jesus quite so much.
     
  5. Irminsul

    Irminsul Valkyrie

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    And also when you think about it, life in the wild etc. is a bolt to the head really less humane than being eaten alive by predators etc? Because seriously like to hell with that. I watched a documentary once where a pride of lions ate an elephant while it was alive for 7 hours. I'd wager my whole everyone on that elephant would have rather been killed instantly by a shot to the head or something.

    Imagine that though. Being eaten alive for 7 hours.

    Sending livestock to their deaths by automatic rolling mince shredding machines is still more humane than what a lot of them go through out in the wild.
     
  6. drumminmama

    drumminmama Super Moderator Lifetime Supporter

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    Do you realize where you are posting?
     
  7. OldDude2

    OldDude2 Newbie

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    Vegetarians are legit but Vegans is a cult.
    There is a difference.
     
  8. drumminmama

    drumminmama Super Moderator Lifetime Supporter

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    I must be having a divided by a common language moment, here.
    How are vegans a cult? Do you have a working definition of cult to base your comment on?
    Who is the charismatic leader of all vegans?
    Isa Chandra Moskowitz?
     
  9. OldDude2

    OldDude2 Newbie

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    Have you ever met a Vegan who hasn't proclaimed their Vegan status within 10 seconds of them meeting you?
    I don't think I have.

    As for the cult leaders, plenty around, I know DurianRider who runs a a Cycling Vegan cult chapter, and he's a fairly charismatic leader..
    He has a sizable following of worshipers. I'm not sure they need grand leader, that wouldn't work Vegans tend to fight each other.
     
  10. drumminmama

    drumminmama Super Moderator Lifetime Supporter

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    Yep. I worked with a woman for a year and vegan only came up when I asked prior to a holiday shindig I was organizing that involved food.

    You obviously don't understand the criteria for a cult.

    Behavior may be cultish, but that doesn't make the group a true cult.

    This thread has been hijacked long enough.
     

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