Is it time to talk about guns?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Balbus, Mar 24, 2021.

  1. Toecutter

    Toecutter Senior Member

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    My Mother.
     
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  2. Rocket73

    Rocket73 Senior Member

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    Being British, owning guns is very difficult, you have to be vetted by police and you have to prove you need a gun such as a farmer ect, they must be locked in a steel cabinet with ammunition kept in a separate place, this is for shot guns , you would never usually able to own a hand gun, and defiantly not anything like a AK47, there is a 5 year jail sentence for even carrying a knife in public unless it's connected to your work or in a tool box, out police force do not carry guns , we have an police armed response unit to deal with armed robbery ect and is heavily regulated,
     
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  3. MeAgain

    MeAgain Dazed & Confused Lifetime Supporter Super Moderator

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    So that's two out of, how many thousands?
     
  4. Toecutter

    Toecutter Senior Member

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    What is your point, if you don’t know anyone, it doesn’t happen?
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2021
  5. MeAgain

    MeAgain Dazed & Confused Lifetime Supporter Super Moderator

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    Let me explain....
    In my case I've known and do know literally (that means for real) thousands of people of all age groups, races, and religions, rich and poor, who have lived in hundreds, probably thousands of homes.
    I've known people who live all across my state and in several other states all across the nation, in the country and the city, in private homes, duplexes, apartments, and dormitories.
    I was born in 1951 so I've known thousands of people for over seventy years. That's over 25,250 days. If we limit a home intrusion to an hour, just to make the math easier, that gives us over 613,200 possible hours for a break in to occur in seventy years. Multiply 613,200 by just a hundred households, although I've known far more households in my time than that, for example there were about 700 students in my graduating class in high school; that gives us 61,320,000 opportunities for a home break in over seventy years. Just for me.
    If I did the math correctly.

    In that seventy years I know of one use of a gun to stop a home invasion.
    So, I'm no mathematician but I figure the odds are about 61,320,000 to 1 in my case.
    That doesn't mean it can't happen to me tomorrow, or today for that matter, but I think the odds are pretty low.
     
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  6. Toecutter

    Toecutter Senior Member

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    Out of those 25,250 days have you met a murder, rapist, child molester ?
     
  7. MeAgain

    MeAgain Dazed & Confused Lifetime Supporter Super Moderator

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    Sure, I knew a dude who stabbed someone to death with a spark plug tester.

    [​IMG]
    He went to the pen.
    Knew a dud who was an enforcer for a bike club, rumor is he killed someone over some motorcycle club thingy.
    Had a student that that participated in a murder for hire. Walked into this guy's cabin and shot him with a shotgun as he was sleeping on a couch. He never had a chance to use a weapon in defense.
    Had a student who stabbed another kid in the back in the middle of a wrestling mat during a meet. The kid did survive.

    None of their victims ever had a chance to use a gun in defense.

    Never knew a rapist or child molester that I know of.
     
  8. Toecutter

    Toecutter Senior Member

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    Good, then you know that evil exists and may strike at anytime with no warning,
     
  9. granite45

    granite45 Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    Thinking that more and more guns will stop violence is like thinking that spending more and more will get one out of debt.
     
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  10. MeAgain

    MeAgain Dazed & Confused Lifetime Supporter Super Moderator

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    No, I don't agree that evil exists as a entity.
    I would say that some people do stupid things and hurt others in the process at various times.
    And they can strike with no warning, that's one of my points. If someone attacks you with no warning, especially with the intent of killing you, it is very hard to defend yourself. For example, if you own a gun to protect your home and I invade it, unknown to you, with no warning, and I come upon you, with no warning, and I aim a gun at your head with, no warning, it would be pretty hard to stop me with your gun as I got "the drop" on you. Especially if you have children in the house and have your gun secured in some manner to protect them from accidental discharge.

    The only example I know of where a gun was used for home defense involved a love triangle, as I stated. The home invader got drunk and called up the other dude and said something to the effect that he was coming for him for messing with his girlfriend. He then drove the the guy's house and proceeded to beat on his front door with a baseball bat. The guy called the state police and told them what was going on but as this was in the country they told him it would take them at least an hour to get there. They told him to, "Do what he had to do." So he waited until his door was beat in and the guy entered and he shot him dead.
    He could have run out the back door and he later stated it was the worse thing he had ever done and involved years of legal bills and court hearings before he was proclaimed guilt free.

    Now to be clear I'm not agaisnt having a gun for home defense, this guy used a pistol. I lived down the road from him a few years after this happened right beside the house the break in guy came from. In the house lived another guy, one of the break in friends, who made a few remarks to my wife, had just gotten out of prison and their house had bullet holes in the walls from him "having fun." So I kept a 410 handy as my wife could handle that pretty well. He later hung himself so that ended that.

    My point is the odds of needing a gun for home defense is very rare, extremely rare in fact, and there is no justification for not having it registered, no need for AR15s, etc.


