If God Is A Contradiction Then He Does Not Exist

The postal workers had too much time on their hands; and started to hit on the temporary christmas help in the lunch room. Better if he informed her in a letter that he didn't like her in advance.

 

He? They? Was this proverbial worker his own man or not? Perhaps he was only capable of posting letters.

 

According to the time line he wants to do at heart what was the fate of human nature. No contradiction in my mind; only in hers. There must be God for the contradiction. Fate could be as good as chance over and over again. No; that was a meteorology story.:sombrero:

 

How god for it? Did the christmas help attempt to exact something from you in return for what you supposed your heart chanced to be fated upon? Soul destroying, if you like. I see no moral dilemma down the line, either way.

 

I don't think so. All your rants against religion come from a sense of idealism. I dare to say everyone who has morals that involves protecting the rights of others is at least to an extent idealistic.

 

^ I think Airy was referring to epistemelogical idealism not ethical idealism.

 

You haven't made any logical deductions.

We have inherent trust in providence. The child looks to mom and dad for everything.

No, not where faith originates nor even religion. Religion is a cultural outgrowth and fertility, goddess, and pagan religions or cults predate the religions you mention.

You really need to get your own information straight if you are going to use it as argument for truth.

No, faith is ignorance is statement of a somewhat mindless prejudice.

See above.

 

"God is love" is what you want to believe, that's your faith, that's what makes you feel good.

I don't see your view, is the the contradiction. I don't see the love, or at least not nearly as much love as to justify a supreme loving creator. Love is quite local and segmented and literally submerged in a world of hatred and massive horrific suffering of countless flavors.

Happiness is great, paint the world how you want to see it...

Unfortunately these paintings of unreality come at a cost to others and our children and the future of humanity. They cause even more suffering that needs more painting over...

 

I didn't say you couldn't see a look on my face, I said I could not. I cannot distend my eyeballs and turn them around to look at my face. What you suggest is an abstraction not physically possible.

God-pusher? I am here looking for agreement in terms, that we all might understand what is our common experience and move on from the debate about reality. Faith is common ground not a display of ignorance. Those who say it is complain that it is not the right faith to have and theirs is better.

Your notion that every expression points to something physical is misplaced.
We can imagine things that are not so.

 

This is the secular faith versus religious faith argument restated and it is simply a distortion of meaning through qualification or better disqualification, of the words faith or idealism.

 

An authority we invoke.

 

we can imagine logical things that do not exist . logical in this
way : the thing could be willed into existence by a single and
capable person who is also the dreamer or its coherence may
be recognized , held , and translated through philosophy .
coherence is essence , and this may be created as this object
or that or presented as diffuse action - the philosophy in action -
music perhaps . my music my words can be quite reasonably id-
entical to a logical thing imagined , to many logical things whose
existence is not forbidden by god or self .

want unlimited free energy ? hahhaha it'd kill you fat bastard . it's
not forbidden but withheld . walk the blessing path .

 

Same God, maybe, but wrong description. God should sue for defamation! I agree with you about the OT depiction of Yahweh.

That's the human predicament. How do we know that my qualia are the same as your qualia when we refer to the impulses we call, say, "blue". We don't, for sure. We take a chance, at least I do. I've found communities of others who seem to share the same concepts and experiences--after I formulated my own. That's good enough for me, and probably the best we can do. BTW, by the early 1960s, most philosophers reached the conclusion that verificationism is untenable--since Quine attacked it and Hempel jumped ship.

Verify that.

What is the cost to others? The suffering you speak of comes from denying that God is Love. If people believed it, much of the suffering would disappear, and we could work effectively with others to reduce the rest. "The kingdom of heaven is spread out upon the earth, and people do not see it." (Thomas, 113) That is the real reality.

 

that he is not loved is a personal delusion . who?

 

If you Minus the necesity for all deities and necesity for all 'sacred' texts and necesity for religion that is often implicated with faith you may be in the same ballpark Lol. But idealist and the faithful can have opposing views, it is not necesarily a restatement.