    In addition, many "existing evils" can strike at any time with a far greater chance, such as tornadoes (I know of two people who were literally in the middle of two different ones and that was in an area where tornadoes are virtually unknown. I knew someone who fell off a six foot ladder and died. Two guys who fell off roofs. Several people killed in vehicle accidents. One in a comma for six months due to a motorcycle wreck. Someone who drowned in six feet of water and another who broke his neck at the beach and died when a wave slammed him into the sand.

    Now if you want to be prepared for all those existing evils I would suggest in addition to your gun you wear a helmet and life jacket at all times, never climb an object over five feet tall, drive an Abrams tank, and never leave your tornado shelter, all at the same time. Not to mention tying yourself into bed when you go to sleep.
     
  11. Toecutter

    Toecutter Senior Member

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    I have a fire extinguisher in my home, never used it, I know how to use it, I hope I never need it.

    Walking into a home and getting the drop on someone is a possibility,
    What are you going to do if you find him before he finds you, he has a gun what do you have to defend your family ?
     
  12. Eric!

    Eric! Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    Japan is very similar to this, they don’t play. You get pulled over by the koban (police), if you have a baseball bat in car, there better be a baseball glove and baseball uniform, and you better be on the way to or coming from a baseball game- or else you’re going straight to jail.
     
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  13. Toecutter

    Toecutter Senior Member

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    Imagine that happening here in America….. News at 11:00
     
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  14. MeAgain

    MeAgain Dazed & Confused Lifetime Supporter Super Moderator

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    I'll do whatever I can. Meanwhile I'm not losing any sleep over it, nor am I running out and buying a Bushmaster. I'm looking at the odds of it happening and not worrying about it.

    I've looked down the wrong end of a gun before. Survived that time, maybe I will again if it ever happens, maybe not. That's life.
     
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  15. Toecutter

    Toecutter Senior Member

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    Agreed Sir
     
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  16. scratcho

    scratcho Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    I think like everything else in life that can be quantified, anything can always be reduced to percentages and should for be for edification, depending on the importance of the circumstances. There are some people that are going to die in car wrecks. Likewise with fires, falls, murders, plane crashes, vaccinations, falling trees,guns, fist fights, poisonings, etc,etc and on and on ---percentages work for any and all facets of life. For example: I quit flying back when I left Hawaii for the last time in 1976. It just isn't worth it for me to go through the stress and the results of my vivid imaginings of the end when it comes via a plane plunging to earth with people screaming , piling up in the front of the plane------YIKES! See what I mean. Now the odds on that happening are miniscule compared to driving on a public highway. I've rolled two cars, been in a drag race wreck where the the two in the the front seat of the other car were killed. In the car in which was riding in the front seat, my friend the driver was horribly injured and lived an awful life afterward and then me. I lost some teeth, got a whiplash that bothered me for years and years. I also worked as a roofer and roofing contractor from the age of 27 until the age of 70.

    So--to conclude: Willing to buck the odds of crashing in a plane however much the odds would be in my favor. Nope. Foolish? Perhaps.
    Willing to buck the odds of dying on the highway after beginning to drive at 8 years old until this very day at 82? Yup. Foolish ? Perhaps
    Willing to vaccinate? Yup, even though a small percentage will die from a vaccination. I grew up before polio shots / cures were discovered. Saw results of polio firsthand. Foolish? Hell no.
    Willing to roof even though I fell off 4 or 5 times over the years and hurt myself in two of the incidents and had to work on jobs that not many would do? Yup. Enjoyed the physically difficult, hard work, the satisfaction of helping people with serious situations and the money I made. Foolish? Depends on who you ask.:)

    So: My usual long winded / typed point is that I now keep a gun at the ready in case a member of that very, very small percentage of assholes that want other peoples stuff and don't mind killing said others or at least frightening and humiliating said others to get their stuff. And woe to the asshole that thinks that he has a right to my stuff and to impose upon me and my family by fright , humiliation and worse. --- his attempt will gain him a serious case of lead poisoning.

    ( No Children here in the house and if I lived in a peaceful, country--I would not own any guns.)
     
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  17. Toecutter

    Toecutter Senior Member

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    Agreed Sir
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2021
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  18. Eric!

    Eric! Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    If I was still single, I would have the same view. However, now that I have a family- I’ll do anything I can to keep them safe. Security system, cameras, weapons, etc. I have it all, and I have peace of mind. As the saying goes, “Better to have and not need, than to need and not have”
     
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  19. erofant

    erofant Members

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    I should have clarified in my posts #939 and #940 that we have no kids below 21 anymore. We're TOTALLY READY for any home invasion.

    I saw a cool sign some years ago ( not a big billboard ) in a home's yard. It said -

    "This homeowner is very well armed and a proficient shooter. There's nothing in this house worth risking your life for."

    I don't know if anyone - day or night - would take the time to read his sign, but if they saw it, I have to think it would give them pause to reconsider their plan.
     
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  20. Tyrsonswood

    Tyrsonswood Senior Moment Lifetime Supporter

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    Actually that sign just tells criminals there are weapons in that guy's house... It might peak their interest.
     
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