 

False.

Suffering exists because religious people cannot leave non-believers well enough alone. Theists have this erroneous notion that everyone must believe as they do for the betterment of society.

Perfectly happy, morally upstanding, and law-abiding atheists cause no suffering whatsoever. Except in the deluded mind of the theist whose worldview is so skewed from reality that he plays the persecution card every chance he gets as though nonsensical faith is above reproach and must be protected from being disrespected.

If history has shown anything, it is religion and its adherents that continue to cause suffering in the world because theists are under the mistaken impression that their morals are perfectly just simply because they are derived from god. If history has shown anything, religion and its adherents have always had a corrupt understanding of morality because of the precise harm it has done since it gained power in the world. Obviously, killing witches, keeping black people in slavery, preventing women from having equal rights as men, preventing same-sex marriage, all culminate to just morality merely because their supposedly infallible god deemed it thus.

Anyone who thinks that religion provides the best guidance on morality has some seriously strange ideas about both guidance or morality. Religion merely allows its adherents to think their beliefs and actions are moral when they are in fact highly immoral.

 

Surely that statement is false. Do you think that suffering would not exist if religious people left non-believers alone? Since you are obviously not content to let believers alone, I find your position worse than ironic.

I agree. Unlike you, I don't want to convert everyone to my beliefs, since they're gambles to begin with. Nor do I deem myself or co-believers superior to anyone. Justin Martyr and Pope Francis made clear that sincere atheists can be good people, and Jesus taught us to pay attention to our own moral inventory instead of our neighbors'. Religions come in many varieties, and some Christians cause suffering--because they've misunderstood the core message of Jesus, which was active, unconditional love for everyone, including society's rejects. I don't feel a need to pester other people who don't want to be pestered. But I do think it's true. How is it false? How would it cause suffering, unless people misunderstand it or don't practice it?

You haven't shown that these evils are the result of religion per se, There have been plenty of evils and atrocities in history that had nothing to do with religion, such as the mass murders under atheists Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, and the North Korean Kims. Nationalism has also caused more than its share. Religion has often been involved in the remedies. For example, the Quakers have always spoken out against war, and they and Wilberforce, an Evangelical Christian, took the lead in the effort to get rid of slavery. Long before that, Cyrus the Great, a Zoroastrian hailed as Messiah in the Bible, liberated slaves throughout the Persian empire. Rev. Martin Luther King, of course, led the fight for civil rights, and the UCC and other progressive churches have been prominent in the struggle for women's rights and gay rights. To use an analogous argument, would you say that because some political parties have resulted in policies that have led to war, slavery, racial injustice, etc., we should get rid of all of them? That humans can be perverse is obvious. We can only try our best to recognize and overcome our limitations, and some of us prefer to do this through religions emphasizing peace, love and understanding.

 

Amen! I'd only add that in order to alleviate the suffering of others, we need more bodhisatvas like Jesus.

 

It is quite clear that they are. Without a belief in god, those atrocities would not have been done in the name of god. Christians who hurt society and non-believers do so because their moral compass is broken. They have merely deluded themselves into thinking that they are doing good and being loving because god is at the core of their actions toward humanity.

I do not deny that. However, imagine how much suffering could have been eliminated and how much future suffering can be eliminated if religion was not an issue with which we had to deal.

What little good religion has done for the world is no argument in its favor against all the harm it has done and continues to do.

I honestly believe any little good that comes from religion is derivative more from an understanding of a humanistic nature than of religion. Religious beliefs are unnecessary for understanding what it means to be human and respecting humanity.

That is no argument in religion's favor. As I have mentioned already, so long as any mythological belief is viewed as truth rather than fantasy, so long as theists cannot agree on how to interpret scripture, thus dividing believers even amongst themselves to cause more violence and suffering, then there will always be someone and many people who will use religion to further an agenda that will only lead to more violence and suffering in its name.

If everyone recognized religion as mere mythology, something that has no basis in truth, then of course the violence and suffering would diminish greatly.